Why I like boating on the SoF

[MapisM]

I think the 65 is [...] easy to manage on my own ie no crew.

Do you mean singlehanded? Chapeau!
In both my previous 53' and current 56', the minimum crew requirement reported in the registration papers is 2 persons.
And I wouldn't fancy going out singlehanded regardless of legal requirement, anyhow!

 

[MapisM]

To be fair, M. Amati didn't make it to be good at anchor of course

Absolutely. Neither did Aronow, Bertram, Theodoli, etc., in fact.
Easy to figure any of these guys faced with a prospect client pointing out that their boats roll like pigs, and answering along the lines of...
So, what? Buy something else!

 

[Hooligan]

Do you mean singlehanded? Chapeau!
In both my previous 53' and current 56', the minimum crew requirement reported in the registration papers is 2 persons.
And I wouldn't fancy going out singlehanded regardless of legal requirement, anyhow!

I think lost in translation. I meant without staff type crew. Any bigger boat and I think you are starting to look at some sort of professional help. I can easily handle her with just me and the wife. In fact in some ways she is easier than the 58 that didn’t have a bow thruster. As for legal requirements this doesn’t show in my reg papers so that must be an Italian thing I guess.

 

[Hooligan]

I think lost in translation. I meant without staff type crew. Any bigger boat and I think you are starting to look at some sort of professional help. I can easily handle her with just me and the wife. In fact in some ways she is easier than the 58 that didn’t have a bow thruster. As for legal requirements this doesn’t show in my reg papers so that must be an Italian thing I guess.

Apologies rear thruster not bow

 

[MapisM]

Aha, understood - and wholeheartedly agreed.

We saw a few larger boats (up to an 86', no less!) before eventually going for a 56', similar to the Sq58 in size and also in some other ways.
In fact, while as liveaboarder (if such word exists!) the larger spaces were attractive, we feared that we would have soon been fed up by the workload involved, probably needing crew - which we didn't want.
That's the primary reason why eventually we focused on mid-50 footers, also because back in the years of our search we came across several 20+ meters boats whose asking price was amazingly low (often below much smaller boats!), due to a demand for that type/size of boats which in Italy had dropped like a lead baloon.

Ref. minimum crew requirement, yes, I believe it's an Italian thing to have it in reg papers also for pleasure boats with no commercial registration.
I just mentioned that for reference!

 

[Portofino]

Absolutely. Neither did Aronow, Bertram, Theodoli, etc., in fact.
Easy to figure any of these guys faced with a prospect client pointing out that their boats roll like pigs, and answering along the lines of...
So, what? Buy something else!

They don’t “ roll like pigs “ .They might have a shorter , sharper roll period , but they , Itama are beamier than the competition and you don’t notice any thing @ anchor .Indeed they stop rolling faster than a dumbbell pendulum eq FB or even greater size FB . They have extra wide flat bits , chines , strips , more acreage of surface parallel to the water surface .Moot pount on here but to create lift and thus lift the deep V draggy hull out of the sea at speed .
At rest these flat bits assist in stability .Both at rest and running .Well recognised on NA sites .

If there is any actual hypothetical disadvantage( I don’t feel it btw ) in aggressive roll @ anchor it’s multiple compensated by the other advantages of a true deep V , high dead-rise the seakeeping which isn’t hypocritical it’s real .

Every boats a comprise, stuffs on a spectrum , roll @ anchor is something Itama owners ( suspect Magnum , Etc ) never think about or mention on there brand specific forums .Forums that have 50 % owners and 50 % “ friends “

No body mentions it .Owners or perspective owners .
I very much doubt any owner or perspective having dinner with Amarti trying to convince him to build a boat for him , ever raised the subject .Doubt very much Amarti heard any owner or prospective whinging either .

Its an alien concept to me .They settle quicker .

like all Ferretti products seakeeper is on the option list as is most builders if you are that bothered ?

 

[Hooligan]

Aha, understood - and wholeheartedly agreed.

We saw a few larger boats (up to an 86', no less!) before eventually going for a 56', similar to the Sq58 in size and also in some other ways.
In fact, while as liveaboarder (if such word exists!) the larger spaces were attractive, we feared that we would have soon been fed up by the workload involved, probably needing crew - which we didn't want.
That's the primary reason why eventually we focused on mid-50 footers, also because back in the years of our search we came across several 20+ meters boats whose asking price was amazingly low (often below much smaller boats!), due to a demand for that type/size of boats which in Italy had dropped like a lead baloon.

Ref. minimum crew requirement, yes, I believe it's an Italian thing to have it in reg papers also for pleasure boats with no commercial registration.
I just mentioned that for reference!

TBH it’s a sensible rule re crew. He IK has no rules. The Solent in the summer is like dodgem cars at a fair! The S58 is a great boat. What I love about the 65 other than generally more space is the master cabin. Def helps getting you know who onboard!

 

[markc]

anyway, back to the photos...

 

[jfm]

They don’t “ roll like pigs “ .They might have a shorter , sharper roll period , but they , Itama are beamier than the competition and you don’t notice any thing @ anchor .Indeed they stop rolling faster than a dumbbell pendulum eq FB or even greater size FB . They have extra wide flat bits , chines , strips , more acreage of surface parallel to the water surface .Moot pount on here but to create lift and thus lift the deep V draggy hull out of the sea at speed .
At rest these flat bits assist in stability .Both at rest and running .Well recognised on NA sites .

If there is any actual hypothetical disadvantage( I don’t feel it btw ) in aggressive roll @ anchor it’s multiple compensated by the other advantages of a true deep V , high dead-rise the seakeeping which isn’t hypocritical it’s real .

Every boats a comprise, stuffs on a spectrum , roll @ anchor is something Itama owners ( suspect Magnum , Etc ) never think about or mention on there brand specific forums .Forums that have 50 % owners and 50 % “ friends “

No body mentions it .Owners or perspective owners .
I very much doubt any owner or perspective having dinner with Amarti trying to convince him to build a boat for him , ever raised the subject .Doubt very much Amarti heard any owner or prospective whinging either .

Its an alien concept to me .They settle quicker .

like all Ferretti products seakeeper is on the option list as is most builders if you are that bothered ?

No-one is saying they are bad because of this. It's just physics - they roll faster aotbe, And yes you're right that when the waves or passing wake end, they stop rolling faster (by perhaps a couple of seconds) . It's a compromise - they are good dynamically and run at moderate (not fast) speeds very nicely, even in a chop, and the nice examples look very cool, but you have to pay for all that in terms of at-anchor roll.

Can be cured by a gyro but it needs to be a bigger gyro aotbe because low profile/fast rolling boats are harder to stabilise aotbe.

 

[MapisM]

Itama are beamier than the competition

I don't think so.
I just checked to avoid quoting numbers by heart: the Magnum 53 is one inch beamier than the Itama 54, and the Itama 48 is one inch beamier than the Magnum 45. One could even argue that they are copycat moulds.

Regardless, when you said that deep vee boats are better at bashing waves, I might have argued that this is irrelevant to most boaters, compared to the many other drawbacks of open sportboats, but I never denied that.
If you say they are more stable/comfortable at anchor, well, this is quite simply not true.
And I'm not saying this based on any theoretical design concept, which I couldn't care less about.
Firstly, I did own a few deep vee sportboats myself.
And second, I saw their behaviour while anchored in the same bay, in several occasions.
On this basis, give me a dumbbell flybridge any day of the week, and twice on Sunday.
Jeez, what will you tell us next, that Itamas are better than flybridges for living aboard?!?

 

[MapisM]

anyway, back to the photos...

At risk of appearing picky, I hope you don't mind my curiosity about those tiny holes in the stanchion in foreground...

 

[jfm]

I don't think so.
I just checked to avoid quoting numbers by heart: the Magnum 53 is one inch beamier than the Itama 54, and the Itama 48 is one inch beamier than the Magnum 45. One could even argue that they are copycat moulds.

Regardless, when you said that deep vee boats are better at bashing waves, I might have argued that this is irrelevant to most boaters, compared to the many other drawbacks of open sportboats, but I never denied that.
If you say they are more stable/comfortable at anchor, well, this is quite simply not true.
And I'm not saying this based on any theoretical design concept, which I couldn't care less about.
Firstly, I did own a few deep vee sportboats myself.
And second, I saw their behaviour while anchored in the same bay, in several occasions.
On this basis, give me a dumbbell flybridge any day of the week, and twice on Sunday.
Jeez, what will you tell us next, that Itamas are better than flybridges for living aboard?!?

Itamas are beamy?
Itama 48 = 14.6m (no pulpit, and including aft platform) x 4.2m
Fairline phantom 48 = 14.95 (without pulpit and including aft platform) x 4.27

 

[mcanderson]

waking up photo

 

[Portofino]

Itamas are beamy?
Itama 48 = 14.6m (no pulpit, and including aft platform) x 4.2m
Fairline phantom 48 = 14.95 (without pulpit and including aft platform) x 4.27

Compared to there peers other true deep V * Magnums , the stuff Aronow made .A Itama 46 is ( 3 - berth cabins ) about irrc 4.46 m beam at the hull about a foot wider or more than the eq Magnum .

The eq Magnum to mine the 40/45 is 3.95 m beam .

* where the definition of a true deep V is north of 20 degree deadrise .

 

[Portofino]

Anyway back to pic s .
Although not the SoF , I was based there 10 yrs and roamed about to Marseille- Genoa - Corsica - Elba .The Liguria where we are currently based is a lot calmer sea state wise .
Ironic I know as it was the ever changing seas , the buggeration getting back to the home port around Cannes / St Trop / Cap Ferat that drove us to find a more capable hull that could tackle them .This was sans Mistrals .

Its still handy the seakeeping thingy but rarer where .The cruise speed 100 miles in 3 hrs is always handy .

Yesterday




Sorry about the pic angles taken on phone then later airdropped via marina wifi ( which is excellent btw ) to I pad .

 

[markc]

At risk of appearing picky, I hope you don't mind my curiosity about those tiny holes in the stanchion in foreground...

Ha, never noticed them before! I just had a look and from outside the holes are angled upwards, so am thinking some kind of weep hole?

 

[Portofino]

I don't think so.
I just checked to avoid quoting numbers by heart: the Magnum 53 is one inch beamier than the Itama 54, and the Itama 48 is one inch beamier than the Magnum 45. One could even argue that they are copycat moulds.

Regardless, when you said that deep vee boats are better at bashing waves, I might have argued that this is irrelevant to most boaters, compared to the many other drawbacks of open sportboats, but I never denied that.
If you say they are more stable/comfortable at anchor, well, this is quite simply not true.
And I'm not saying this based on any theoretical design concept, which I couldn't care less about.
Firstly, I did own a few deep vee sportboats myself.
And second, I saw their behaviour while anchored in the same bay, in several occasions.
On this basis, give me a dumbbell flybridge any day of the week, and twice on Sunday.
Jeez, what will you tell us next, that Itamas are better than flybridges for living aboard?!?

No point getting drawn into an argument , an argument you try you best to ignite of FB vs sports vs anything else boat .
Or yet again derailing threads delving into the finer nuances of NA .

I did not bring up stab @ anchor , nor rose to the bate of the initial Mcanderson pic of a Itama @ anchor of St Jean .A place I have visited many times btw .
As I said its none issue .

The guy launching his tender from the 55 ft rib in the pic above ……run along and slag his boat off .Plenty for you to go at there .He spends a season boating full time just like you with it .But he has the luxury of returning to a huge sea front villa in Alasso .

 

[MapisM]

The guy launching his tender from the 55 ft rib in the pic above ……run along and slag his boat off .Plenty for you to go at there.
He spends a season boating full time just like you with it. But he has the luxury of returning to a huge sea front villa in Alasso.

Each to their own, but assuming Alassio is what you mean by Alasso, I know exactly how the place looks like, and trust me, I'm not one bit envious of any villa he might have there.
Nor of his RIB boating, not to mention his (and yours!) boating grounds.
You know, there's plenty of people coming to Sardinia from just about anywhere in Liguria during the summer.
But I've yet to come across one single boater based down here who can't wait to head north and visit Liguria whenever they can.
There must be some reasons, I reckon.

Oh, and ref. "derailing threads delving into the finer nuances of NA", I hope what you actually imply is that you feel guilty as charged about it.
In fact, I can't think of anyone else who posted a pic of themselves onboard, while reading a book on naval architecture!
Me, I even wrote in my previous post (literally!) that I couldn't care less about about any theoretical design concept - go figure.

 

[Chris H]

Have to say, we are in our second season in Liguria but we will be rolling about on anchor, probably around Villifranche later today and towards Antibes and then st tropez !

 

[benjenbav]

We had a house in SoF for many years. I used to love the place - so beautiful; wonderful light. But the weather didn’t suit me too much (too hot for a pale north European - it must be my Scottish reiver antecedents ), plus the coast is a little bit too busy in the high season for me. But am loving the pix on this thread.