Why do UK Raggies Always Fall Overboard?

[MainlySteam]

Well that is the conclusion I come to reading the UK Yachting Mag's.

For example, have just gotten down to reading the December PBO (just appeared out here 2 weeks ago and I have been away) and on the cover is the photo for the "Round Britain on a Budget" cover story. Very calm sea, grey day but no rain in sight but here we are in all our wet weather gear, boots, life jacket and all tethered to the jackstays.

Ok I thought but then I recall there is a common theme here as I recall the same in YM too - for example, sailing photos of group at sailing school bright calm sunny day and all done up with all the gear plus, I suspect, multi tools, personal flares, lights, whistles, etc secluded about the body in places the photos do not pry. How can they enjoy a day's calm sailing and tuition while dressed as if disaster and accidental immersion was an everyday occurance for the average sailor I remember thinking?

So I set out through the PBO and first address the cover story - and I see always dressed for the roaring 40's, always calm conditions and even tethered when down below at the chart table which is something really new to me. Do not misunderstand me, I am not having a go at the author, surely it is just to show how he was prepared. But is that so, because then at the start of the mag there is the reader's photo, bright calm sunset time in the Channel - same, all the gear on as if it was a force 9 and sea state to match. Progressing through, limiting examination to the photos large enough to assess, a pleasant surprise as I spy a lady in only a dress in the cockpit of a yacht, but no, that one is in the Med. Another crew in shorts and sunhats, but no that one is in the Indian Ocean. And so it goes on - over dressed and personally over equipped, that photo is in UK, otherwise the photo is elsewhere.

Got to the rear cover and ahhhh here we are a race boat in the Raymarine ad, at speed, etc and looks like he has just got a jacket on, looks like no tether and none of the all the other gear either. Looks about right for the situation. But no, it is Brad Van Liew, an American, in the Hilfiger Open 50.

So the theme is - photos of UK crews in UK waters, all the gear on and I bet they need to be tethered cause they will sink like stones if they go over the side. All photos outside of UK waters, including racy ones, crews in just what is necessary for the particular conditions.

Why? Do you fall over the side all the time over there, is it the result of a finger wagging social engineering government, or does the weather and sea change from dead calm to Cape Horn storm faster than you can get your gear on?

Or do the magazines make a mockery of reality?

Wonderingly but not cuttingly

John


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[Ric]

Yes but whenever the British mags show somebody on a boat that isn't dressed up like Noddy rounding Cape Horn, they get a realm of angry reader's letters from places like East Cheam demanding to know why they didn't have their lifejackets and harnesses on, blah blah don't you know the sea is dangerous etc, and why there isn't a S&R helicopter permanently hovering in the background of every photo.

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[Robin]

It is boaty form of political correctness I believe. Put a picture in the magazines of someone not wearing a lifejacket and/or harness and just watch the letters to the editor columns next month! The compensation culture 'sue for miles' has arrived too. With this backgound the Sailing Schools cannot fail to add their shove to the snowball rolling down the hill!

I will get well and truly flamed for this BUT:-

I cannot remember when we last wore lifejackets. I think it was when we bought a sailboard and had to relearn how to do it (didn't really succeed!) and those were actually buoyancy aids not lifejackets.

We have combined lifejackets & harnesses, fully automatic top of the range ones too. I see them each year when they are checked over pre-season.

We did have heavy Roaring Forties wet weather gear, built in harnesses etc, as supplied to RTW racers. They were so hot and cumbersome and took ages to dry the furry pockets/collars so we bought lighter gear to use, even in a British summer.
These were eventually replaced with very nice soft PVC gear at about one third the cost. No street cred of course but we can hose the salt off, dry them and put them away to stay mildew free very quickly.

We do have a couple of those multi-tool thingies, one is kept in the grab bag for the liferaft, the other in a holster strapped on deck. Neither have ever been used. We do not have knife/pliers/marlin spike kits on our belts though.

We WOULD use the kit if conditions justified or if either of us felt the need. There are no set conditions for when to use it, even at night and mostly these days we try and avoid those kind of conditions. We actually managed to sail 2000mls last season without needing to wear even wet weather gear!

I will now stand by and await heavy incoming.....

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[oldharry]

Ah well ... you have obviously never sailed in the UK! It may well have been a bright calm sunny day when the picture was taken. What you dont see is what the weather did 5 minutes later - F9, horizontal rain, and a temperature drop of 30degrees.

And thats just an ordinary English summers afternoon: now when the weather here gets REALLY bad.....

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[Magic_Sailor]

A point well made...

....except for that word "gotten" /forums/images/icons/smile.gif

What is that then? /forums/images/icons/smile.gif /forums/images/icons/smile.gif

Magic

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[MainlySteam]

Re: \"Gotten\"...

past participle of "get", commonly found in the fouly mouths of us folks living anywhere in the so called English speaking world from a little to the west of Dingle then westwards around the world to a little east of Great Yarmouth I think /forums/images/icons/smile.gif.

John

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[pugwash]

Re: "Gotten"...

Not really. Gotten is distinctively American but British people including far-flung colonials often get it wrong. It is not simply an alternative to "have got" (see Cambridge Encyclopaedia of English Language). They've gotten a new boat (obtained). They've gotten interested (become). He's gotten off the chair (moved). But not in the sense of possession. Not: I've gotten the answer. Not: I've gotten plenty.

It seems you have used it correctly here. Speaking as a long-ago-kiwi-cum-Pom I think it's ugly usage but I've gotten accustomed to it.

Apart from all that, remember the stink a couple of years ago when one of the mags, I think PBO, had a colour picture of a family picnicking in their cockpit at a calm anchorage and one of the kids was not in a lifejacket. Hell of a fuss. We've all gotten too sensitive.

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[graham]

Yachtie Mags dont reflect real life all the time.

Personally I never critiscise anyone for wearing safety gear even if I dont allways.

What the pics dont show is the temperature,the sun may be out but it could still be pretty cold at the start of our sailing season.Definitely not shorts and Tshirts weather.

Also sea temperature puts a different perspective on a dipping!!

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[Evadne]

No sign of you getting flamed, so I guess, like you and most other sailors we see, we dress according to the weather. Wet weather gear if it's wet and a harness if its lumpy and I need leave the cockpit to do something other than make the tea. As I am a wimp and SWMBO gets seasick we try not to go out in the sort of weather that requires heavy weather clothing, although we seem to come back in it often enough.


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[Magic_Sailor]

I think..

I've gotten the meaning of gotten! /forums/images/icons/smile.gif

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[Sans Bateau]

Re: I think..

One has 10 is'nt it, as, I have ten pounds etc, gotten got_ ten or has 10...

No, sorry, have I joined in a bit late.....

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[FlyingSpud]

Re: \"Gotten\"...

I agree about the fact that we rarely need all the gear on.

But, isn’t it slightly different when you are single-handed? Particularly if the boat is being steered by autopilot? After all, if you do fall in the oggin, just through clumsiness, unless you are Mark Spitz, you are unlikely to catch the boat up as it sails away from you. Isn’t it thought that this is what happened to Eric Tarbaly?


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[uke73]

I had a pretty similar view point myself until yesterday. My ex-girlfriend (who is a Police Officer in Portsmouth) spent most of yesterday baby siting two corpses washed up on the beach (father and son I think) after their small fishing boat capsized. Neither had been wearing life jackets.

I think Arthur Ransome summed it up quite well:

Better drowned than duffers, if not duffers will not drown

I'll be wearing my life jacket all the time this season, that's for sure!!

Cheers all,

Neil


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[Robin]

Give them time!

I have never been a lifejacket fan, preferring to stay on board unless wanting a swim. Harness use declined too when roller headsails arrived and on the previous boat we had a rough weather option of mizzen/jib, mostly no need to go on deck to reef the main. Our current boat has roller reefing, plus slab reefing on the main with all 3 slabs done from the cockpit. Our cockpit is pretty protected too with a large hood with extra handrails, as well as a full gantry carrying the solar panel, wind genny & radar which acts like a 'roll cage' over the wheel/helmsman. As a result we rarely feel the need for harnesses either, BUT if we do they are easily available at the foot of the companionway and have lifejackets included.

I started sailing in 1962 as a teenager on a Bristol Channel Pilot Cutter with OYC, on the Tall Ships Race. The 'lifejackets' were old kapok ships stuff and probably wouldn't have floated themselves! We had 2 full gales (spent hove to) and solid water over the decks was a feature of the boat! You learned very quickly to have one hand for yourself, the other for the ship! Lord knows what would be said nowadays if a group of non sailing teenies were taken out like that...

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[ChrisE]

I'd go along with most of what you say, except for night sailing when we have one of the few rules that we always enforce - always wear lifejackets and harnesses. Liz and I sail as a pair for both long and short distances and neither of us wants to come up onto deck to find only the windvane on duty.

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[Mirelle]

Two thoughts, really

Some years ago I went for a cruise up the east coast on a friend's nice old boat, with my sister as well as the owner. I still have a mental picture, but, alas, no photo, of the owner at the helm in a bikini with my sister sitting next to her togged up in Mustos and lifejacket - a classic case of "one of them must be right".

Five minutes later the weather my sister was expecting arrived!

Secondly, I have fished my 9 year old son out of the water once a season without fail since he was 4. He's always been clipped on - so far

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[Jools_of_Top_Cat]

Agreed. We have the same rule and if on deck alone wear a harness.

If I went over while SWMBO was making a brew for instance the boat could travel a long way in 5 minutes if I went over for a swim. Even on a sunny day this is a disasterous scenario. Though to be fair, if I really need to leave the cockpit I will wait until she is back up from the galley.

At night it is no compromise, leave the cockpit - wear jacket and clip on. Obviously in poor weather this rule also applies.

<hr width=100% size=1>Julian

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[Peppermint]

Re: If

you study Sea Survival in GB waters you'd either wear more gear or retire from sailing and sit on a hill. The water never gets warm enough to take your survival, if you fall in, for granted.

Gear we wear is amazing stuff that is light and not to burdensom so why not wear it. It is rare to be too hot while at sea in UK waters and you'd die feeling a prat if you fell in without lifejacket or being hooked on

There really are few days in my offshore sailing career where I've thought that shorts and a teeshirt were the rig of the day and even fewer were it was suitable all day. We often have very changeable conditions.

Yachting magazines tend to work outside reality because reality is dull. But they do reflect reality to some extent. British yotties wear cloths but when the editorial team go on one of these exotic jollies they wear shorts.

Of course we are all moon coloured, except for our ruddy faces, and ten minutes exposure to the sun/wind is more than enough for your average anglo saxon.

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[MainlySteam]

Thanks for the comments everyone - most seem to be a bit more relaxed than the photos in the magazines infer.

Our own practice is pretty close to Robins I have to say and that would also match the practices of most who I know. Things we do make a point of doing are that outside of sheltered waters no one goes on deck unless there is someone else in the cockpit (perhaps to wave goodbye?), we always carry lifejackets in the small hard dinghy (but only wear them when the waves look about to surmount its freeboard, which we find is a good incentive to put them on), and we try to remember to lower the bottom section of the transom boarding ladder down into the sea if we are anchored in one place for long or using the dinghy so's anyone falling in can get on board (and we always forget to raise it again before we sail off after /forums/images/icons/blush.gif).

On our own yacht I have only ever worn a lifejacket as a consequence of their serving as our harnesses as well (which is not often), and even then I am not too embarassed to crawl along the deck instead of walking, preferring not to fall in in the first place. I can quite imagine that being different if on a smaller vessel as a couple of weekends ago I stepped on board a friends 24 footer and just about went for a swim - had forgotten how tippy they can be. And, finally, if anyone can work out a way to fall or get washed out of our cockpit into the sea they deserve to suffer the consequences so we are pretty careless in there unless it is likely to be really rolly.

John


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[yachtcharisma]

Having started off sailing singlehanded most of the time I've always clipped on when underway, even in calm water. Thinking about how I'd feel in the water with the boat sailing off without me made the decision fairly easy. And since having a lifejacket as part of the harness didn't make it significantly more cumbersome to wear, I have a combined lifejacket and harness.

Now I sail with my family and still keep the old routine, partly because I now feel comfortable with it, partly to try and minimise difficulties for my other half if I did fall over, and partly as it seems unfair on the kids if the same rule doesn't apply to everyone. And as Mirelle said, I'm sure the kids will fall over occasionally, and if they're wearing a harness it turns a potential disaster into a minor learning experience.

But its really the harness I think is important, not the lifejacket.

Cheers
Patrick

<hr width=100% size=1>Sailing a Victoire 25 on the Scottish West Coast