Alternatives to deak for decking?

lustyd

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Even if so, not bad. Plenty of anecdotal evidence quotes are approaching 5 figures minimum for a full deck all in.
From what they told me it’s a per square metre cost so for average sized boats I don’t expect it would get much over 10k and that would probably be a very large amount of decking. Mine would only add side decks and bow if it were full teak they don’t do the coachroof as far as I’m aware so that might double the cost to 4-5k. As I said they never came back to me to get a date in and then I went cruising all summer. They seemed confident though in the pricing and effort.
 

Koeketiene

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Got to be honest, I’ve not seen a synthetic teak that I like. But everyone has their own taste.

This is what my previous boat's cork based 'faux teak' looked like in 2021 as I helped her new owner sail the boat back to the UK.
This was 12 years after the deck was fitted.
If I had to re-do the teak deck of my current boat, I would use the same thing again.

244307663_10165464783355114_9064645473852564460_n.jpg
 

Tranona

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As I said, my quote was £2k so you're just showing your own wild biases again
That is just for your cockpit and sugar scoop - and is low even for that. Wait until you actually do it. The majority of cost of many redecking projects is removing the old and making good. Actual laying the teak or plastic is much the same if you are using pre made panels, although not sure now that premade teak panels are actually available. So if you are laying teak or plastic onto plain GRP then it is roughly half the cost of stripping and recovering.

Seem like you don't really understand the this business at all and base your claims on one quote for a small job. The OP is talking about complete strip and redeck and depending on the size of the boat and the type of decking being removed and the new covering it could be anywhere between £10-30k
 

lustyd

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The majority of cost of many redecking projects is removing the old and making good.
Yes I thought that until I actually spoke to the supplier. The figure quoted included removal and fairing. I get that you don't like it, but I can't understand your desire to stop others by any means possible. If people can afford it and want to do it, live and let live. Why pretend it's more expensive and lower quality than it clearly is?
I've spoken to suppliers, and looked at this stuff at boat shows and in marinas. Almost everything you have said on this thread is utter nonsense and I've no idea what you hope to achieve in discreditting these businesses. Do you have some axe to grind or maybe an undeclared interest here? Or perhaps you were quoted over the odds because the supplier didn't want to deal with you further?
 

Tranona

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Yes I thought that until I actually spoke to the supplier. The figure quoted included removal and fairing. I get that you don't like it, but I can't understand your desire to stop others by any means possible. If people can afford it and want to do it, live and let live. Why pretend it's more expensive and lower quality than it clearly is?
I've spoken to suppliers, and looked at this stuff at boat shows and in marinas. Almost everything you have said on this thread is utter nonsense and I've no idea what you hope to achieve in discreditting these businesses. Do you have some axe to grind or maybe an undeclared interest here? Or perhaps you were quoted over the odds because the supplier didn't want to deal with you further?
What have I said that you seem to think is nonsense? I am not discrediting anybody. I am expressing a personal opinion that I don't like the fake teak look on many of the boats it is applied to. I think it is poor value for money as it offers no functional advantage. I deliberately did not specify either real teak or plastic on my new Bavaria for those reasons - plus I have seen what happens to teak 20 years down the line. The plastic was more expensive than the real as it happens. I do, however think it is practical for cockpits, particularly if you cover them up for the winter when most of the damage (in the UK) is done. If you actually read what I write you will discover that I have done a complete boat in teak decking all by myself and am in the process of applying teak to selected parts of my project boat and will be doing the cockpit seats and sole this coming winter.

Is that good enough for you ? I have no axe to grind. I just think teak is wrong on many modern boats aesthetically and practically and that plastic teak is even worse no matter how "real" they try and make it. Its only saving grace is that based on experience to date it is long lasting. The figures I have suggested for complete jobs are real - there have been more than enough articles in the boaty press confirming this. You can obviously reduce the cost if you do all or part DIY because of the high labour content as much of the removal and making good is relatively unskilled.

BTW I have never had quotes for aftermarket fitment - why would I as I don't need it? But that does not mean I don't know what it costs because there is plenty of information in the public domain - and as I said I am no stranger to laying teak decks.
 

Koeketiene

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Yes I thought that until I actually spoke to the supplier. The figure quoted included removal and fairing. I get that you don't like it, but I can't understand your desire to stop others by any means possible. If people can afford it and want to do it, live and let live. Why pretend it's more expensive and lower quality than it clearly is?

Teak decks can be an emotive issue.
There are those who feel that the only thing worse than a teak deck is a faux teak deck.
Lots of wildly inaccurate figures are being waved around based on best guesses rather than actual first hand experience.
And experiences will vary from boat to boat depending on various factors.
 

Concerto

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Have to agree with Tranona and diagree with lustyd.

Earlier in this thread I advised the OP to fill and paint the deck, to which Tranona agreed. Later synthetic plastic decking was suggested. On my Fulmar when I removed the Treadmaster in the cockpit 8 years ago, I initially was going to use Wilks decking but decided against as I found Howells in Poole could make 9mm thick teak panels for very little extra cost. To me that was a no brainer for a classic glassfibre boat. My teak cocpit was only £1500 for the teak and adhesive, plus I fitted the panels myself. However the number of people who have commented it is much nicer than synthetic teak whilst at the 2021 Southampton Boat Show made me realise I had made the right choice and there are plenty of owners who do not like synthetic plastic decking.

When you visit a boat show many companies are there to sell their wares. In the case of synthetic decking there are a number of companies promoting this, yet none to suggest just filling and painting the deck. Why? There is more money to be made from selling synthetic decking than filler and paint. For this reason it seems lustyd has fallen into the marketing grasp of these companies and ignoring the cheaper solution.

Usually the older the boat requiring work also involves keeping an eye of the total spend in relation to the value of a boat. There is little point in spending £10,000 on new decking on a £20,000 boat. Even spending £10,000 on new decking for a £60,000 boat would never increase its value by more than a couple of thousand over painted decks.
 

lustyd

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What about using flowcoat rather than paint? More effort initially perhaps, but no repainting every few years thereafter and there is a load of filling and fairing required anyway.
The issue here is that unless you put an exceptional amount of effort in making moulds you'll end up with an ice rink of flat and shiny plastic. That done, you'll still be in for painting and maintenance every couple of years. I recently made moulds for my non-slip and it's not a fun process even for small sections let alone a full deck.
 

harvey38

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It looks like I'm going to have to replace the teak decking this winter.
I don't want to replace teak with teak.
The deck is foam core, and the existing teak deck is glued down, so there are very few screw holes into the foam core, just 2 or 3 forward by the anchor locker, and down the side of the coach roof.
The existing deck isn't a true edge to edge narrow plank, but wide boards with grooves routed into the boards, then filled with sealant, to make it look like a traditional laid deck.
My guess is that the old teak will have to be cut out somehow, the deck sanded and a glass epoxy laminate laid down. Followed by an artificial teak laminate, of some kind.
Is my guess about right?
And what's the best artificial teak to use?
Ian, as you can see, it's an emotive subject!

If you have researched artificial teak and dismissed the alternatives, I can endorse it's practicalities. Our mobo was smothered in Treadmaster that was probably dark grey when new but was worn and a horrible charcoal colour. I removed the Treadmaster and had Tek-Dek template, make and fit a fake deck to the upper helm and steps either side, that cost around £3k. The following year I removed the Treadmaster on the deck and employed their services again, £3k.

Tek Deck are again coming today to template the forward coach roof and upper helm seat boxes. Another £3k

So, for a 38ft mobo circa £9k. The coach roof was again covered in Treadmaster and is a bit overkill IMHO doing in Tek-Dek but SWMBO thinks it will be OK and it does cover all manner of surfaces dinks that would take a huge amount of work to get a decent painted/gel finish. The tender generally lived there too so it does make sense. They quote £300 sq. M for fully margined panels so £6k without the coach roof.

Money vs practicalities vs aesthetics, I'm very pleased with it and had many positive comments. Do I really care what others think, no!20220927_160125.jpg
 
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Ian_Edwards

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Thanks for all the replies.
However, I'm not sure that I'm that much wiser after reading them.
The boat is a Southery 46RS, from 2007, so relatively high value, there were 4 built.
The teak decking consists of a relatively narrow side deck (around 400mm) which runs the full length of the boat, plus a small section of foredeck, forward of the coach roof. Not a big area considering the size of the boat.
As I said in the original post, it's not a conventional narrow strip, edge jointed, but wide boards, with groves routed into the boards, which have been filled with black "mastic", to make it look like a conventional edge to edge construction.
In high wear places the teak has worn down to the point where the mastic has worn way, or become loose. i.e. the deck has worn to the depth of the Grove.
I agree that the cheapest solution is the strip the old teak of, make good the surface and paint.
However, to my eyes, that would look very odd, and I'm happy to admit that is in the eye of the beholder!
The boat is based in Scotland, and I'm not sure that there many, if any, yards capable of doing the work. And moving the boat down to an English yard is expensive and time consuming. It's around 1,200 miles round trip to the Solent, 10hrs driving each way.
My take away is synthetic teak is partical, wears well, there are multiple choices, and it's down to whether you can live with it or not.
 

Supertramp

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Thanks for all the replies.
However, I'm not sure that I'm that much wiser after reading them.
The boat is a Southery 46RS, from 2007, so relatively high value, there were 4 built.
The teak decking consists of a relatively narrow side deck (around 400mm) which runs the full length of the boat, plus a small section of foredeck, forward of the coach roof. Not a big area considering the size of the boat.
As I said in the original post, it's not a conventional narrow strip, edge jointed, but wide boards, with groves routed into the boards, which have been filled with black "mastic", to make it look like a conventional edge to edge construction.
In high wear places the teak has worn down to the point where the mastic has worn way, or become loose. i.e. the deck has worn to the depth of the Grove.
I agree that the cheapest solution is the strip the old teak of, make good the surface and paint.
However, to my eyes, that would look very odd, and I'm happy to admit that is in the eye of the beholder!
The boat is based in Scotland, and I'm not sure that there many, if any, yards capable of doing the work. And moving the boat down to an English yard is expensive and time consuming. It's around 1,200 miles round trip to the Solent, 10hrs driving each way.
My take away is synthetic teak is partical, wears well, there are multiple choices, and it's down to whether you can live with it or not.
Good clarification. And on a boat of that size, quality and age teak or faux would look best. If there is no one in Scotland that can do it, try North Wales at Conwy or Pwllheli.

On my boat teak decks were an option so removal returned it to standard appearance.
 

Buck Turgidson

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Thanks for all the replies.
However, I'm not sure that I'm that much wiser after reading them.
The boat is a Southery 46RS, from 2007, so relatively high value, there were 4 built.
The teak decking consists of a relatively narrow side deck (around 400mm) which runs the full length of the boat, plus a small section of foredeck, forward of the coach roof. Not a big area considering the size of the boat.
As I said in the original post, it's not a conventional narrow strip, edge jointed, but wide boards, with groves routed into the boards, which have been filled with black "mastic", to make it look like a conventional edge to edge construction.
In high wear places the teak has worn down to the point where the mastic has worn way, or become loose. i.e. the deck has worn to the depth of the Grove.
I agree that the cheapest solution is the strip the old teak of, make good the surface and paint.
However, to my eyes, that would look very odd, and I'm happy to admit that is in the eye of the beholder!
The boat is based in Scotland, and I'm not sure that there many, if any, yards capable of doing the work. And moving the boat down to an English yard is expensive and time consuming. It's around 1,200 miles round trip to the Solent, 10hrs driving each way.
My take away is synthetic teak is partical, wears well, there are multiple choices, and it's down to whether you can live with it or not.
Are you sure the grooves can’t be routed deeper and re caulked?
 

Tranona

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Thanks for all the replies.
However, I'm not sure that I'm that much wiser after reading them.
The boat is a Southery 46RS, from 2007, so relatively high value, there were 4 built.
The teak decking consists of a relatively narrow side deck (around 400mm) which runs the full length of the boat, plus a small section of foredeck, forward of the coach roof. Not a big area considering the size of the boat.
As I said in the original post, it's not a conventional narrow strip, edge jointed, but wide boards, with groves routed into the boards, which have been filled with black "mastic", to make it look like a conventional edge to edge construction.
In high wear places the teak has worn down to the point where the mastic has worn way, or become loose. i.e. the deck has worn to the depth of the Grove.
I agree that the cheapest solution is the strip the old teak of, make good the surface and paint.
However, to my eyes, that would look very odd, and I'm happy to admit that is in the eye of the beholder!
The boat is based in Scotland, and I'm not sure that there many, if any, yards capable of doing the work. And moving the boat down to an English yard is expensive and time consuming. It's around 1,200 miles round trip to the Solent, 10hrs driving each way.
My take away is synthetic teak is partical, wears well, there are multiple choices, and it's down to whether you can live with it or not.
That does put a different perspective on it. Pretty sure the teak is a preformed panel and was probably made by moodydecking.co.uk/products/decking-products and vacuum bagged with epoxy onto the deck before it was fitted out with all the hardware and attached to the hull. If I am right they may well still have the templates. As you see they also now do a cork based product as well. I remember seeing decks at the Northshore yard at the time with the teak already bonded on. That would be my first port of call. As an aside, the mass producers like Bavaria also moved to that type of decking, either in plastic or teak.

Alternatively if you decide to go down the plastic route your deck is very straightforward compared with some (like Harveys) which have a lot of detail around fittings. Some firms take templates and manufacture the panels offsite so that all the seams are pre welded and the complete panels are then glued onto the boat. This makes it possible to, say make it down south and go up to you to install it on the boat (same would apply to preformed teak). Removal of the old is something that could be done locally in advance. Most of the makers have accredited installers. One of them has just done the cockpit and sugar scoop on a boat in our club. He had taken templates, made the panels and arrived with them rolled up for fitment. Took less than a day to fit.

Despite my negative comments earlier your boat "deserves" replacement rather than painting. If it were mine I would go for the real thing if you can get it, Second choice would be cork based, but makes sense to explore all the options before making a decision.
 

ashtead

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A few observations based on experience with Flexiteak fitted from new since 2015 :
1 don’t fit on coachroof if currently white as it will increase heat inside but maybe in Scotland that’s a good thing;
2 the big advantage of Flexiteak is even after 8 years it looks like it did day 1 with little maintenance save for usual washing and a spray in parts to remove green at start of season;
3Flexiteak can get light scratches where deck gates are but really only caused by dog claws not human traffic and can be sanded out;
4 we have to clean and seemco our real teak rails and cockpit cappings but I doubt I would ever be doing that with real teak decks unless I had crew or a cheap source of labour -on reflexion I might have gone for flexiteak cappings . I don’t know how well a Flexiteak roe rail would stand up to wear and tear though so would stick with teak there;
5 avoid bright colours-white filler etc;
60 it has the advantage on cockpit seats that the black sikaflex doesn’t come off on clothing unlike real teak (at least that used by some German boats)
7 if you can get down to a marina to see the Flexiteak being retrofitted on a new delivery boat - it a large investment after all,not convenient for you but see if you can sail on another boat of same size etc with the flexiteak -that’s how we decided on product after seeing a white grp deck with retrofit;
8 no raised teak plugs and uneven wear
9 based on comments from others it keeps the boats looking newer if that’s important - in summary it will take years off a 2007 boat I’m sure
I have attached photo showing Flexiteak deck alongside real teak rail in case of interest as an example.
 

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