Engine reconditioning

[Aja]

OK. Recommendations for good advice?

West Coast Marine in Troon.

 

[Dave1786]

I took a Volvo Penta 2002 to Pitcairn Engineering in Bonnybridge for a complete rebuild. They have their own machining for honing, rebore etc so everything (except injectors) is done by them.

 

[RunAgroundHard]

I have had work done by West of Scotland, one job was okay but I had to ream the valve guides, which they should have done, the other job was fine. They are expensive.

DDZ marina at Largs did a lot for me on a 4236, but again pricy, their work was satisfactory.

Most of the work noted above was from about 15 years ago.

Going back a bit now, Pistons and Components in Glasgow sorted cylinder liner, bores and big ends and crankshaft for a good price and quality.

Definitely worth looking at Glasgow engine refurbishes, Piston and Components is one of them. Have a good discussion with them, you might find a good price and good service, a lot lower cost than any of the marina based centres.

I used to do a lot of work on vintage tractors and motorcycles, absolutely worth shopping around for service and ability.

 

[38mess]

When my Perkins M30 got to around 8k hours I enquired at Golden arrow marine for a ball park figure to get it rebuilt.
A very helpful engineer sent me a parts list of things they change and for the estimated labour charges to put it all together. If I remember rightly it would have been cheaper to put a new beta 30 hp in.
Just a thought for you.

 

[Refueler]

Isn't there other factors in this as well ?

1. What is the boat itself worth ?
2. What is the intended use of the boat ?
3. Would a new replacement engine be cost effective against recon of old ?
4. Is there are 2nd hand engine available that's already been recon'd ?

I ask the above because as we are told - OP's engine is about 30yrs old ... meaning the boat is at least the same. Going back to my situation I posted about - that I replaced the engine with a 2nd hand - the decision was using all the above factors.
1. The boat was of such age that a new engine + installation etc would have constituted near the value of the boat.
2. Boat was English Channel / Near Europe / UK use.
3. Even recon of old engine and the risk that an item may still fail - questioned the cost effectiveness.
4. There was an engine available and we were reasonably confident of its condition as the engineer who fitted it - was also the one who took it out of the other boat. He'd infact advised that owner - the engine just needed a good service and part refurb. Owner declined and replaced the engine.

I fully realise OP is not interested in my posts - but others reading in similar situation may find it thought provoking enough for them to weigh up the alternatives. I see I am not only one who questions recon of an engine ...
Cost of recon of an engine can easily mount up and approach the cost of a replacement new ..

 

[Stemar]

Assuming the arguments over new or rebuild and why you're wrong whichever you choose (welcome to the forum ) haven't changed your mind, could you get an exchange short block? That and a valve job gives you what is effectively a new engine and it might get you back out on the water quicker.

 

[Tranona]

This might prove useful to understand first the reasoning around replacement and specifically about the engine the OP has. in this case the replacement chosen was the Beta - unsurprisingly as it fits neatly where the old engine is.
chrisjennings.net/blog/2021/01/14/repowering-the-boat-the-research/

 

[Stemar]

Magic Carpet came to a similar conclusion and for much the same reasons.

 

[B27]

I have had work done by West of Scotland, one job was okay but I had to ream the valve guides, which they should have done, the other job was fine. They are expensive.

DDZ marina at Largs did a lot for me on a 4236, but again pricy, their work was satisfactory.

Most of the work noted above was from about 15 years ago.

Going back a bit now, Pistons and Components in Glasgow sorted cylinder liner, bores and big ends and crankshaft for a good price and quality.

Definitely worth looking at Glasgow engine refurbishes, Piston and Components is one of them. Have a good discussion with them, you might find a good price and good service, a lot lower cost than any of the marina based centres.

I used to do a lot of work on vintage tractors and motorcycles, absolutely worth shopping around for service and ability.

One problem is, there's much less of this kind of work being done these days.
Car and van engines mostly last the life of the vehicle without the head coming off.
I was chatting to my local garage bloke about what a nice change it made to do some proper engine work instead of just fitting new ancillaries etc. He was working on a classic of some sort.
The automotive trade has changed a lot in the last few decades.

 

[Refueler]

One problem is, there's much less of this kind of work being done these days.
Car and van engines mostly last the life of the vehicle without the head coming off.
I was chatting to my local garage bloke about what a nice change it made to do some proper engine work instead of just fitting new ancillaries etc. He was working on a classic of some sort.
The automotive trade has changed a lot in the last few decades.

My local Car Service - luckily guy working there has become a friend - not just a good service guy .. but what I really like is that he is despite being young - interested in actually getting parts to work instead of rip out - replace as most are now.

He's refurbed VVT's ... Turbo gates .... various items on my cars and van ... items that most would just rip out and bin. Successful ? Yes. They all still working years after ...

Not all skills have been completely lost !

 

[Refueler]

My local Car Service - luckily guy working there has become a friend - not just a good service guy .. but what I really like is that he is despite being young - interested in actually getting parts to work instead of rip out - replace as most are now.

He's refurbed VVT's ... Turbo gates .... various items on my cars and van ... items that most would just rip out and bin. Successful ? Yes. They all still working years after ...

Not all skills have been completely lost !

Sadly the guy who was a real whizzo with any diesel engine - boat or whatever - who used to do the odd job on my boat Perkins ... had accident and was killed by a car he was working under.
Like I said - they are out there.

 

[fredrussell]

Isn't there other factors in this as well ?

No. Because the OP just asked for suggestions of engine refurb companies in his area. Not for a full blown debate on what his plan moving forward should be!

 

[Refueler]

No. Because the OP just asked for suggestions of engine refurb companies in his area. Not for a full blown debate on what his plan moving forward should be!

The value and actually the reasoning of forums is to expand and develop initial input to the forum. I understand the OP's request - but the fact is that many people will read and look for information / leads to how they want to move on in similar situation.
Therefore to limit and even complain about expansion of the matter is actually contrary to forum thesis.
Take it as the OP's first input is like a 'seed' sown in the fertile soil of the forum.

 

[Refueler]

The value and actually the reasoning of forums is to expand and develop initial input to the forum. I understand the OP's request - but the fact is that many people will read and look for information / leads to how they want to move on in similar situation.
Therefore to limit and even complain about expansion of the matter is actually contrary to forum thesis.
Take it as the OP's first input is like a 'seed' sown in the fertile soil of the forum.

Think of like sitting round the table in a pub ... A makes a question or statement ... it then evolves into a conversation ... quite often diverging from its original core item. But the question or statement has had its replies ... its then led into a wider field.

 

[dunedin]

The value and actually the reasoning of forums is to expand and develop initial input to the forum. I understand the OP's request - but the fact is that many people will read and look for information / leads to how they want to move on in similar situation.
Therefore to limit and even complain about expansion of the matter is actually contrary to forum thesis.
Take it as the OP's first input is like a 'seed' sown in the fertile soil of the forum.

Agree fully.
And if we had stuck exactly to the OP question in post #1 the post might have had no replies at all - as the question was for recommendations of places used to refurbish and engine near Largs, and it sounds like nobody else has attempted this in recent years (for reasons explained above).
Would a resounding silence have been better?

 

[Refueler]

Agree fully.
And if we had stuck exactly to the OP question in post #1 the post might have had no replies at all - as the question was for recommendations of places used to refurbish and engine near Largs, and it sounds like nobody else has attempted this in recent years (for reasons explained above).
Would a resounding silence have been better?

Thank you D.

 

[rogerthebodger]

Its what's called in Engineering design meeting "Brainstorming" which generally result in the best solation to a problem

But you have to be careful of not going down a rabbit hole

 

[fredrussell]

Think of like sitting round the table in a pub ... A makes a question or statement ... it then evolves into a conversation ... quite often diverging from its original core item. But the question or statement has had its replies ... its then led into a wider field.

Fair enough. But in post 13 the OP himself said,

“To be fair, my question was not should I recondition it or not. I was asking for recommendations on engineering firms who could do the job. So no other information was required”

God forbid we should actually just help with the OP’s query!

 

[Refueler]

Fair enough. But in post 13 the OP himself said,

“To be fair, my question was not should I recondition it or not. I was asking for recommendations on engineering firms who could do the job. So no other information was required”

God forbid we should actually just help with the OP’s query!

But he rec'd many suggested people / co's to do the work ... so the query was not ignored. He got his answers ... but it was obvious he was not content with them ... so please don't blame me or others for taking another tack on the subject.

 

[Tranona]

Agree fully.
And if we had stuck exactly to the OP question in post #1 the post might have had no replies at all - as the question was for recommendations of places used to refurbish and engine near Largs, and it sounds like nobody else has attempted this in recent years (for reasons explained above).
Would a resounding silence have been better?

Yes, finding somebody on a small(ish) forum like this who has direct experience of engine reconditioning anywhere, let alone in Largs or thereabouts, and for a relatively unusual engine in marine form is a bit of a shot in the dark. There was a time when every decent size town had an engine reconditioner of some sort - because engines needed it. where I was brought up in Romford (Ford land) there were 3 within 2 miles, one run by my brother. The popular small engines (Ford 85 bore, BMC A and B series etc) had a life of maybe 50K miles but the car would last probably twice as long. My brother's best seller was a Ford Anglia exchange, fitted in a day for £100 (£75 for the engine and £25 for fitting). It kept the car going for another 5 years or so before it rusted away! These were simple engines with few "add ons" and lots of common parts.

The Ford XLD which the OP has was the first really high speed diesel Ford made for passenger car use. Much better made and very lightly stressed (less than 60hp out of 1800cc) and the 8000 hours the OPs engine has done is nothing out of the ordinary and compares well with half that which was the norm for the BMC and Perkins engines of that size/hp from the previous generation. Plus it started and stopped when you asked it to and did not leak oil. It filled a real gap in the market before the even better Perkins Prima/Leyland Montego/Volvo MD22 came along followed by Beta etc 10 years later.

All this of course is over 30 years ago and while parts are available and plenty of machine shops who will do the basic machining (my brother still has one in Essex, but does not touch small vehicle engines if he can avoid it) it is no longer economic to have somebody else do it for you. If as the OP seems to say he is looking at long term cruising and wants a totally reliable engine in "tip top condition". It might be different if the intention was to prolong the life of the engine in a lower value boat for a few years light use.

It is the age old dilemma that many face when buying a larger older boat for serious cruising. You find most of the gear is past its sell by date and while you can soldier on replacing bits as you go there comes a point where best to either pass the boat on or bite the bullet and buy new, finding of course that costs are at today's prices and not 30 year old prices you bought the boat for.