Electric Boats

[henryf]

hydrogen always sounds very attractive, but it has a teensy problem. Compressing it takes a lot of energy. Hurricane is concerned there is not enough electricity to run EVs - there is, but is there enough electricity to create hydrogen, distribute it and compress it etc - probably not.

Fear not, your teensy problem will be washed away by our 16 billion gigawatts of waiting tidal energy slipping between our fingers every day.

I see that the national grid are angling for a bit more money and ranking in the pecking order. Generation is in the bag but we need to respect the wiring.

in their points they say that batteries are guaranteed for 7 or 8 years which apparently equates to 100,000 miles. Yet the average use talked about in this very thread would make that around 50,000 miles.

Anyway, we are ultimate just prawns in the sea of life. Some people may find their investment in new tech goes Betamax but for the rest of you happy days, revel in your VHS enjoyment….. ?

 

[Hurricane]

An interesting project I heard the other day is an International Grid.
As the planet rotates, countries can draw or feed onto the grid thus "smoothing" the load across the globe.

Another interesting project is the power cables that are being laid between the UK and North Africa.
I suspect that solar power can then be supplied directly into the UK.

 

[Momac]

Norway is a bit closer
Full power ahead for UK to Norway under-sea power cable

 

[Bigplumbs]

An interesting project I heard the other day is an International Grid.
As the planet rotates, countries can draw or feed onto the grid thus "smoothing" the load across the globe.

Another interesting project is the power cables that are being laid between the UK and North Africa.
I suspect that solar power can then be supplied directly into the UK.

until some pissed off African decides to switch us off

 

[Bigplumbs]

All those that think the Electrical infrastructure upgrades can be done quickly have never tried to get U.K. power networks to do even the smallest job. If you then add in Planning law. Enviromental sorts protecting the bats, newts and fungi you are once again doomed. Ironically the newt savers are also probably the same road glue nutters who started it all

 

[ChromeDome]

If it is feasible for commercial use? Eventually getting there, I presume.

Went on a 2h trip on this one yesterday - still Hybrid, not pure electric:

The world's largest fleet of hybrid ferries | Scandlines

Interesting concept, moved somewhat slower than a normal fuel driven ferry at portions of the trip which indeed would save power regardless of power source.

 

[Farmer Piles]

until some pissed off African decides to switch us off

Quite, but we currently rely on Putin for a lot of our gas. I would rather take my chance with an African nation. Come to that we get electricity from France, and they love us.

 

[vas]

If it is feasible for commercial use? Eventually getting there, I presume.

Went on a 2h trip on this one yesterday - still Hybrid, not pure electric:

The world's largest fleet of hybrid ferries | Scandlines

Interesting concept, moved somewhat slower than a normal fuel driven ferry at portions of the trip which indeed would save power regardless of power source.

yes, and there's a fully electric ferry doing a 10 or 20min crossing somewhere in the scandi countries.
it all boils down to the fanciful definition of hybrid. How much hybrid is this thing? getting in and out of low emission zones/harbours, sorry cant check specs now.
Are you aware that the 5kw (if so) fiat 500 is a hybrid - not the full e one? probably good to start stop in traffic lights (haven't bothered checking the specs).
yeah, stick a bit of a battery and a larger starter/generator/alternator/whatever baptise it hybrid job done.
Bet come 2030 miraculously all ice cars will survive as they'll be hybrids kicking the can down the road to 2050 or so

V

 

[henryf]

Given that we are the Middle East of tidal power why on earth would we want to import power?

We should be exporting to the world either as electricity or electricity based liquid power.

 

[Farmer Piles]

They have tried various tidal turbines down this way but none have really been effective. If you build tidal barrages, say like across the Severn where you have a 10m range, they take monumental amounts of concrete - millions of tonnes and billions of pounds. They did this in the Bay of Fundy in Canada and it was a disaster. The biggest problem - after the cost of building it, both in cash and environmentally - was silting. The barrage so slowed the water flow that after not many years the silting was such a problem that it became unviable.
Back to the Severn; you only have to look at the water as far west as Weston to see how much silt is in the river. Slow the flow and the earth and mud will sediment out either side of the barrage instead of dissipating into the wider Bristol Channel and the Irish Sea. This is from modelling work carried out by people far more clever than me and experience from the likes of Canada.
Obviously a shame given the amount of energy available on our doorstep.

 

[Portofino]

Here - end game . Liquid fuels still have place
This + more reforestation globally to balance off .

How sustainable fuels created from thin air could solve the energy crisis

Edit - it’s not Aril 1st .

 

[westernman]

Here - end game . Liquid fuels still have place
This + more reforestation globally to balance off .

How sustainable fuels created from thin air could solve the energy crisis

Edit - it’s not Aril 1st .

That is a huge solar dish which over the course of a whole day produces a volume of liquid fuel which corresponds to a shot of wiskey (5cl).
This is not going to be powering your mobo at 30 knots any time soon,

 

[ChromeDome]

..it all boils down to the fanciful definition of hybrid..

Indeed this is used to cover a lot of wannabee Green initiatives. If you look at the link referred to you can see how the ferry is managing power and it documents that hybrid is just that.. a blend!

The EU once stated that any car with any combustion engine is regarded 'black'.

If only those making the plans/decisions (for you and me to pay for) would realize the true sources in proper perspective of pollution, the picture would be much more diverse than just mumbling 'electric' at every breath.

Until further notice I'll be all-in-all hybrid (by some definition)

 

[Bigplumbs]

As far as cars, Boats, Caravans and larger cost items is concerned I never buy new. What will the second hand market be like for Electric Cars if the Battery is on its last legs. If there isnt a second hand Market after a while

 

[Bigplumbs]

Quite, but we currently rely on Putin for a lot of our gas. I would rather take my chance with an African nation. Come to that we get electricity from France, and they love us.

I like the French they make me seem as though I smell less of Garlic

 

[henryf]

They have tried various tidal turbines down this way but none have really been effective. If you build tidal barrages, say like across the Severn where you have a 10m range, they take monumental amounts of concrete - millions of tonnes and billions of pounds. They did this in the Bay of Fundy in Canada and it was a disaster. The biggest problem - after the cost of building it, both in cash and environmentally - was silting. The barrage so slowed the water flow that after not many years the silting was such a problem that it became unviable.
Back to the Severn; you only have to look at the water as far west as Weston to see how much silt is in the river. Slow the flow and the earth and mud will sediment out either side of the barrage instead of dissipating into the wider Bristol Channel and the Irish Sea. This is from modelling work carried out by people far more clever than me and experience from the likes of Canada.
Obviously a shame given the amount of energy available on our doorstep.

I've never seen tidal as a series of dams or barrages for the reasons you state. I've always seen it as lots of smaller turbines getting driven by tidal movement. Obviously water is massively more powerful than wind. Some sort of funnel to act as a multiplier and then turbines tethered to the sea bed. Think about solar power. A single panel doesn't put out that much but links lots together and it works. We have a lot of coastline, even a constant knot of tide is energy going to waste.

Henry

 

[Bigplumbs]

I've never seen tidal as a series of dams or barrages for the reasons you state. I've always seen it as lots of smaller turbines getting driven by tidal movement. Obviously water is massively more powerful than wind. Some sort of funnel to act as a multiplier and then turbines tethered to the sea bed. Think about solar power. A single panel doesn't put out that much but links lots together and it works. We have a lot of coastline, even a constant knot of tide is energy going to waste.

Henry

I have also always imagined it this way. I think the issues are that there are so many things in water that would block and clag the turbines. In the Air not so much

 

[henryf]

I have also always imagined it this way. I think the issues are that there are so many things in water that would block and clag the turbines. In the Air not so much

That's always been the excuse given but water energy is so much more predictable and powerful. If you think about the hurdles jumped to extract oil from the ground I don't think a solution is beyond the realms of human capacity.

The big appeal of wind is that lots of people contribute to development. Not everyone enjoys our tidal reserves in the same way not everyone has oil reserves. The ones who have it cashed in big time. Why can't we be the tidal Middle East with huge cash income and virtually free leccy for the masses ?

 

[Bigplumbs]

That's always been the excuse given but water energy is so much more predictable and powerful. If you think about the hurdles jumped to extract oil from the ground I don't think a solution is beyond the realms of human capacity.

The big appeal of wind is that lots of people contribute to development. Not everyone enjoys our tidal reserves in the same way not everyone has oil reserves. The ones who have it cashed in big time. Why can't we be the tidal Middle East with huge cash income and virtually free leccy for the masses ?

Well that certainly seems a very good Idea. My idea in principal came from the EDF (Electric Ducted Fan) jets I have flown RC. You just make a huge EDF unit with reversible blades. Drop it in the tidal flow, ...... stop the crap getting in it some how and hay Presto Electricity from the moon...... Only worry might be if the Soup Dragon turns up and claims the rights to the energy as of course the moon only orbits the Earth because he keeps farting due to his cabbage soup.

 

[ICTM]

I think you are overlooking the blindingly obvious. How can you possibly dare to even suggest that we put anything in the sea off our shores that could possibly disturb the poor innocent seahorses ?? Not only that but potentially blade like objects that they could hurt themselves on.

I can only hope that this thread isn’t seen by anyone from the seahorse trust or you’ll all be on a fizzer ?