Bayesian.

[ghostlymoron2]

I hope that the people from the MAIB have concluded their interviews with everybody involved before Dick Durham waded in, in his size 9 sea boots. He must know that there would be a) a MAIB investigation and b) a Coroners Inquest.

Having sailed with a friend who was on one of the Clipper boats that had a fatality the description of his MIAB interview was very interesting and his comment about the report that was issued was at it was a 'balanced view'.

Like others I've not watched TV since we went digital, but might find the programme online.

It'll be available on the itv catch up channel.

 

[Metalicmike]

There never seems to be much discussion about the keel, I can understand them lifting the keel whilst motoring but cannot understand why they wouldn't drop the keel when anchored. It would be interesting to know its effect on the yacht stability in its raised position.

 

[dunedin]

There never seems to be much discussion about the keel, I can understand them lifting the keel whilst motoring but cannot understand why they wouldn't drop the keel when anchored. It would be interesting to know its effect on the yacht stability in its raised position.

Actually the opposite, there has been a LOT of chat about the keel. Clearly it would be expected to be down with sails hoisted - particularly with the enormous spinnakers a boat like that would use in the superyacht regattas. But equally should be designed to be stable enough (within its design envelope) with the keel up when sails down and in harbour or anchored in shallow water.
Apparently it is common practice to lift keel in some super yachts at night, even in deep water, to reduce noise for guests.

In terms of the surprising tendency of the builder to publicly blame the crew for their “unsinkable” boat sinking so fast, it will be interesting to learn what the builder’s operating manual says about keel position overnight, if anything.

 

[Sea Change]

There never seems to be much discussion about the keel, I can understand them lifting the keel whilst motoring but cannot understand why they wouldn't drop the keel when anchored. It would be interesting to know its effect on the yacht stability in its raised position.

I used to have a 33ft boat with a big bronze centreboard. We only ever lowered it when sailing with the wind forward of the beam. In all other instances it would rattle and clonk, which was pretty annoying.
I'd also expect that any lifting keel boat would be designed to have adequate stability with the keel raised. The boat is expected to be able to sail safely with the keel up.

I have no idea whether my experience translates to a much larger boat of course.

 

[davethedog]

I watched the documentary last night and found it very informative but also very very sobering that it could happen to such a vessel.

As for the investigation, due to the publicity etc I am sure it will be very thorough indeed!

 

[bedouin]

I watched the documentary last night and found it very informative but also very very sobering that it could happen to such a vessel.

As for the investigation, due to the publicity etc I am sure it will be very thorough indeed!

To be fair - MAIB are always very thorough indeed. I have no doubt they will do everything possible to understand why it sank in the way it did.

 

[lustyd]

that it could happen to such a vessel.

I think this assumes incorrectly that seaworthiness would be high on design priorities on a boat primarily designed for drinking in the sunshine. Boats like this need to be seaworthy enough but not overly so as it would spoil the experience. The Kraken video demonstrates this nicely with him implying a raised hatch with sliders would be better than a patio door. Sure, it wouldn’t sink but neither would it leave the dock as nobody would buy or charter such a boat.

 

[Sandy]

There never seems to be much discussion about the keel, I can understand them lifting the keel whilst motoring but cannot understand why they wouldn't drop the keel when anchored. It would be interesting to know its effect on the yacht stability in its raised position.

Why would you need the keel down at anchor?

My only experience with a lifting keel is on a Boreal 47 and it was not needed unless sailing to windward.

While the size of the vessel is smaller than Bayesian the principals are the same.

 

[Seastoke]

Why would you need the keel down at anchor?

My only experience with a lifting keel is on a Boreal 47 and it was not needed unless sailing to windward.

While the size of the vessel is smaller than Bayesian the principals are the same.

Is it not to counter balance the heavy mast , when windy.

 

[RunAgroundHard]

The weather event was very extreme, hence keel down would have improved stability at anchor in these conditions, keel up reduced stability. It’s pretty simple logic for the incident conditions.

 

[RunAgroundHard]

Is it not to counter balance the heavy mast , when windy.

As far as I understand it, from the various discussions post incident, YouTube et cetera, the boat is stable motoring about with its keel up, so countering the mast weight was in place.

 

[Seastoke]

As far as I understand it, from the various discussions post incident, YouTube et cetera, the boat stable motoring about with its keel up, so countering the mast weight was in place.
[/QUO. !!!

 

[14K478]

I’ve been a “customer” of the MAIB twice, in the day job and they are excellent.

I don’t know about you, but looking at the anchorage position, and the possibility of the wind coming on shore, I would have had the plate up.

 

[Sandy]

Is it not to counter balance the heavy mast , when windy.

Without the design and testing data for the Bayesian nobody can work that out. I am sure the MAIB are having a good look at all the figures, Standard Operating Procedures and the actions of all onboard that night.

 

[Pye_End]

A lot of information on this thread: 56m luxury sailing yacht sinks off Sicily, 7 missing

It sounds as though the keel is potentially noisy at anchor. Lots of discussion of stability and downward flooding angles in the thread.

 

[Seastoke]

Is it not to counter balance the heavy mast , when windy.

I was asking the question .

 

[laika]

I'm sorry but I have no idea what you're talking about. I haven't watched ITV for maybe 40 years (if not more). In fact I don't watch TV at all except twice a year when SpringWatch or WinterWatch are on. Apart from that the TV stays switched off.

Either you’re watching that without a licence or by my calculations you’re paying about £7.50 an episode

 

[Sandy]

Either you’re watching that without a licence or by my calculations you’re paying about £7.50 an episode

You only need a TV licence to watch BBC content on the internet live, i.e. at the time of transmission.

 

[capnsensible]

I’ve been a “customer” of the MAIB twice, in the day job and they are excellent.

I don’t know about you, but looking at the anchorage position, and the possibility of the wind coming on shore, I would have had the plate up.

The Forum Accident Investigation Board is much quicker at jumping to several conclusions though. Doesn't need any real evidence either.

 

[Tillana]

You only need a TV licence to watch BBC content on the internet live, i.e. at the time of transmission.

Not for BBC. That's true of other channels, but you can't watch iplayer without a licence