Dinghy to shore drowning

[[2574]]

is there anything better around?

I've recently been reviewing our offshore MOB kit and have decided to buy PLB's (such as this: http://www.mcmurdomarine.com/en/products/plbs) and fit to our lifejacket harnesses. This would work for anchorage MOB's as well as offshore MOB's albeit that nobody local is aware. The disadvantage of this is that the LJ and PLB together are worth about £400 so one can't chuck it in the dinghy whilst ashore as Mr Lightfinger will have it nicked and on EBAY before you've finished your pint.

Someone suggested flares; I'm fast forming the view that flares are yesterdays technology and thinking of removing all pyrotechnics from my boat.

 

[fireball]

LJs are essential,

Sorry - I disagree ...
It depends on circumstances.

they do not GUARANTEE survival.

If they don't guarantee survival then they can't be essential. Ppl have survived a dunking with and without LJs. Unfortunately ppl have also not survived dunking - both with and without LJs

They improve the chance of survival, by a long way,

In the right circumstances ...

but we should be no less vigilant just because we are wearing them.

One bit we do agree on.

 

[Talulah]

I've recently been reviewing our offshore MOB kit and have decided to buy PLB's (such as this: http://www.mcmurdomarine.com/en/products/plbs)

Personally, my choice would now be for personal AIS.
http://www.mcmurdomarine.com/en/products/personal-ais-beacon

I know the PLB helped in the Fastnet race last year when Leopard overturned but can't help thinking the bigger risk is an individual going overboard.
I don't think it will be too long before personal AIS has a much smaller footprint and so I'm holding off for the time being.

 

[fireball]

So, we (at least I am) are converted. We use our preferred buoyancy device when in the dinghy.

What's to convert? I also use my preferred buoyancy device when in the tender ... I just decide what it's going to be before getting in ...

 

[rotrax]

I posted on a similar thread some time ago. Someone said on here the RNLI 'useless unless worn' made him fume-or similar. As a long time motorcyclist putting on a helmet or other protective gear became second nature. Helmets were not compulsory when I started riding but I used one anyway. For a start, it kept my head warm! I was told a little truism about crash helmets many years ago by a top racing motorcyclist who also rode in long distance trials events at international level. Apart from the bonus that a L/J can be re-armed and made good after use it is relevant here. He told me the following-'You wear a helmet a lot but you only use it once' This reflected the fact that after a substantial impact you discarded a helmet. It is a fact beond dispute that some members of society need protecting from themselves. When I was the Machine Examiner at Oxford Speedway in the late nineties I had to impound a helmet that had a broken chinguard from a previous crash. The rider had presented another for inspection but used a damaged one in two races before the damaged one was spotted. When the referee read the report he did not believe it. The helmet chin piece could easily have folded back into the users face or throat causing substantial puncture damage. The three turns of red insulating tape covering the break added no strength at all! I dont want compulsion for lifejacket use but too many tragedies occur which puts it in the legislators minds.

 

[webcraft]

.

It is hard to see how anyone can justify not wearing a lifejacket for tender transfers in UK water temperatures.

It beggars belief that anyone should think it is OK to expose young children to this kind of risk.

The monumentally stupid arguments put forward by the non-wearers seem to indicate to me that (sadly) legislation is probably necessary. Anyone else with an interest in this subject reading this thread is likely to come to the same conclusion.

If you don't want legislation then perhaps you should just shut up about your own bravado instead of continually braying about it, as would-be legislators would have a field day with the nonsense posted on here.


- W

 

[Talulah]

.

It is hard to see how anyone can justify not wearing a lifejacket for tender transfers in UK water temperatures.

It beggars belief that anyone should think it is OK to expose young children to this kind of risk.
- W

So would you have adults and children wearing life jackets in the water taxi in the Hamble/Yarmouth/Cowes?

Sure we could bubble wrap everyone but you have to be realistic about the real risks. Not the perceived risks.

 

[webcraft]

. .. the disadvantage of this is that the LJ and PLB together are worth about £400 so one can't chuck it in the dinghy whilst ashore as Mr Lightfinger will have it nicked and on EBAY before you've finished your pint.

This sort of thing is not a problem in island anchorages, and we usually leave our LJs in a drybag in the dinghy. In more crowded surroundings then I can see why this could be a worry. You could invest in a rucksac type drybag so you can easily carry the kit to the pub.

- W

 

[webcraft]

So would you have adults and children wearing life jackets in the water taxi in the Hamble/Yarmouth/Cowes?

A water taxi is not a tender. This thread is about dinghy drownings.

- W

 

[Talulah]

This sort of thing is not a problem in island anchorages, and we usually leave our LJs in a drybag in the dinghy. In more crowded surroundings then I can see why this could be a worry. You could invest in a rucksac type drybag so you can easily carry the kit to the pub.
- W

So the people who are conditioned to never step foot afloat who find their kit now nicked in the pub/shore are so incapable of thinking for themselves do what?

 

[Talulah]

A water taxi is not a tender. This thread is about dinghy drownings.

- W

It's a fine line. The difference is often that the driver of the dinghy has had a drink. The accident isn't in the boat it's the stepping on and off.

 

[webcraft]

It's a fine line. The difference is often that the driver of the dinghy has had a drink. The accident isn't in the boat it's the stepping on and off.

It isn't a fine line at all. A water taxi is a professionally run service that has to comply with legislation. A tender is a little unstable thing piloted by people with varying degrees of skill and common sense.

You are havering and you know it.

- W

 

[fireball]

.

It is hard to see how anyone can justify not wearing a lifejacket for tender transfers in UK water temperatures.

It beggars belief that anyone should think it is OK to expose young children to this kind of risk.

Ok - can you tell me exactly what risks I take when I go out in the tender please.
You obviously know the risks I take far better than I do ...

If you don't want legislation then perhaps you should just shut up about your own bravado instead of continually braying about it, as would-be legislators would have a field day with the nonsense posted on here.

Do you want a medal every time you wear your LJ?
Once LJs become compulsory - what's next - PLB, HH VHF, personal flares?
There is ALWAYS another device that would've saved a life and it must be made compulsory so "it can never happen again" - but that's just it isn't it - we cannot prescribe the elements of an accident and therefore we cannot predict exactly what is required to guarantee to save the lives of those involved - all we can do is our best to judge the conditions and minimise the risk. For you (and many others) it is the wearing of LJs at all times. For myself I'm happy that the risk is small enough not to make it a compulsory fit.

IMHO I take a greater risk every time I cycle too/from work - there are vehicles involved that I have no control over and some pass too close - for that reason I wear a cycle helmet and ride defensively...

Honestly - I don't care a jot what you - on your boat - want to wear - as long as you (with your experience) feel it is sufficient for you in the conditions.
Similarly, I expect the same back.

 

[webcraft]

Ok - can you tell me exactly what risks I take when I go out in the tender please.
You obviously know the risks I take far better than I do ...

Obviously you and your offspring are able to breathe water. Sorry, how silly of me - didn't realise you wwere a mutant.

No, really, it beggars belief that you can ask such a stupid, stupid question.

- W

 

[fireball]

A tender is a little unstable thing

Sweeping generalisations!!

So - in your view - should we ALL wear LJs no matter the size/type tender or the conditions in which it is used?
What if I have a launch similar size/type to that used by water taxis - but I use it as a tender?

piloted by people with varying degrees of skill and common sense.

Ah - so perhaps there should be an IQ test along with the legislation ... IQ of over 150 and you're on your own? Or would you rather we legislate for those with no intelligence - in which case "Everyone off the water now" ...

Sound ridiculous - yes, it is - as is prescribing what I can/can't do with my own vessels ...

 

[Talulah]

It isn't a fine line at all. A water taxi is a professionally run service that has to comply with legislation. A tender is a little unstable rubber thing.

You are havering and you know it.

- W

I accept there is a difference. But equally some people are very steady in their small inflatable while others are very unsteady stepping on/off water taxi. I have seen a few people 'fall' into a water taxi where drink has been involved.
Can't you accept that some people are quite capable of doing things for themselves without having all the 'safety features'.

 

[fireball]

Obviously you and your offspring are able to breathe water. Sorry, how silly of me - didn't realise you wwere a mutant.

No, really, it beggars belief that you can ask such a stupid, stupid question.

- W

Personal insults? Nice ...

I know the risks I take - and have a good grasp on the probability of them happening to me ...

Falling in the water doesn't equate to drowning.

 

[alant]

Forty years not wearing lifejacket, no problem
One year wearing lifejacket, that year you fall in.

Pure coincidence? Or is there some connection? I know I am even more careful riding a motorbike in jeans than in leathers, and it is often suggested that wearing crash-helmets makes cyclists less careful. Are modern sailing dinghies less seaworthy than their predecessors because clubs nowadays have fleets of RIBs instead of a single diesel-powered launches?

Do we take more risks if we have more safety equipment?

Mate who was a Traffic Cop, astounded people at a 'safety forum', when he suggested that driver airbags should be replaced by a sharp spearhead pointing directly at drivers chest.

 

[fireball]

Can't you accept that some people are quite capable of doing things for themselves without having all the 'safety features'.

Obviously not ..

It's a shame that such an accident always brings out the "I always wear my Lifejacket - and so should you" brigade ...
There are risks in every part of life - one of life skills is recognising them and taking appropriate action to minimise them - it would be a shame to legislate out that skill.

 

[alant]

Last year we fished a woman out of the marina who had fallen of the gang plank going from the dock side onto her boat. Her very young daughter was screaming. If we had not been passing at the right moment it might have ended very badly.

Do any of you wear lifejackets on the marina pontoons - especially when returning back to the boat from the nearby restaurant?

The only time I have gone in has been from the marina dock side when trying to unhitch the hosepipe. It was slippering from the leaking water. Fortunately this was high season and there were 100's - yes 100's of people on the dockside to see the huge split and hole that the fall had made in my shorts.

Do you know where the escape ladder is?