Belgium and Red

[Daydream believer]

Not to mention the bike ride through the countryside to the monastery that produces the beer voted best in the world.

I do not know that one-- Details please someone- Where is it?

 

[LadyInBed]

As the Chancellor of the Exchequer banned the sale of red to leisure craft and fishermen in last year's budget, with an implementation date sometime this year, I doubt it will be much of an issue.

As I understand it, the implementation date won't come in before 2022
I've still got a tank with 270 plus ltrs in, it's going to take some time to shift it, as again this year it doesn't look like I will be using much!

 

[Alicatt]

I do not know that one-- Details please someone- Where is it?

Bier kenners regularly vote St. Bernardus ABT12 better than the Westvleteren in blind tests, though they are both made to the same recipe.

The waffles in the Silversand Café on the promenade in Blankenberg are to die for, A4 in size and come with a mountain of fruit, it has been a favourite stop off when we are in the area and especially when we were catching the ferry to Rosyth.

I live on the other side of the country close to the Dutch and German borders, partying is part of the Belgian culture here, was quite a shock to the sheltered Scotsman here, I've been coming over here for 15 years and now seeking residency in Belgium with my Belgian wife.

As above Westvleteren https://www.trappistwestvleteren.be/nl/age-gate?_target_path=/nl
and St. Bernardus Home | St.Bernardus (sintbernardus.be)

It is fairly difficult to get the Westvleteren, there are shops in Brussels that sell it but at a huge premium, today's sale of beer ended early as it sold out very quickly, they have a calendar of when they sell the beer and when you can then collect it, they are now doing a home delivery in Belgium but at €70 plus per 12 bottles I'm not going to avail myself of the service. I have tasted the beer and it is very nice but the St. Bernardus tastes almost identical and is a fraction of the cost plus it is available in the local corner store here, my favourite Belgian beer is Kasteel Donker a sweetish dark beer at 12%abv Kasteel Donker - Kasteel Brouwerij Vanhonsebrouck

 

[st599]

It's only in the last 2 years they've sold it anywhere but the monks' shop. And when you did buy it you had to promise not to sell it on.

It's about 90 mins from Nieuwpoort Marina by bike - though I wouldn't go for thin racing tyres.

 

[rotrax]

Good - it is a fantastic country and we are trying to keep a secret

Best chips in Europe ?

Had some with most excellent meatballs in an Antwerp workers cafe in 1970!

And a fantastic " Lappin avec prune " in Bruge.

No chips that meal though

 

[Gibeltarik]

As I understand it, the implementation date won't come in before 2022
I've still got a tank with 270 plus ltrs in, it's going to take some time to shift it, as again this year it doesn't look like I will be using much!

Not an urgent problem unless you are off next week - see today's budget. But it doesn't solve the BE douanier issue - propulsion - white only

 

[dgadee]

Tell me if I'm wrong, but I thought that the red dye indicated that UK tax had not been paid. Now that we are out of the EU (except NI which remains in the customs union) it is of no interest to the rest of the EU what is in our tanks or what tax has been paid, so long as we didn't buy it or put it in whilst in an EU country.

 

[Gibeltarik]

Tell me if I'm wrong, but I thought that the red dye indicated that UK tax had not been paid. Now that we are out of the EU (except NI which remains in the customs union) it is of no interest to the rest of the EU what is in our tanks or what tax has been paid, so long as we didn't buy it or put it in whilst in an EU country.

The red dye and the chemical marker show that only rebated duty has been paid. This is illegal for propulsion in the EU and even if full duty has been paid in UK it is the fiscal marker that makes it illegal for propulsion not the level of duty.

 

[dgadee]

The red dye and the chemical marker show that only rebated duty has been paid. This is illegal for propulsion in the EU and even if full duty has been paid in UK it is the fiscal marker that makes it illegal for propulsion not the level of duty.

The Directive surely applies to member states and relates to the internal market. The EU can't stop a third country from putting any marker into fuel as it deems necessary for its own tax system. That's what I take the directive to mean - it is at EUR-Lex - 31995L0060 - EN - EUR-Lex

Ps: and my earlier post shouldn't have said tax not paid, but rebated as Gibeltarik says.

 

[TernVI]

The EU can make it a criminal offense to import or possess euromarked diesel in tanks connected to engines, in the EU.
What 3rd countries do at home is not the EU's business, but on thier territory, their rules.

If the UK wants to have different rules for coloured or marked diesel in yacht engine tanks, we need to pick a different chemical marker/dye.

 

[Gibeltarik]

You are probably right (and I don't have time to check properly!) but I wouldn't want to waste my cruising time arguing with a Douanier in Oostende or Dunkerke.

On our trips abroad in the last ten years we have always sailed with white (mainly) in our propulsion tank brought by jerrycans from the petrol station. Slow but sure. Of course - we have never been checked for fuel (water police, taxation , dept of transport - yes) but you never know - why spoil your holiday / cruise worrying?

In the same 10 years RYA tell me that they have never had a fuel tax issue where it could be proved that the fuel had been legitimately purchased in UK before departure.

 

[dgadee]

The EU can make it a criminal offense to import or possess euromarked diesel in tanks connected to engines, in the EU.
What 3rd countries do at home is not the EU's business, but on thier territory, their rules.

If the UK wants to have different rules for coloured or marked diesel in yacht engine tanks, we need to pick a different chemical marker/dye.

"Can make it" is different from there actually being an existing requirement that countries have to bring in a criminal offence for importation of 'marked' fuel. It cannot be 'euromarked' anyhow if it comes from a third country. So far as I see, the Directive relates to the harmonization of the internal market, not to importation. Point me in the direction of the source of your interpretation.

 

[JumbleDuck]

The Directive surely applies to member states and relates to the internal market. The EU can't stop a third country from putting any marker into fuel as it deems necessary for its own tax system.

Of course, but it can limit what is in the tanks of visiting craft. Try visiting France with out-of-date flares which are perfectly legal here or rocking up at Harwich with a bag of cannabis bought perfectly legally in Vlissingen.

 

[newtothis]

"Can make it" is different from there actually being an existing requirement that countries have to bring in a criminal offence for importation of 'marked' fuel. It cannot be 'euromarked' anyhow if it comes from a third country. So far as I see, the Directive relates to the harmonization of the internal market, not to importation. Point me in the direction of the source of your interpretation.

Ask the UK mollusc farming industry about what the EU can and cannot do when it comes to letting in stuff it doesn't want to cross its borders. Better yet, go visit Belgium with some red diesel and argue your point with the port police.

 

[dgadee]

These examples are all very well, but you need to point me in the direction of a Directive prohibiting the importation of marked diesel from a third country. Belgium was correctly applying the Directive when it dipped tanks from boats from member states. The UK is no longer a member state. It no longer (apart from NI) partakes of the internal market.

 

[awol]

These examples are all very well, but you need to point me in the direction of a Directive prohibiting the importation of marked diesel from a third country. Belgium was correctly applying the Directive when it dipped tanks from boats from member states. The UK is no longer a member state. It no longer (apart from NI) partakes of the internal market.

Dinnae fash about Belgium. You've got till June to clear your tanks of red and fill with white if you want to use the donk in Noriron

 

[dgadee]

Dinnae fash about Belgium. You've got till June to clear your tanks of red and fill with white if you want to use the donk in Noriron

I think most of us here will be claiming to have legally bought it up the Clyde. We can buy it there, and use it here.

 

[Gary Fox]

Of course, but it can limit what is in the tanks of visiting craft. Try visiting France with out-of-date flares which are perfectly legal here or rocking up at Harwich with a bag of cannabis bought perfectly legally in Vlissingen.

The French flare rule doesn't apply to visitors.

 

[awol]

I think most of us here will be claiming to have legally bought it up the Clyde. We can buy it there, and use it here.

"The government response to the summer 2020 consultation also announced that from no later than June this year private pleasure craft in Northern Ireland will have to use white diesel to propel their craft. This will achieve consistency with the 2019 judgment by the Court of Justice of the European Union and ensure the UK meets its international obligations under the terms of the Northern Ireland Protocol to the Withdrawal Agreement. "

 

[JumbleDuck]

The French flare rule doesn't apply to visitors.

Only on innocent passage, as far as I can see. If you go into port you have to play by their rules. https://littleshipclub.co.uk/files/images/Booklet part 2.pdf