Yachtsmen Carrying Knives (UK)

[ImpImp]

The army didn't do those 'high speed courses' to which you allude in your post. The reason for that is , legally, the only organisations who can exceed the speed limit are the police, fire, ambulance, and lately, NCA, but not the army. So, you might have done an army driving course but it wasn't a pursuit course or course which involved exceeding the speed limit. Army/forces personnel requiring that kind of training came to the police because only the police can do it. Pursuit training was not included, because the armed forces do not have marked vehicles equipped for that, and are not allowed to do it, so what would be the point? Possibly, changing your user name to Walter mitty be appropriate.

Whilst I'd agree that the chap to whom you are replying is called Walter you are wrong about the law, and indeed almost everything else in your post:

The Road Traffic Exemptions (Special Forces) (Variation and Amendment) Regulations 2011

 

[Hermit]

I carried an Allen key that fits high pressure air reducers and a small adjustable spanner.

2B pencil and rubber for me

 

[capnsensible]

2B pencil and rubber for me

Hope you mean an eraser......

 

[Hermit]

Hope you mean an eraser......

Depends which was required to be carried whilst going about my lawful employment.

 

[The Q]

Whilst I'd agree that the chap to whom you are replying is called Walter you are wrong about the law, and indeed almost everything else in your post:

The Road Traffic Exemptions (Special Forces) (Variation and Amendment) Regulations 2011

Not special forces, but I had an O/C MT try and charge me for speeding in a landrover fire engine while on a shout to another site. We had 4 sites spread over 20 miles, belonging to one RAF Station.
Strangely we had no road training for this, we were electronics technicians, responsible for fire response on, secret at the time, electronic equipment.
Officially I got a blocking, however it was very mild and ended with the words ... Ignore the idiot.

 

[PWLS08]

Not special forces, but I had an O/C MT try and charge me for speeding in a landrover fire engine while on a shout to another site. We had 4 sites spread over 20 miles, belonging to one RAF Station.
Strangely we had no road training for this, we were electronics technicians, responsible for fire response on, secret at the time, electronic equipment.
Officially I got a blocking, however it was very mild and ended with the words ... Ignore the idiot.

Amusingly RMP etc are not exempted from traffic regs, though historically the odd blind eye has been turned one or two have been caught out - the cheeky monkeys ;-).

 

[Neil]

The teacher himself needs a bit of instruction in knife safety!

Yes, never try to pierce something with a non-locking knife! but if it's the only one in your pocket.....

I remember when my youngest daughter was about 4yr and the Velcro fastenings on her shoes wouldn't because the hook sides were full of fluff. Out came the knife from my pocket and I proceeded to comb out the fluff with the tip of the knife; "Daddy, I don't know what you'd do without your pocket knife!"

"I know Elena, I don't know how anybody manages without one!"

 

[penberth3]

Amusingly RMP etc are not exempted from traffic regs, though historically the odd blind eye has been turned one or two have been caught out - the cheeky monkeys ;-).

RMP are not Police

 

[nevis768]

Whilst I'd agree that the chap to whom you are replying is called Walter you are wrong about the law, and indeed almost everything else in your post:

The Road Traffic Exemptions (Special Forces) (Variation and Amendment) Regulations 2011

Actually, if you read the posts by 'Walter' he was referring to the time well before 2011, referencing the military during the time of the Troubles. This Act came into force in 2011, there was no exemption before that, so you are incorrect. There was no Road Traffic exemption, at that time for military training. The Act produced an exemption for SF only, which also does not appear to be what the OP was referring to, or if it was, he didn't mention it. During that time, referred to in the posts in question, the police carried out the "high speed training" of the military SF, usually the Met. These courses were not carried out in NI for obvious reasons, which is also were 'Walter' claimed to have done them.

 

[PWLS08]

Actually, if you read the posts by 'Walter' he was referring to the time well before 2011, referencing the military during the time of the Troubles. This Act came into force in 2011, there was no exemption before that, so you are incorrect. There was no Road Traffic exemption, at that time for military training. The Act produced an exemption for SF only, which also does not appear to be what the OP was referring to, or if it was, he didn't mention it. During that time, referred to in the posts in question, the police carried out the "high speed training" of the military SF, usually the Met. These courses were not carried out in NI for obvious reasons, which is also were 'Walter' claimed to have done them.

He's right and you're still wrong. A whole raft of Army and joint units have been doing that sort of thing since the 1970s at least. Not just for NI, but also (in the UK training for) BRIXMIS etc, the latter mostly a mix of RCT/RLC and RAF drivers. They may, or may not, have had the strict legal right but HO police forces were happy to allow it. I suspect that in the days of Crown Immunity it wasn't a problem in any case, but eventually the anomaly was spotted and put right. A bit like the appearance of the word Ambulance on BFAs in the early 2000s to fit with the statutory requirements.

Initially many of the instructors were police but as is the way of things it soon went over to in-house pax, or CS employed retired police.

 

[nevis768]

He's right and you're still wrong. A whole raft of Army and joint units have been doing that sort of thing since the 1980s at least. Not just for NI, but also (in the UK training for) BRIXMIS etc, the latter mostly a mix of RCT/RLC and RAF drivers. They may, or may not, have had the strict legal right but HO police forces were happy to allow it. I suspect that in the days of Crown Immunity it wasn't a problem in any case, but eventually the anomaly was spotted and put right. A bit like the appearance of the word Ambulance on BFAs in the early 2000s to fit with the statutory requirements.

Complete rubbish, police forces cannot allow anything which is against the law, e.g if you have a fatal accident on the M6 while doing illegal training you are saying the police would say, 'Oh, it's ok, never mind about that we will tell the family it was ok. We know it was illegal, it's such a shame your relative was killed, but we won't do anything about it?'
Are You having a laugh?
Also, the exemption does not prevent prosecution for dangerous driving and other offences.
I don't think you have any idea what "high speed' training entails or pursuit training. It is certainly not undertaken by people in the RAF unless they are using their aircraft, I'm sure they do advanced driver training, but that's not the same as what happens in advanced police training, or in any way similar.
Crown immunity doesn't apply in the way you suggest, hence the prosecution of many people in the military over the years.

 

[Keith 66]

Last year at our club's cadet week all instructors & helpers were told they had to grind any pointed ends off their knives so they couldnt stab anyone!

 

[Bouba]

I know it’s was a different time and place...but I used to walk around town with a sheath knife on my belt...when I was eight years old

 

[Zing]

I know it’s was a different time and place...but I used to walk around town with a sheath knife on my belt...when I was eight years old

Me too, but a little older. 11 maybe.

 

[Pete7]

I know it’s was a different time and place...but I used to walk around town with a sheath knife on my belt...when I was eight years old

Actually, I would suggest nothing much has changed today given the picture posted by Onesea (post 17)

 

[Bouba]

Actually, I would suggest nothing much has changed today given the picture posted by Onesea (post 17)

Looking at that pile of knives handed in in a knife amnesty....makes me ask one question....why would you hand in a kitchen knife ?....why not just put it back in the kitchen drawer

 

[Pete7]

Looking at that pile of knives handed in in a knife amnesty....makes me ask one question....why would you hand in a kitchen knife ?....why not just put it back in the kitchen drawer

Don't think 14 yr olds have a kitchen drawer and might be difficult to explain taking it home and declaring it.

 

[doug748]

Looking at that pile of knives handed in in a knife amnesty....makes me ask one question....why would you hand in a kitchen knife ?....why not just put it back in the kitchen drawer

Indeed, plus the portly copper standing proudly beside a pile of stuff you could pick up for a quid in any charity shop.

.

 

[Zing]

Actually, I would suggest nothing much has changed today given the picture posted by Onesea (post 17)

Oh, yes a lot has changed. Owning a knife back then meant you thought it appropriate to use it as anything but as a weapon.

 

[Geoff Wode]

Ah yes, those halcyon days when no one who carried a knife considered it a weapon apart from those who did.