Girl, 15, dies in Southampton boat crash

[Greenheart]

Jeez, Stork. That's one of those photos that says more than a forum thread full of words.

AFAIK it is a legal requirement to wear a lifejacket when on deck on a small commercial boat.

Very much so. The RIB-ride punters get issued waterproofs and lifejackets. At least those that operate from Shamrock near me, but I assume this outfit at Ocean Village is the same.

I had been about to infer (still purely guessing) that if the child had certainly been wearing a lifejacket, her death would seem more likely due to some ghastly blunt-force trauma resulting from the vessel's impact. Stork's photo seems to make that look much more probable.

 

[PilotWolf]

I’m not suggesting any form of incompetence or neglect in this incident as we dont what happened but...

I got told ‘that’s how we’ve done it for X years and not had an accident’.

I said doesn’t that lower the odds?

I was very unpopular when it came to safety issues.

PW

 

[mjcoon]

I’m not suggesting any form of incompetence or neglect in this incident as we dont what happened but...

I got told ‘that’s how we’ve done it for X years and not had an accident’.

I said doesn’t that lower the odds?

I was very unpopular when it came to safety issues.

PW

Do you subscribe to the (Gambler's_fallacy)?

 

[TernVI]

This is more your normal AOA from a RIB going fast.

View attachment 97693

In weather, matey in the bow would either be flung out or need a new spine.

 

[oldmanofthehills]

I think you will find RIBS configured for tourist passengers in use all over the world.

Noted. But sadly there are accidents and boat deaths of tourists resulting from careless operators all over the world.

The first rule at land or sea is "slow down if position or conditions are unclear". But some idiots wont, be they operators or mere liesure owners.

 

[Capt Popeye]

Damage.

So from the sight of the damage would the Tubes have hit the Bouy or the GRP Rigid Hull have hit the Bouy first ?

Might one expect that if the Tubes hit first the Tubes would have softened the Blow or afforded a glancing blow, but if the Hard GRP hull had hit first guess that there would be very little glancing or deflecting motion ?

Anyone had any experience of thos sort of collision ?

 

[Elessar]

Noted. But sadly there are accidents and boat deaths of tourists resulting from careless operators all over the world.

The first rule at land or sea is "slow down if position or conditions are unclear". But some idiots wont, be they operators or mere liesure owners.

Very few.

And I hate the way you and others are implying that there was idiocy or incompetence in this case. We don’t know that.
Wait for the enquiry.

 

[Greenheart]

Indeed.

Although, if the wrecked boat wasn't culpably mishandled, the report certainly will make interesting and instructive reading.

It's very hard to see why anyone could have perfectly responsibly passed near enough (and be going fast enough) to a solid metal navigation mark, for a slight slip or moment's distraction to cause such a calamitous collision.

 

[oldmanofthehills]

Very few.

And I hate the way you and others are implying that there was idiocy or incompetence in this case. We don’t know that.
Wait for the enquiry.

As a professional dealing with safety, I firmly believe there is no such thing as an accident. There is error in mechanics or error in helm/driver/pilot judgement. It may be understandable it may be excusable, or it may not. Do you not remember MAIB reports on similar incidents? We await the report on this one, so should nor speculate too much on this one.

A girl died expecting to come back alive, and did not die due to any actions of hers other than boarding that boat

 

[penberth3]

Indeed.

Although, if the wrecked boat wasn't culpably mishandled, the report certainly will make interesting and instructive reading.

It's very hard to see why anyone could have perfectly responsibly passed near enough (and be going fast enough) to a solid metal navigation mark, for a slight slip or moment's distraction to cause such a calamitous collision.

A lot of assumptions there.

 

[ProDave]

Just to add I have been on a few commercial RIB trips, mostly wildlife watching so not biased towards extreme speed, and never been given a LJ. They are available on the boat, but not routinely worn by the pax.

We always wear them when crewing the club RIB's

That is some "bump" there. No doubt from the damage they will be able to assess the impact speed.

 

[Capt Popeye]

No it doesn’t. That is a shot taken in the split second that the boat was at that angle for. To achieve this, it would need to accelerate over a wake or wave. In normal planing mode it would ride almost flat, with very little bow high attitude.

Yea quite so, but, is that what the Customers have paid for, maybe just maybe the Company understand that the Customers expect Thrills and Speed Jumps so the Helm tries to give them that, maybe, or maybe you are right the customers are given a High Speed journey and thats what the Company do ?

To acheive the Jumps etc I suppose it only takes a Helm a moment to seize the chance of thrills when the Wash or Waves appear before them or the Helm decides to Jump over their own Wash on a sharp turn

Anyways be very interesting to read the outcome of any Report into this Incident so that we can all learn from it

 

[TernVI]

So from the sight of the damage would the Tubes have hit the Bouy or the GRP Rigid Hull have hit the Bouy first ?

Might one expect that if the Tubes hit first the Tubes would have softened the Blow or afforded a glancing blow, but if the Hard GRP hull had hit first guess that there would be very little glancing or deflecting motion ?

Anyone had any experience of thos sort of collision ?

The tubes won't absorb much. 40 knots to zero in half a metre?

I will admit I have experience of hitting a channel mark. Racing a dinghy around one of the mid-Solent marks. They are very solid objects. You could see bits of my gel coat on that one for a couple of years.

 

[Greenheart]

A lot of assumptions there.

I'm sorry, I'll try to step back. I'm unable to go over about eight knots so I'm asking, not stating.

I was thinking of the location, which isn't exactly constricted, although we (I personally) don't know how busy it was at the time.

The first rule at land or sea is "slow down if position or conditions are unclear".

That was the basis of my assumptions; although at this location's busiest, I rarely see speedboats slowing down in response to potential proximity with vessels under way, because there appears to be space to steer wide of dangers without throttling back.

But is it not regarded as less potentially risky to have a thrilling close encounter with something that isn't under way?

Truly tragic. I see they are appealing for video footage. I am assuming they already have the one a number of us saw on Facebook...The RIB simply appeared to drive straight into it.

I hadn't known there was a video, apparently taken from the Red Funnel. Very shocking viewing it must be.

Is it conceivable that the steering could lock up, and the throttles too, at the same time?

 

[Elessar]

Is it conceivable that the steering could lock up, and the throttles too, at the same time?

Yes.
And other ways it could have happened.
that’s why you have an enquiry.
Rather than speculating on an Internet forum.

 

[oldmanofthehills]

Yes.
And other ways it could have happened.
that’s why you have an enquiry.
Rather than speculating on an Internet forum.

Mr E, I disagree

The MAIB are not God and might in some instance never get to the root cause of an incident.

However if even they dont members of this forum can still consider likely scenarios sombrely and be reminded of risks and means to reduce them. Thus the wisdom of our boating community is strengthened.

Two simultaneous equipment failures would be needed to cause crash. Thus unlikely, and probably not relevant to most of our siuations.

So one can consider what helmsman failure or single equipment plus inadequate helmsman response is most likely based on the basic knowledge of how such RIBS are operated. Being helmsmen and women ourselves albeit mostly of slower craft it is worthwhile for us to contemplate.

 

[Greenheart]

...other ways it could have happened. That’s why you have an enquiry. Rather than speculating on an Internet forum.

Alright, I really am only asking. You could broaden minds (and shut me up ) by giving the other ways it could have happened; I can't see them because I don't know. Spreading that knowledge might even help prevent recurrence, as well as showing how blameless any party involved may be.

Or you can just leave us in the dark.

 

[Time Out]

I'm sorry, I'll try to step back. I'm unable go over about eight knots so I'm asking, not stating.

I was thinking of the location, which isn't exactly constricted, although we (I personally) don't know how busy it was at the time.



That was the basis of my assumptions; although at this location's busiest, I rarely see speedboats slowing down in response to potential proximity with vessels under way, because there appears to be space to steer wide of dangers without throttling back.

But is it not regarded as less potentially risky to have a thrilling close encounter with something that isn't under way?



I hadn't known there was a video, apparently taken from the Red Funnel. Very shocking viewing it must be.

Is it conceivable that the steering could lock up, and the throttles too, at the same time?

Yes the video was widely shared on Facebook before the author and indeed all those the viewed it (including me) realised how serious it was. In fact I had not realised it was that morning when I saw it. I did however notice the time for some reason.

I suspect it will be key evidence.

 

[Greenheart]

I suspect it will be key evidence.

Surely.

Am I right in thinking that aboard the type of boat in question, the helmsman sits aft, out of view from his passengers, who may therefore scarcely know more than we can, about the reasons for this?

On balance, I guess it's good that today, so many places and times are committed to permanent record by the ubiquity of cameras.

 

[CLB]

Is it conceivable that the steering could lock up, and the throttles too, at the same time?

It is possible, but highly unlikely. A million to one chance I would say. But if either one did fail, the startle factor may have prevented the other being used in what could possibly have been a split second.