Catching an intruder on your boat

[CJU]

Many years ago a friend kept his narrow boat on a stretch of the Grand Union near Coventry and it was broken into at least 5 times. Over the period of break ins he fitted metal shutters to all the windows and doors but still he was done. Eventually after the last break in he arranged a machette, pivoted on its handle and tensioned with a bungee such that it swept across the cabin floor at shin height, just in front of the companion way steps. It was triggererd by a trip cord and when tested on a broom handle took a large lump out of it.

On a subsequent visit the trap had been triggered and he said "it was as though someone had slaughtered a sheep there was blood everywhere". Now this perhaps rightly scared him so much that he recovered it all and spent the next 3 months living in fear of retribuition by either the victim or the police. Happily neither happened and as a bonus his boat wasn't broken into again. It also prevented a fellow boat owner from implementing his plan to aim a crossbow into the companionway to fire when the doors were opened without disarming the trap first.

I post this, not to suggest anyone else copies my friend but if they do go down that path to be sure they could live with all the consequences that might happen. And also to show what can happen to ordinary people when they are pushed to far.

 

[Searush]

All these ideas for electric shocks, how do you ensure that the seagull/ robber, whatever has one foot in the sea so that the shock works?

This might prove particularly difficult with the seagull on the mizzen top situation, but even thieves will not normally wish to get their feet wet & the deck is insulating GRP or wood.

 

[Nostrodamus]

Come on people. let's get real here.
It is one thing to defend your family or property with reasonable force when your on your boat and there is an intruder but to be off your boat when someone is electrocuted, fish hooked, machetted and cross bowed before being dumped in the water.
Is the law to soft... yes
Should we take reasonable steps to protect our property ... yes
Could and innocent person be severley injured by some of these ideas .. yes
Would you be happy if you saw smoke coming from a neighbours boat and went aboard to try and sort it out and you were injured by home made booby traps???

 

[Poignard]

Come on people. let's get real here.
It is one thing to defend your family or property with reasonable force when your on your boat and there is an intruder but to be off your boat when someone is electrocuted, fish hooked, machetted and cross bowed before being dumped in the water.
Is the law to soft... yes
Should we take reasonable steps to protect our property ... yes
Could and innocent person be severley injured by some of these ideas .. yes
Would you be happy if you saw smoke coming from a neighbours boat and went aboard to try and sort it out and you were injured by home made booby traps???

No good posting common sense anymore. It's not what they want to hear. The lunatics have taken over the asylum!

 

[jordanbasset]

Come on people. let's get real here.
It is one thing to defend your family or property with reasonable force when your on your boat and there is an intruder but to be off your boat when someone is electrocuted, fish hooked, machetted and cross bowed before being dumped in the water.
Is the law to soft... yes
Should we take reasonable steps to protect our property ... yes
Could and innocent person be severley injured by some of these ideas .. yes
Would you be happy if you saw smoke coming from a neighbours boat and went aboard to try and sort it out and you were injured by home made booby traps???

+1, beginning to thinking I was living in a parallel universe as so far we have been lucky and not had anything taken from our boat. Also only met a couple of people on our travels who have had items stolen, and they were from the cockpit. Some of the postings here make me more frightened of the posters than potential criminals.
We enjoy being on our boat, it is a wonderful way of life and I think a sense of perspective would be useful

 

[Conachair]

... electrocuted, fish hooked, machetted and cross bowed before being dumped in the water......

Does seem a bit over the top. Just because you thought your neighbors boat was dragging it's anchor and nipped onboard to let out some more chain... "I'm sure that boat has moved downwind a bit, I'll just nip over and let out some chain just in case, being the nice caring bloke that i am. Zap! AAAArrrrrgggghhhhhhh...... splosh.."

It's also bit odd that no one has mentioned prevention

How do you stop any light fingered locals/fellow yachties round the anchorage in the first place?
Lights turning on randomly? Would be quite easy to build a little box to do that. Then some kind of motion sensor ? pressure pad in the cockpit connected to a LOAD alarm and bright lights.
Would need to be pretty robust to be mounted permamently. Or maybe something which just gets rigged in the very occasionaly places where it's a problem.

 

[Robin]

+1, beginning to thinking I was living in a parallel universe as so far we have been lucky and not had anything taken from our boat. Also only met a couple of people on our travels who have had items stolen, and they were from the cockpit.

The original question was how you react to a break in whilst you are on board. As I said earlier there are two possibilities, those who have been burgled and those who have not, yet. Our burglary at home was traumatic enough for us to move house, with all that entails, within 2 months. Memories of that probably influenced my thinking and made me somewhat less charitable to the scum that broke into our boat and eleven others the same night (and returned a week later and did another dozen).

Some of the postings here make me more frightened of the posters than potential criminals.

Some of the postings here were made rather tongue in cheek don't you think? My fish hook comment was made to illustrate the attitude of plod after our boat break in when I floated the comment whilst they were on board telling me a) they knew who the culprits were b) they had no evidence c) it would probably happen again d) there was no point in taking fingerprints even. Oh and they only came in the first place because we INSISTED having been told not to touch anything until they had been, yet they didn't arrive and when we rang said they were not now intending to. Now 12 boats one night and another lot a week later, and plod doesn't give a shit, our marina is in millionaire's avenue I would bet if ONE house was done the entire constabulary would have arrived.

We enjoy being on our boat, it is a wonderful way of life and I think a sense of perspective would be useful

Absolutely agree. We are moving full time onto our boat in the USA soon, but will have one eye on the possibility of problems because not to would be rather naive. My current thinking is for some kind of PIR floodlighting at night in advance of a full alarm. How we react to both of those being activated in the middle of the night will depend on the circumstances but we could at least barricade ourselves into our cabin to buy time for Florida's finest to arrive. If our cabin was attacked I think then is the time that enough is enough, somebody is going to get hurt and it is not going to be us. That is perspective. At least in Florida we don't have to worry if the law will chose to protect the scum first or us.

 

[Poignard]

Does seem a bit over the top. Just because you thought your neighbors boat was dragging it's anchor and nipped onboard to let out some more chain... "I'm sure that boat has moved downwind a bit, I'll just nip over and let out some chain just in case, being the nice caring bloke that i am. Zap! AAAArrrrrgggghhhhhhh...... splosh.."

It's also bit odd that no one has mentioned prevention

How do you stop any light fingered locals/fellow yachties round the anchorage in the first place?
Lights turning on randomly? Would be quite easy to build a little box to do that. Then some kind of motion sensor ? pressure pad in the cockpit connected to a LOAD alarm and bright lights.
Would need to be pretty robust to be mounted permamently. Or maybe something which just gets rigged in the very occasionaly places where it's a problem.

Somewhere I have seen a sketch showing a simple, non-electrical, gadget that operates an aerosol foghorn if someone enters the cabin.

But you would have to be careful about not generating false alarms, otherwise you might suffer more violence from your neighbours than you ever would from a burglar!

 

[Conachair]

As I said earlier there are two possibilities, those who have been burgled and those who have not, yet.

Not sure about that, I've been burgled twice and had the boat done once. While I was asleep onboard. Don't feel a deep need to inflict pain on others, though would rather they stayed off the boat in the first place.

After the laptop and phone went from the boat, I do remember feeling quite lucky as the red mist lifted around lunchtime and I was back in a beautiful place.
Our realities have little to do with what happens but everything to do with how you react to it.

 

[jordanbasset]

'Originally Posted by Robin
As I said earlier there are two possibilities, those who have been burgled and those who have not, yet.'

Don't get me wrong my house has been burgled and it was annoying at the time and a feeling of invasion of privacy but I refuse to allow it to effect the rest of my life.
I do not want to live in fear of it happening again, it may well but life is too short to worry about it.

 

[Seajet]

Robin,

top tips as always; I think a resourceful yottie with the usual kit around will be able to deter the average yob, and a lot of the ideas mentioned are indeed tongue in cheek.

Maybe an alarm with a speaker in an American voice saying " Self Destruct Initiated; 5,4,3... " might assist the scrotes getting off !

At my club however some have adopted boat alarms which call the owner " help help I'm being burgled ! " by phone, a few £100; this kit can also work the other way, to turn on lights, fridge etc before one gets aboard.

Doesn't seem like the Swallows & Amazons spirit though, does it ?!

 

[Poignard]

Would you be happy if you saw smoke coming from a neighbours boat and went aboard to try and sort it out and you were injured by home made booby traps???

Not long ago I climbed on someone's boat to secure the main boom which had become unsheeted. If it had been booby-trapped as described above I would be dead and some rabid loonie would have been posting on here along the lines of:

"Result!
My home-made security system works a treat. Went down to the boat today and found the mangled corpse of a thieving scrote lying in the cockpit. Chucked him over the wall and scrubbed the deck in case the Old Bill luvvie-lefties come round making enquiries. Funny thing though, he must have been at least seventy, bit old for thieving off boats I would have thought. Probably needs money to fund his meals-on-wheels habit."

 

[Cardo]

One of the best forms of deterrence, I have found, is CCTV. Scrotes don't want to get caught, even if they know the penalties are laughable. I worked in the burglary unit for over 2 years and found that houses that either had obvious CCTV cameras or had signs up saying they were being monitored by CCTV were very rarely targeted. It was simply easier for the burglar to go next door and not risk being caught on camera. Of course, this won't stop the determined thief who will simply cover up his face, but local thieves are still recognisable even without seeing their faces.

One could either install some kind of dummy camera, CCTV sign, or go all out and set up some kind of system that records when it detects motion. Set it up on the mast so it can't easily be reached and pointing into the cockpit so it's not set off by someone walking past on the pontoon. If using real CCTV, the trick is to get a close up shot of the perp. Too many CCTV cameras are mounted miles up in the air and only show a figure moving around, which is a complete waste of time.

 

[Seajet]

Cardo,

I agree, but I think as CCTV is unusual on most boats, a slight way of drawing attention to it via an LED might be an idea, and some scrotes will be familiar with infra red systems so maybe a dull red solar ( day charged ) light ?

As to the value of CCTV, My ex- has a nice house in a small village; very soon after I put a camera up, despite it being matt green & discreetly placed, the village busybody was around within a couple of days asking " is that camera real ?" ' Yes, would you like me to run it through and print your picture ? '

I doubt there are any thieves in the village, but it was nice to know the camera was noticed.

 

[Stemar]

My comment about upping the power was at least half tongue in cheek and there are all sorts of reasons why putting the electric guard wires into practice would be more difficult than it sounds, not least the thought of frying some kind soul who wants to save my genoa when it unrolls.

On Jissel, in the midst of a hundred other boats, most newer and more expensive, I reckon the most effective anti-theft device I have when I'm not on board is a canvas cockpit cover. It's a pain to remove and pretty obvious if cut open. Unless you have a steel boat with armed guards 24/7, you're never going to be invulnerable. The best you can do is make next door more inviting.

When I'm on board, I hope that an extremely angry fat bloke waving a 10" bread knife and screaming blue murder will be adequate. At night the fact that said angry bloke is naked is likely to add to the shock and awe

 

[Seajet]

the shock and awe

So the breadknife is 10", right ?

 

[Honey]

Robin & US

Robin,
Like you I spend a lot of time in the sunshine state, but I am ashore. Having been burgled once - they stole the a/c unit whilst I was away - I now have these attached to each door

http://www.dollartree.com/catalog/search.cmd?form_state=searchForm&keyword=air horn&x=33&y=11

Good value for a dollar!

As a last resort I keep one of these handy

http://www.smith-wesson.com/webapp/...4_750001_750051_768152_-1_757992_757992_image

With a .410, missing is very difficult and damage to surroundings inevitable.

Hope the links work.

John

 

[Robin]

'Originally Posted by Robin
As I said earlier there are two possibilities, those who have been burgled and those who have not, yet.'

Don't get me wrong my house has been burgled and it was annoying at the time and a feeling of invasion of privacy but I refuse to allow it to effect the rest of my life.
I do not want to live in fear of it happening again, it may well but life is too short to worry about it.

I understand that view also. The loss of stuff in a burglary is an invasion of privacy, but when as in our case it involved setting up a gallery display of personal letters, personal photographs and my wife's underwear across our bed then 'invasion' takes on a whole new meaning. As I said, we moved house 80 miles away within 2 months which was as quick as it could be done. Plod warned us that the burglars often return for seconds once you have replaced everything on the insurance, since they know what there will be to nick.

We are not afraid of being on board, never have been over 40 years so not about to start now and we always sleep with hatches open. Over here we have never bothered with setting the alarms if we were on board.

Times have changed however. Boat burglars are no longer after marine stuff it seems but anything that can be easily removed and sold in the pub next day for the price of a fix. Times are changing even more for us because our home will be parked in a berth in downtown Daytona Beach, two blocks from Crytstal Meths Avenue & Crack Cocaine Street. The marina has good security, regular (armed) night patrols and gated pontoons, plus a good few other liveaboards so we are not especially bothered but we will NOT be complacent and will have our own plan of action formulated in advance. Power isn't a problem since we will have shorepower in our berth and we have enormous batteries and 2.5kw inverter for when not, even without the generator running. So PIR floodlighting is first warning, followed by PIR or pressure pad activated alarms as phase two. Our owners stateroom has a hefty door that can be quickly closed and then we almost have the safe room of a tanker crew in Somali pirate waters.

I don't think I'm being murderous or vengeful but forewarned is forearmed and that is the essence of our planning.

 

[Robin]

One of the best forms of deterrence, I have found, is CCTV. Scrotes don't want to get caught, even if they know the penalties are laughable. I worked in the burglary unit for over 2 years and found that houses that either had obvious CCTV cameras or had signs up saying they were being monitored by CCTV were very rarely targeted. It was simply easier for the burglar to go next door and not risk being caught on camera. Of course, this won't stop the determined thief who will simply cover up his face, but local thieves are still recognisable even without seeing their faces.

One could either install some kind of dummy camera, CCTV sign, or go all out and set up some kind of system that records when it detects motion. Set it up on the mast so it can't easily be reached and pointing into the cockpit so it's not set off by someone walking past on the pontoon. If using real CCTV, the trick is to get a close up shot of the perp. Too many CCTV cameras are mounted miles up in the air and only show a figure moving around, which is a complete waste of time.

Cardo, our YC Marina was done several times, including the two incidents of twelve at a time I mentioned plus even more in the boatyard area. The club has swipecard security gates on the entry which are locked down overnight needing additional code entry, swipecard gates again to the pontoons, PIR floodlights are everywhere AS ARE CCTV CAMERAS and signs warning of them. All that happens is that a) the scrotes arrive by water, thus avoiding the gates and b) they wear hoodies so the CCTV cameras merely tell next morning what time the scrotes were there!

The YC problem was solved by setting up a boatwatch scheme with club member volunteers on duty overnight monitoring the CCTV and using their eyes, ears and high powered lights. This successful method however isn't easily transposed into a single boat cruising type situation

 

[Stemar]

the shock and awe

So the breadknife is 10", right ?

I couldn't possibly comment...