Blatant plug for Suncoast RYA school

tcm

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As below, i just returned from Suncoast doing a YM course. Well recommended. Phil "cool" (not sure of his real surname) is the Principal - more serious boat handler and calming expert tutor than merely "cool".

You fly to Malaga, then rent a car is a good option instead of cabs and cheaper. Duquesa is a 100km blast down the motorway. A fiat punto cost unde 100 euros for the week, tho i only used it on arrival and departure days. Renting an apartment in summery months for hol with family and kids wd be a fab idea i bet. Duquesa and this whole coast is v popular with brits, a bit white trashy, but popular with good reason. Loads of evening restaurants all in walking distance, not haute cuisine but ridiculiously cheap.

At sea, estepona is a few miles east, then puerto banus. Some training trips turn west, where it's only 15 miles to the rock of Gibraltar which looms froma distance and looks 2 miles away when it in fact still six miles distant. The big bay means that even in rough weather a course or an exam could continue, hidden from a storm one reason the Brits wanted Gib to hold the empire.

Approaching the Rock of Gibralter by sea is one of the world's must-do runs for any boater, and in the course of as week we did it several times - probably more than my fair share on the helm as the others on the course, full-time skippers, were happy to let others take the helm for a change.

Neil Jobes and clive neighbour are the other directors of Suncoast, good guys and very sociable, and whilst it's not a requirement of the YM course to drink them under the table almsot every night, I made a pretty good attempt. Actualy, I did get to bed at 8:30 on one occassion. But unfortunately it was 8:30 in the morning.

Friday was exam day, and Phil made it clear that he wouldn't overly "prep" for the exam us for the course by letting us practise in exactly the same spots as where the exam would take place. Which is fair enough. Off to gib for blind navigation, which went well. You have to sit at the the saloon table, curtains drawn, no sight of instruments, and converse with the helmsman to gettim to take you to another spot a couple of miles away, following bearings or (often much better) some contour of the seabed. The helm can read back at you the speed, depth, bearing and distance but not use any GPS. Forget any idea of developing clever cheating codes cos with exam pressures on everyone, and experienced exmainers in charge, it won't work. Doing it properly is a better choice, and one after another we all arrived within 50 yards of our targets.

Then back eastwards from Gib, towards Duquesa, and into Sotogrande. This was originally a small port, but developers have dug out the land behind to hugekly extend the marina, Eastbourne-style, perhaps on an even bigger scale. There are some areas of new finished developments, and some under construction. Moorings range from big 30 metre dockside moorings to small basins for runabouts, all presuambly to be surrounded by flats. I thought we'd probably do some mooring alongside and so on.

But as we trolled around the examiner spotted one small basin off the main fairway, surrounded by concrete pontoons, an area about 40 metres by 60 metres, with a single entrance 15 metres wide. Lots of public swimming pools are bigger than this, and the poor bugger on the helm was instructed to drive in, turn the boat around, and get out again, with a nice fluky 15-20 knot breeze playing across the water. Oh, and the helmsman was told that he had to do this on one engine only. Jeez. We'd practised single-engine manouvres during the week, but in much more space. I think this must have been one of the freakiests things I've ever done with a boat.

Throughout the day, the Examiner ran man overboard drills, and took individual candidates below to grill them about secondary ports, tide heights, lights, sounds, tides and all the rest. I would strongloy recommned that anyone doing the course does a theory exam/course shortly before YM, cos the practical is no cakewalk, and you aren't excused any theory questions in the practical anyway. I used cmonline.co.uk where (if your remote tutor permits) you can blast through the course in a couple of weeks.

The other candidates did the whole lot, including revising rusty or non-existent theory knowldge in the one week, which means they could forget about about going out in the evenings and had to hope they wouldn't be grilled too hard about tidal heights or secondary ports.

We all passed, and celebrations began in Duquesa, then in Puerto Banus, the examiner joining in the jollities. There was some talk of a beach party, I think, with a spit roast, apparently. But nothing came of it and we roamed aroudn the bars returning home at a more civilised 4:30 pm. No problem getting up for breakfast at 9, though I chatted a bit too long in the dockside caff, and realised that departing Duquesa at 10:40 for a 12:10 flight meant I had to razz along the motorway at 100 , not wait for change at the tollbooths, and dump the wheezing hire car almost out of petrol in the cab rank to make the checkin.

Anyway, Suncoast is strongly recommended. Good people and i wish them well. Nice weather offers a taste of the med if you normally do boating in the UK. I think you need 2500 miles under your belt for Yachtmaster, half of it or more in tidal waters. If you have dayskipper already it's a start, but not necessary.

Thanks to Phil and the others at suncoast for putting up with me for a whole week.







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ccscott49

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Well done, Matt! Some incentive for me to go and do mine now, have to start swatting up on my theory!

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hlb

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Twenty six weeks of day skipper drudgery and I remember one thing only. Cardinal marks. Thats usefull. The rest. AAaaRRrGGgg!!

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Congratulations. Dont forget to ask for 10% off your insurance premium now (Bishop & Skinner anyway)

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hlb

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Ah But. It said some place. SB maybe. Ym's have more accidents than None YM's!!

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Haydn
 

hlb

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In all the years I've sailed around England, Ireland, France CI. Scotland, Greek Isles. I've never needed to know about Tidal Curves, Secondary Ports. What light is on a Fishing vessel. (If I'm going to get run down, does it really matter!!) All the info I need is in the pilot books or Almanac. Balls hung up by ships at anchor. Well I cant see that on the radar screen. But I can see the ships stopped and the anchor chain. Long before the ball!! Only ever got lost once when GPS came unplugged. So asked a fishing boat the way to Isle of Man!!...Who needs YM....../forums/images/icons/laugh.gif

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Haydn
 

MainlySteam

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A lot of merit in what you say Haydn. One can be too clever and get oneself into difficulties. We have tidal ranges of between 1 and 4 m in the places we normally cruise - I tend to just always assume it is low tide and don't go anywhere I can't at low tide (which does not cut out many places around here) and is much more reliable for keeping oneself afloat than all that secondary port stuff.

As you infer, fishing boats normally know the way to where they want to go, and especially home again, using the most cunning of plans. You don't actually even need to know all that deviation and variation compassy stuff they teach you. The old (well actually quite recent as I know of it still being used a couple of years ago) fishermans' method of getting from Cook Strait here to the Chatham Islands, which is a jaunt of 250 miles of open sea, was to head out of Cook Strait, set the boat on a transit from behind which they knew had them pointed in the right direction, then see what the compass read and then steered to that course.

Seen a few fishermen go on the rocks through going to sleep, too much drink or getting into the wrong type of baccy though, so it might pay to wipe the sleep out of their eyes or ensure they are not stoned before asking the way.

John

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Nick2

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I have to say that our three days last March bringing our boat from Thames to Hythe with the Suncoast Boys is a time that we will remember with great fondness. As you say Phil is more than "Cool" he is an excellent and very patient tutor and we were able to combine the trip with our dayskipper practical which was a real bonus. Having not long completed the theory course at Bisham (also recommended) the time spent with Phil and Clive has really changed our boating as we gained so much practical confidence and knowledge.

We have had an excellent first sea season and would also plug Suncoast for the dayskipper practical course too.

When we feel ready for YM we too will be off to Spain.

Plug over.........

Nick

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Renegade_Master

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Congrats on your YM pass Matt and thanks a lot for the kind words. We really enjoyed your company and Phil reckons you were the star pupil, being as prepared as you were.

Thanks also to Nick2 for your kind comments hope to see you & Joanne out here when you can get the chance. Clive

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BrendanS

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Final impetuse for me to get round to finishing off YM theory, and maybe start making plans for practical?

Which was most difficult bit for you, other than tricky handling bit. On the theory side, met and nav are ok, but find memorising ship lights bleedin difficult, especially as when out on water in dark, can never see ships actual nav lights for the all over illumination they all seem to have.

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hlb

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Well this is what I've got against all these exams. It might be pleasant to know whether the boat over there is a pilot, fishing, tanker. But take coming into Plymouth last year. I was following a fishing boat. Not that I wanted to follow him, but the flood lights on the deck had me blinded and I could not see a thing apart from him. Course it was just then that a rag, stringy thing decides to tack across my bow. But where to go when the only reference point is the bloody light.

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Divemaster1

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Congratulations !!

Would have wanted to join you guys, but workload dictated otherwise.

The few days I spent down there last week, I used to view a couple of potential boats for purchase instead.... but that's another story. Nice temperature at this time of the year though...

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tcm

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advantages of dayskip info

um your argument is a bit specious innit? Depending on the lights, he might have fishing gear out, or be drifting, and so on. You cd easilyy learn these, don't need evening classes, just a book or flash cards.

Anyway, last nite, in antibes, as a direct result of Phil's YM met info, i cut short a walk around the marina as the wind veered, and a cold front turned up 6 hours earlier than predicted. Sure enuf it chucked it down within 10 minutes just as we had got the covers up and cushions in.



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tcm

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There is a set of flash cards which are good for learning the lights, and once learnt they are hard to forget. True, lots of boats show the wrong lights. But of course, this does not mean it is ok not to knowem, as h thinks. Cos you'll be YM, and he'll be a donkey with the wrong lights, no lights, or wrong shapes, or the incorect size shapes.

I found it all tough enough, but it is very clear what you need to know, and what you don't. I wd imagine that others feel the same - no one part of the exam is a total doddle, really. It is a mistake to read all the tales of incredible pressure and imagine that the examiner will be a total git, cos ours wasn't. But he did tell of others who failed peeps cos they didn't know how to bleed the fuel, or failed to kep a log during the exam. Erk.

Again, Cmonline.co.uk is worth a look, and they give a taster free of charge. Phil at suncoast was impressed at the level of knowledge, if you hammer at the theory questions till you gettem all right. I think also that if you are hot shit at the theory it reduces the insistence of the examiner to keep probing after the first 20 questions he slings at you are answered correctly.

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BrendanS

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Yep, already over halfway through the cmonline.co.uk course, and it's very, very good, even for the bits like met and nav that I'm really just revising.

and got the flash cards too - Hate sitting there just learning them though. Boring,and I'll forget 98% once I've passed.

Wouldn't have a clue about bleedin fuel though!!!!! Is this a diesel thing?

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tcm

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Almost all seaschools offer a four-day course and the exam on the fifth day. So instructor will show on whatever boat about bleeding the diesel. If air gets in the pipe, engine stops. After bleeding, it starts again. No air if you keep tank topped up, usually. Not at all very difficult, but a bit important, like most of it really.

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Birdseye

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Never been able to understand how people can be so sure that the things they dont know arent worth knowing.

Suppose ignorance is bliss?

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hlb

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Ah but thats just my point. You have not been paying attention have you.

I,ve done the course, well day skipper anyway. Just found that much of the theory is of little use. Especially on a power boat. So you forget a big percentage of the course as irelivent. Most of what was relivant, I already knew. I learned one thing in 26 miserable weeks. Cardinal mark top marks. Cos we did not come across many in Wales. But it still dont make much difference as its obvious from chart, which way to go.

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MainlySteam

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<<<Never been able to understand how people can be so sure that the things they dont know arent worth knowing. Suppose ignorance is bliss?>>>

Hi Birdseye. I would never assume that anyone with no personal details against their posts is not worth knowing, but maybe ignorance really is bliss.

I think the courses and qualifications are fine, especially for jumpstarting a relative newcomer. But, for example, I take one look at the cartoons in the learning stuff and think "OhmyGod, I have better things to do than that" (perhaps along Haydns lines of spending a lot of time learning very little, but probably something) and consequently have never bothered with any. Perhaps it is a little like someone who has been speaking French as a second language all ones life, being advised that they should take some French language lessons - would probably learn something, but the fact that they can get through the original Dumas and Hugo makes it all a bit pointless really, they best spend their time doing their own learning targetted at what they don't know and may need to know (for example an experienced coastal sailor deciding to do an ocean crossing perhaps learning celestial).

Do courses that teach you how to work out secondary port tides, all the lights, etc teach one about risks? I suspect not. I would argue that they may even, unwittingly, teach one to take risks. My first reaction if I saw a vessel's lights I did not know (and I assume few of us know them all or can determine them all against confusing backgrounds such as a well lit city) is to assume the worst and get out of the way. Perhaps a fresh student would get his prompt card out and waste time trying to analyse the situation. Would a fresh student look at a chart and say if I do some classy calculations on secondary port tides I might get across those shallows or will he look at the chart and, if possible or reasonable, say "Why take the risk, lets keep to where we will always have water" who knows, the tide may be different to predictions today, etc.

When I see classes, or photos of classes on a yacht in a flat sea all with their wet weather gear, auto inflate lifejackets, tethers, etc on I sometimes wonder if the instructor has said - "You don't really need all that stuff because you are going to learn how not to fall overboard from me, and if you do go over while with me we will pluck you out again and you will have learnt the best boating lesson of your life." I suspect not.

In the end, much of what is taught is mostly irrelevant to a small vessel. It is irrelevant because if it is not used every day it is forgotten, or because it makes you think that the only way to know that a ship is at anchor, a sailing vessel motoring, etc is by its lights or shapes, etc, etc. (In fact I am unsure why any small vessel skipper would want to know why a ship is anchored or not - within the small vessel's navigation all that matters is if the ship is moving or not.)

This is not a criticism of those who do the courses at all, and I congratulate and admire TCM, for example, for doing so.

John

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