bowler
Well-Known Member
A folder full of paperwork. Plus, if private, a seller who clearly knows the boat inside and out is a good sign.
Tips to Spot a Boat Scammer
- Thread starter FattyStan
- Start date
Hot Property
Well-Known Member
At 21 ft I'd be looking at outboard powered boats. Particularly if you are keeping it in the water.
Modern 4 stroke EFI engines are reliable, fuel efficient and easy to maintain.
An inboard engine with stern drive is equivalent to having 2 engines to maintain - avoid unless you are in the industry and are skilled enough to maintain it.
There's a reason American stern drive boats are generally cheap!
Modern 4 stroke EFI engines are reliable, fuel efficient and easy to maintain.
An inboard engine with stern drive is equivalent to having 2 engines to maintain - avoid unless you are in the industry and are skilled enough to maintain it.
There's a reason American stern drive boats are generally cheap!
Seastoke
Well-Known Member
If you mentioned your budget it might help
just google , if you said budget , we could all help more most would recommend diesel, or if petrol boat with out board .
gjgm
Well-Known Member
He did mention he was leaning towards a 1998 USA sportsboat, which will certainly be inboard and will not be diesel!
Neil1300r
Well-Known Member
Was looking for our first boat 2 years ago. Looked at 10+ boats with brokers. The thought being it was safer going through a broker as its a lot of money to just hand directly to an owner. Most boats looked like they had been adondoned with the brokers in the hope they would eventually sell. Found one that looked perfect through a brokers, put a deposit on it. Had it surveyed and checked by a Volvo Penta specialist. It failed the survey for a number of reasons. Brokers agreed to return the deposit, which got painful getting them to actually return the money. Numerous calls, emails, which they kept ignoring. Eventually got the deposit back.
In the meantime saw an advert but, a private seller. I wasn't keen to even view it because it was a private seller. Painful enough dealing with a broker. Viewed the boat, wife loved it and the seller was very helpful, pointed out all the work he had done, had a genuine reason to be selling (health issues) and had stacks of paperwork, invoices going back years. Went away to think about it and look at another boat at a brokers, which he couldn't even get the engine hatch to open ( why do people abandon boats with brokers in need of work?)
Wife is fed up with looking at rubbish so says she wants the boat with the private seller, to be fair it'sher moneybut now my responsibility. Looked at how to do it, downloaded from the RYA a contract for purchase. Went to see the boat again and face to face agree with the owner how to do the purchase, the price and deposit, surveys etc. He was happy to use the RYA contract but offered to go through a solicitor if required.
Got the boat surveyed, a few things were picked up which the seller fixed at his expense. Paid for the boat whilst sat on it with owner. He saw the money being transferred, both of us happy, handshakes all round.
So, buying privately can work, but needs the right seller, the right paperwork, and some trust from both sides
In the meantime saw an advert but, a private seller. I wasn't keen to even view it because it was a private seller. Painful enough dealing with a broker. Viewed the boat, wife loved it and the seller was very helpful, pointed out all the work he had done, had a genuine reason to be selling (health issues) and had stacks of paperwork, invoices going back years. Went away to think about it and look at another boat at a brokers, which he couldn't even get the engine hatch to open ( why do people abandon boats with brokers in need of work?)
Wife is fed up with looking at rubbish so says she wants the boat with the private seller, to be fair it'sher moneybut now my responsibility. Looked at how to do it, downloaded from the RYA a contract for purchase. Went to see the boat again and face to face agree with the owner how to do the purchase, the price and deposit, surveys etc. He was happy to use the RYA contract but offered to go through a solicitor if required.
Got the boat surveyed, a few things were picked up which the seller fixed at his expense. Paid for the boat whilst sat on it with owner. He saw the money being transferred, both of us happy, handshakes all round.
So, buying privately can work, but needs the right seller, the right paperwork, and some trust from both sides
FattyStan
New Member
Yes I did. Although, a diesel is definitely preferred. All the boats I’ve been finding seem to mostly be inboard which is frustrating. I’m not set on a particular brand to be fair. My budget is £15-£20k, length no bigger than 8m, thats ideally a 4 berth, but 2 would be ok. As long as the important parts are working I don’t mind refurbing anything else, such as interiors etc as I have contacts for all that. I’m still very actively searching and won’t rush into it. Thank for the help guys!
FattyStan
New Member
I love this! This is exactly where I’m at! I have so many tabs open on my Mac! I’ve certainly been doing my research! The RYA contract is a must for me too. I’ve already checked that through, so I’ll be using that if needed! Thanks for your advice. I hope you are enjoying your boat
Neil1300r
Well-Known Member
Moody says hello. We are loving her. Good luck with the search and hopefully buyingI love this! This is exactly where I’m at! I have so many tabs open on my Mac! I’ve certainly been doing my research! The RYA contract is a must for me too. I’ve already checked that through, so I’ll be using that if needed! Thanks for your advice. I hope you are enjoying your boat
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spannerman
Well-Known Member
I get to work on a lot of inboard powered boats and have run Mercruisers for 30 yrs, there are several things to check, one is that the drive shaft bellows on the drive have been replaced at 5 yr intervals, and check the exhaust manifolds and risers when the engine is hot especially if its just seawater cooled as these rust internally and get blocked. You should be able to place your hand on the riser without it being uncomfortably hot, if it is very hot there is a restriction in the manifold or riser and these aren’t cheap to replace. The other thing to check is that it goes in and out of gear without stalling otherwise the gear wire down to the drive needs replacing and setting up correctly. These can be bargaining points but if its your first boat I would recommend having someone with you on the test drive who knows these engines and can identify any problems.
Hot Property
Well-Known Member
Which is why it can be expensive to maintain inboards and out drives.
Unless you like maintaining and fixing boats I'd recommend outboards up to say a 24 ft boat.
As this will be kept on the water, fouling on the drive will be high, an outboard leg rises clear of water and the only item subject to fouling is the bottom bracket which has little effect on performance.
Boats up to 40 ft are now being fitted with outboards, it's the future.....
Seastoke
Well-Known Member
There is a nice S24 ,just come on the market today at Chertsey 17k
gjgm
Well-Known Member
I dont think that there is an agreed cut off in length, but the last thing you want in a smaller sports boat is a diesel engine.
Personally ,24ft petrol is still ok; 28ft should be probably be diesel. Cross over is in the middle!
If you are looking at a different type of boat altogether , the above might change.
Somewhere you will start coming across twin engines. Just remember that also means twice the problems and bills
Little Ricky
Well-Known Member
Buying through a broker is for the same reason that actors have an agent, boat owners are usually rubbish negotiators, because they have too much love and emotion tied up in their boat. A broker will sell boats for a living, so I recomend using a broker. However, in your case looking at a 28 year old boat, I'd suspect, no offense meant, that it wont be on a brokers books so obviously there will be issues on such and old boat.
ontheplane
Well-Known Member
Brokers seem happy to take anything now - poor quality, neglected and 30 years old… if they can charge for selling it….
There is one broker (who shall remain nameless) advertising a 1995 boat as “lovingly cared for and maintained with much money recently spent) where the last lift and service was 2022 and nothing spent since or any sign it’s been used….
So don’t assume that route gets you a better or even a more honestly described boat!
There is one broker (who shall remain nameless) advertising a 1995 boat as “lovingly cared for and maintained with much money recently spent) where the last lift and service was 2022 and nothing spent since or any sign it’s been used….
So don’t assume that route gets you a better or even a more honestly described boat!
Little Ricky
Well-Known Member
If thats true, thats silly on the brokers part. Imagine the miriad phone calls he'd get after delivery because x y and z have all gone wrong on the boat.
ontheplane
Well-Known Member
Won’t matter to some brokers - they are merely middle men - they have extensive “get outs” and make it clear they are only brokers of the deal - they don’t sell anything and which is why they are clear they just put sellers and buyers together.
They don’t own the products they sell and unless the description was materially wrong then you have zero comeback on the brokers. In fact you would have a little more comeback if you bought directly from the seller (albeit not much)…
What has surprised me in my current search is that brokers sometimes don’t seem all that keen to secure a sale - I think sometimes sellers are unrealistic and they know the seller is - it’s almost like they just want to have more listings even if they don’t think the boat is worth what the seller is asking.
They don’t own the products they sell and unless the description was materially wrong then you have zero comeback on the brokers. In fact you would have a little more comeback if you bought directly from the seller (albeit not much)…
What has surprised me in my current search is that brokers sometimes don’t seem all that keen to secure a sale - I think sometimes sellers are unrealistic and they know the seller is - it’s almost like they just want to have more listings even if they don’t think the boat is worth what the seller is asking.
ontheplane
Well-Known Member
In this particular case it won’t get as far as “after handover” - the boat looks sort of ok but the minute you power it up you find few of the switches or gauges actually work and as mentioned the service history is seriously lacking! Not sure it will ever get to “handover” stage…
aerobat
Well-Known Member
I,m wondering a 21ft 1998 boat goes thru a broker . Mostly such boats are on a private market .
I disagree with the diesel and partly disagree with the outboard .
Diesels on a 21footer planing hull are rare . Whatkind of boat should be a ~200hp diesel in a 21 footer ?
And even if , there is a doubt if he logs enough hours to compensate for the price difference and in any way higher maintanance costs .
Outboards are nice , but a really fresh 200hp EFI will probably burst the budget . An older 200hp outboard might get as problematic as an inboard and may be just tired / low conpression as well
Look for :
- no freeze cracked block . After an extensive ride no water in engine oil .
-hull osmosis or hidden collision damage ? . Careful with a fresh and shiny antifouling
-check for water in drive
Needless to say the engine should run fine and no unusal noises from engine or drive . You should generally have a good feeling with the boat and the seller . If the seller refuses to reasonable requests like an extensive test ride or haul out for underwater inspection ... walk with a smile . There are tons of boats in your size and budget range !
If really new to the business consider asking a local boat mechanic to benprrsent during the visit . You might get lucky and he will help you for small money , worth a try.
When you sign the contract take your time for the full paperwork , no "shake hands" verbal deal .
I disagree with the diesel and partly disagree with the outboard .
Diesels on a 21footer planing hull are rare . Whatkind of boat should be a ~200hp diesel in a 21 footer ?
And even if , there is a doubt if he logs enough hours to compensate for the price difference and in any way higher maintanance costs .
Outboards are nice , but a really fresh 200hp EFI will probably burst the budget . An older 200hp outboard might get as problematic as an inboard and may be just tired / low conpression as well
Look for :
- no freeze cracked block . After an extensive ride no water in engine oil .
-hull osmosis or hidden collision damage ? . Careful with a fresh and shiny antifouling
-check for water in drive
Needless to say the engine should run fine and no unusal noises from engine or drive . You should generally have a good feeling with the boat and the seller . If the seller refuses to reasonable requests like an extensive test ride or haul out for underwater inspection ... walk with a smile . There are tons of boats in your size and budget range !
If really new to the business consider asking a local boat mechanic to benprrsent during the visit . You might get lucky and he will help you for small money , worth a try.
When you sign the contract take your time for the full paperwork , no "shake hands" verbal deal .
Purple Velvet
Well-Known Member
osmosis /ŏz-mō′sĭs, ŏs-/
noun
- Diffusion of fluid through a semipermeable membrane from a solution with a low solute concentration to a solution with a higher solute concentration until there is an equal solute concentration on both sides of the membrane.
- The tendency of fluids to diffuse in such a manner.
