Which sub 37 ft yacht to cross the North Atlantic in?

[doug748]

Does anybody have a list of the models that finished and didn't finish the 79 Fastnet?

I think there is an appendix at the back of "Left for Dead" that gives the details of all the boats and their outcomes, if it isn't that one it's one of the other classic Fastnet 79 books.

There is a list at the back of Bob Fisher's: Fastnet and After, but it only gives the Name, Owners Name, Racing Class, Rating and Finishing / Corrected Time / Status of each boat.
The model design of each boat will be in a filing cabinet somewhere but I don't think it was ever compiled and published.
In truth there were very few finishers, in the smallest three classes ( with a nominal LOA of around 30ft to 36ft) only 13 out of 180 boats.

 

[Kurrawong_Kid]

Oyster Heritage 37

Wheel steered! But otherwise fits the spec. and many have.

 

[chrishelen]

I reckon people get too picky over stuff that is simply unimportant. It's only three weeks.

Have been across and back twice in my 1977 moody 33 with no drama. Enjoyed it more than some other yachts I ve been paid to take across or back.

If you put too many limits on it, chances are you will never go???

Totally agree. Two years ago in jolly harbour antigua there was a guy in a westerly centaur, he sailed across from Germany in six weeks. No drama.

 

[thecommander]

So a whale hits a Vancouver 36 or a Rustler 36. What happens? Asking for a mate.

 

[adwuk]

I think it depends on how determined the whale is.

 

[E39mad]

So a whale hits a Vancouver 36 or a Rustler 36. What happens? Asking for a mate.

Assuming you mean an underwater hit the keel is fully encapsulated on both iirc and the rudder on the Vancouver has a full skeg whilst I think the Rustlers is directly behind the keel. I would like to think both would survive but the Vancouver is a bigger and heavier boat (the Vancouver 34 has similar weight and internal volume to the Rustler 36) .

 

[Tranona]

So a whale hits a Vancouver 36 or a Rustler 36. What happens? Asking for a mate.

Impossible to predict as there are too many variables and not enough empirical data to even hazard a guess. However, one of the claimed advantages of encapsulated keels is that they are more difficult to rupture. BUT that property depends on them being built properly and more importantly, particularly if the ballast is iron retained integrity over the years. There have been examples of keels splitting, particularly if the hull was moulded in two halves and joined together - common at the time as the only way of making moulded hulls with tumblehome.

Not sure any method of construction is 100% secure against rupture from either whales or any other big hard bits you might encounter at sea. There are obvious trends that lead to a reasonable conclusion that some are potentially more secure than others, but you only have to look at the thread about the sinking yesterday of an HR 48 by a whale to know that even with what one might call one of the more robust designs one is still vulnerable if in the wrong place at the wrong time.

 

[geem]

Impossible to predict as there are too many variables and not enough empirical data to even hazard a guess. However, one of the claimed advantages of encapsulated keels is that they are more difficult to rupture. BUT that property depends on them being built properly and more importantly, particularly if the ballast is iron retained integrity over the years. There have been examples of keels splitting, particularly if the hull was moulded in two halves and joined together - common at the time as the only way of making moulded hulls with tumblehome.

Not sure any method of construction is 100% secure against rupture from either whales or any other big hard bits you might encounter at sea. There are obvious trends that lead to a reasonable conclusion that some are potentially more secure than others, but you only have to look at the thread about the sinking yesterday of an HR 48 by a whale to know that even with what one might call one of the more robust designs one is still vulnerable if in the wrong place at the wrong time.

I believe the keel on the HR 48 was bolt on lead. Probably the most robust bolt on keel in the business but not whale proof. The connection detail from the outside looks considerable ( i am looking at one now) but I guess the potential loads involved in a whale hit are substantial and far greater than the keel bolts could withstand

 

[Deleted member 36384]

So a whale hits a Vancouver 36 or a Rustler 36. What happens? Asking for a mate.

A worm hole is created that transports the whale to the same position in space but 60 seconds later thus allowing a fantastic opportunity to photograph a breaching whale astern. It's why they command a premium price, don't you know?

 

[Tranona]

I believe the keel on the HR 48 was bolt on lead. Probably the most robust bolt on keel in the business but not whale proof. The connection detail from the outside looks considerable ( i am looking at one now) but I guess the potential loads involved in a whale hit are substantial and far greater than the keel bolts could withstand

Doubt it was the keel bolts. Despite the robust construction expect it was degradation of the surrounding laminate. Safety margins are huge on the bolts, and measurable, unlike the bits they hold together.

Of course it is not known how the impact occurred, but sideways would probably be the most vulnerable as the fulcrum point in that plane is narrow compared with a bow on collision.

 

[geem]

Doubt it was the keel bolts. Despite the robust construction expect it was degradation of the surrounding laminate. Safety margins are huge on the bolts, and measurable, unlike the bits they hold together.

Of course it is not known how the impact occurred, but sideways would probably be the most vulnerable as the fulcrum point in that plane is narrow compared with a bow on collision.

Have you seen the HR48 stub arrangement? It does look strong. Very large surface area. Surely sideways impact would have been relatively low speed and the yacht could heel to reduce stresses. Head on impact would be higher speed and nowhere for the force to dissipate other than at weakest point, presumably the bolt on keel junction, but this is all conjecture. We really dont know what happened and I guess we wont know unless the skipper does and tells all

 

[ianj99]

A worm hole is created that transports the whale to the same position in space but 60 seconds later thus allowing a fantastic opportunity to photograph a breaching whale astern. It's why they command a premium price, don't you know?

As it happens I have some wormhole generators for sale, buyer to collect from P3x57. £1x10^6 each

 

[Tranona]

Have you seen the HR48 stub arrangement? It does look strong. Very large surface area. Surely sideways impact would have been relatively low speed and the yacht could heel to reduce stresses. Head on impact would be higher speed and nowhere for the force to dissipate other than at weakest point, presumably the bolt on keel junction, but this is all conjecture. We really dont know what happened and I guess we wont know unless the skipper does and tells all

Yes, I have - but it is designed to take bows on and is strongest in that plane. We have no idea how fast the whale was going, but the area of the side of the keel is a much greater proportion of the width than the front is in proportion to the length - hence my comment about the fulcrum point. See JD's comments on the other thread which say essentially the same.

While the owner's observations will be very useful, without the remains of the boat to inspect there will always be an element of guesswork.

 

[thecommander]

He's talking about buying something with a collision bulkhead at least 15% of the LOA from the bow. I doubt many sub 37ft boats on the market will have this? Serious $$ to fit one I'm guessing and it would negatively effect the residual value of the yacht?

 

[sniffyjenkins]

He's talking about buying something with a collision bulkhead at least 15% of the LOA from the bow. I doubt many sub 37ft boats on the market will have this? Serious $$ to fit one I'm guessing and it would negatively effect the residual value of the yacht?

Serious kit. The amazing and brilliant Susie Goodall is having that fitted on her Rustler 36 for the Golden Globe race. For an around the world singlehanded non-stop race it makes sense but gawd knows how much it's costing.

 

[Deleted member 36384]

Serious kit. The amazing and brilliant Susie Goodall is having that fitted on her Rustler 36 for the Golden Globe race. For an around the world singlehanded non-stop race it makes sense but gawd knows how much it's costing.

She might be breaking the rules then.

A full standard spec interior layout must also be fitted.

Actually, reading in the detail now they say this: -

you can add and strengthen, even put extra watertight bulkheads..but yes the plan to leave all original is to level the sailing field a

Hence, the original comment is wrong.

 

[Motor_Sailor]

She might be breaking the rules then.

You need to read the rest of the rules - some form of water tight partition up forward is a requirement.

 

[Deleted member 36384]

You need to read the rest of the rules - some form of water tight partition up forward is a requirement.

Yes, thanks, I read on and noticed that I was wrong.

 

[Sybarite]

Assuming you mean an underwater hit the keel is fully encapsulated on both iirc and the rudder on the Vancouver has a full skeg whilst I think the Rustlers is directly behind the keel. I would like to think both would survive but the Vancouver is a bigger and heavier boat (the Vancouver 34 has similar weight and internal volume to the Rustler 36) .

The late Philippe Harlé who was one of France's leading marine architects used to say that a skeg on a boat was a nonsense. If it took a hit it could block the rudder whereas if a spade rudder takes a hit even with the stock bent the rudder might still function.

He designed my Feeling 920.

 

[Sybarite]

Oh no!

You've got me humming that bloody tune again...

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"It sails through icebergs like butter through a knife...."

Hmm....?