Diesel engine

[boatmad2]

I have recently bought a Teal 22 boat with a ford 1600 petrol engine. This needs a fair bit of work to the cooling system etc to get it back into good order.
Due to the requirements of the BSS I am thinking of fitting a ford 1800 XUD engine or an 1800 BMC , if I go for the ford will any of the petrol engine bits be usable ie the bell housing and such by the way the outdrive is an enfield 130.
Any thoughts about the types of engine or the work in fitting wold be appreciated
ps I am an engineer so have mechanical knowledge but not of this job.
pps boats previous name was force 9 gail. does anybody know her?.

 

[tr7v8]

Do a search back through the archives as someone had the same problems a while ago.
Basically the Ford 1600 XLD (not 1800) will fit the petrol bellhousing. I probably get shot but the 1800 BMC is so old that I wouldn't go that way, spares although available will get scarce. The Ford is a cheap as chips and will be around for sometime.
Incidentally XUD is a Peugeot code number!

Jim
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[Strathglass]

Look at Lancing Marine and ASAP they all do all the conversion bits to fit the Ford XLD engines. You probably want a 1600. as was said in the previous posting

Iain

 

[steel_slug]

Before you do the conversion do a cost/benefit analysis.

cost of conversion- new engine or ex vehicle. plus cost of fitting and complying with BSS. By the way what are your BSS concerns with the Ford engine??

fuel consumption - diesel better and more readilly available depending on cruising ground.

noise and vibration - petrol much better diesel.

PM me with your contact details, I have several clients who have mated a diesel to an Enfield 130

PM

 

[Johnjo]

Is the BMC 1800 not the same engine that is fitted in Leyland Daff vans??

 

[dickh]

Speak to Lancing Marine - they are the experts in marinising the ford 1600/1800 diesels, and can supply all the bits etc.

dickh
I'd rather be sailing... /forums/images/icons/smile.gif

 

[Forbsie]

Just be careful with ASAP. I just bought an entire kit from them for the XLD416 for around £1250 and not one single bolt was supplied. I had to go round measuring everything including having 8" studs made up for the heat exchanger. When I phoned them up to query this, they didn't seem to know what I was talking about. (probably the Scottish accent.)



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[tr7v8]

Err yes it was in very early Sherpa's but they went Perkins Prima as soon as it was available. I believe late LDV's went to Peugoet.

Jim
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[Johnjo]

Thanks Jim
nice to know that Im right occasionly, were'nt they the same engine
as the 1500 only bored out larger, handy to know if someone wants a
slightly more powerful engine, who already has a 1.5, and can just
exchange marinisation gear,
mike

 

[colvic]

Sorry, doesn't work like that.

The 1800 is still made, in Turkey, whereas all 1500 are now recons and if you add up all the bits it is cheaper to go new, especially if you try AMC/Thornycroft engines at Preston who do quite a range based on the Mitsubishi core engine.
Bought one to-day and best value in UK having checked all others!!

 

[boatmad2]

Thanks for your post. My concern with the BSS and the ford is the spill piping.
I spoke to Lansing at the London show but could not get very clear details of to make spill pipes comply, also spoke to people on the EA stand who gave me the impression that the spill pipe conversion might not be to brilliant a bit of kit, also its not cheap.
I have done some pricing up via Lansing and ASAP and the figures come out around £500 for a GOOD secondhand engine plus close to £2000 for cooling kit, bell housing, mounting feet, drive adaptor,exhaust silencer, and other minor bits like filters etc.
Reasons to go diesel in order would I think go like this.
1 Safer 2 Availibility of fuel 3 Reliability 4 Easier for BSS 5 Cheaper to run
6 May add value to boat new petrol unit will not.
Incidently I was looking at the 1800 for the 60hp @ 4800 rpm which will match gearing of leg better, but I am not hung up on this.

 

[Strathglass]

As far as I am aware the spill kit is no longer required on the Ford engine.
I have been told that I do not require it on an XLD1800 engine.
It used to be a requirement but I am quite sure it has been dropped.
If I cannot find the info on the BSS web site, I will phone a BSS examiner tomorrow and come back to you.

Iain

 

[tr7v8]

The spil pipe issue is fairly clear cut as I understand it. Fords (and many others) used to use non-metallic spill pipes. Someone at the BSS decided in his infinite wisdom that this was a fire risk and should therefore be changed for metallic pipes. Minor problem is that these pipes are subject to high vibration loads and once aged fracture peeing high pressure diesel everywhere! EG. Just what they were installed to stop. As far as I am aware it's now been overruled by common sense and the Ford ones are legal, under certain circumstances.
This is just one of the many rules that the BSS thought up that were dubious to say the least!

Jim
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[aztec]

i'm not going to knock the 1800 (it can do it itself!) but the 1600 is bombproof.

i'm biased due to the fact that i have rebuilt about 12-15 of these engines after the camshaft had broken, some would say cambelt... i don't care but i wouldn't have one of the early ones in a car, and certainly not in a boat. i am told the later ones don't blow up for fun, but once bitten... etc.

if you feel you need more power, and don't mind the extra engineering think about the 2.5 di engine. it too is a good one to use. my personal preference for what you want is still the 1600 xld, but then i'm a tight arse and don't want to pay loads for all the replacement bellhousing, feet etc.

good luck and best wishes, steve.

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[boatmad2]

RE spill pipes the information I got from people on the EA stand at the boat show is that flexible spill pipes are not acceptable and the previous temporary exemption has now been removed. Lansings kit apparently consists of a dome thing that fitts over the injector and seals with o rings a banjo fitting screws into this to connect a steel spill pipe, problem is told to be difficulty getting o rings to seal reliably. also cost of kit is about £250.
I am also a tight a--e and will save cash if I can but I dont want to give myself a future problem.
If flexy spill pipes are safe on umpteen million various cars why have BSS got a bloody problem, have any boats caught fire yet because of flexy spill pipes.
And just wait till they find out what happens to hyd oil when a hyd pipe splits and sprays hyd oil onto the exhaust, but they dont seem to have any problems with hyd drive boats do they?.

 

[aztec]

see where your coming from, on of the replies came from "dave" an examiner, ask him.

i agree some of the ideas are fine and proper in theory, but when the "risk asessment" is applied it all falls down. i would ask the BSS and EA, where their logic comes from. but then i'm not a part of that.... yet.

hope you get some answers.



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[Strathglass]

Yes I agree the 1600 engine with it's single timing belt is a much sweeter engine but unfortunately much more difficult to find a newish one. My present escort van (L reg) has now covered about 180,000 miles and starts and runs every day and apart from irregular oil changes and timing belt changes has had no attention. I can't complain about that.

But the belts must be changed very regularly otherwise.
The earlier Ford 1800D were very poor. I had a P100 blow up on me. They are much better now. I have fitted four in different boats without any problems.

Certainly the older ones without the Tork head nuts should be avoided at all costs. Another way to date them is to look at the fan belt pulley if it is a five ribbed belt it is a later engine.

But I can understand you once bitten attitude I would feel the same in your situation.

Iain

 

[Col]

I've been told (and this makes sense) the reason they are against rubber spill hosing, is that if an engine fire starts, the hose will burn through, and feed the fire with diesel.
I have had an engine fire, and they can get going quite well before you notice.
If you're on the move, any trace of fumes and smoke will be left behind you, unlike a car, where, with front engine you will see/ smell smoke&fumes.

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[brianrunyard]

I didn't think the bell housing was used with an Enfield drive, my engine certainly hasn't got a bell housing and I've got an Enfield 130.

Brian
http://homepage.ntlworld.com/brunyard

 

[stamfordian]

Agree with this ,but he would have to buy the back engine mounts,i used a bellhousing....ford 2.5 to sonic outdrive using a modified PRM bellhousing ,just needed the drive hole for the gearbox opening out a little to accomadate spline drive,for "Cush" drive.Turned it over for the first time today and it was smooth as a babies bum.

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