We have a leak

[LittleSister]

I am at least 14 hours motoring from anywhere I can lift out

Is it likely to fail if I just sit here on this mooring?

I don't know Tiree, but it looks from photos/maps that there might be drying or part- drying small harbours where you could dry out against a wall, or sand beaches where you might be able to careen the boat to gain external access. (I know it may well look very different there in real life.)

Personally, I very much doubt it will fail if not pushed and pulled about from inside. I think it is more likely the sealant has failed, as you suspect, than the whole thing is falling to bits in place (not that I'm saying this could never happen).

You can't stay awake forever, so get some sleep while the going's good.

I would need to get a new unit to fit first, so need to get the boat back to home waters.

Do they not have postal deliveries on Tiree? (Maps indicate a ferry service. )

Update - there is a daily ferry service, so presumably also daily post.

 

[Tanqueray]

When you say "fall apart in my hands" what exactly do you mean?

I am at least 14 hours motoring from anywhere I can lift out and am now led to believe by the doom and gloom merchants on here that the unit could just fail at any second and sink the boat.

Is it likely to fail if I just sit here on this mooring?

Why is reinforcing it with waterproof epoxy more likely to make it fail?

I need some practical advice... I need to make the boat safe to sail home so I can fix the problem. At the moment I am scared to go to sleep in case I wake up awash.

- W

How big a 'compartment' is the fitting in Webby? Are you able to 'box' it in (perhaps by screwing down the cabin sole above it and blocking any limber holes? You don't have to stop the leak (if it did go) - you just have to contain the ingress to manageable flow rate.

 

[webcraft]

Going to enjoy the good weather on Tiree and wait for the Water Weld to arrive. I am pretty confident the thing isn't going to spontaneously disintegrate.

Another idea... I have almost a full tube of CT1, which will adhere to damp surfaces and cure underwater or in the damp.

I could simply encapsulate the nut and the bottom inch of the tube with a huge glob of CT1, fixing the leak and adhering the tube to the hull - basicly like epoxying it in, but with sealant. No pressure on anything, just encapsulate the whole thing in goop.

What could go wrong with that? I could even do it on top of and as well as the Water Weld epoxy.

- W

 

[webcraft]

I don't know Tiree, but it looks from photos/maps that there might be drying or part- drying small harbours where you could dry out against a wall, or sand beaches where you might be able to careen the boat to gain external access. (I know it may well look very different there in real life.)

Personally, I very much doubt it will fail if not pushed and pulled about from inside. I think it is more likely the sealant has failed, as you suspect, than the whole thing is falling to bits in place (not that I'm saying this could never happen).

You can't stay awake forever, so get some sleep while the going's good.



Do they not have postal deliveries on Tiree? (Maps indicate a ferry service. )

Update - there is a daily ferry service, so presumably also daily post.

Yes, could order a new unit and dry out against a wall perhaps, but stuff can go wrong and drying out would be a last resort. Not ruling it out, but I think Water Weld and CT1 will do the same as glassing it in and will remove any risk of the unit becoming detached and falling into the hull.

I think you are right, and any manipulation should be avoided. Most failure reports seem to feature trying to tighten the plastic locknut. I have already ruled that out.

- W

 

[Pye_End]

Can you block off the log from the outside (or dry out against a wall) and take out the log from the housing? If so it may allow you to inspect the housing for cracks, and then you will know if it is the sealant or housing.

 

[webcraft]

Can you block off the log from the outside (or dry out against a wall) and take out the log from the housing? If so it may allow you to inspect the housing for cracks, and then you will know if it is the sealant or housing.

Thanks for this, so much good input here. Little Sister also suggested drying out, and yes, we could possibly dry out, could seek local knowledge, but there are only fishermen here, not yachties, and drying out a long keeler can be tricky if you don't know the ground. It might be possible to dry out in Scarinish Harbour though.

I don't really care though if it is sealant failure or plastic failure, I just want to enjoy the next few days and get home afloat!

So I would prefer to effect a temporary repair from the inside as described above that would deal with both possibilities (sealant failure or plastic failure)

- W

 

[Dipper]

We launched a boat at the club one year and when the owner went below to check for leaks, the NASA log fitting had snapped off. Maybe the crane strop was on it but we do check for that. I would have thought that a temporary repair with CT1 would work. You just need to hold the fitting still until you can dry the boat out and do it properly. At worst, it might ooze a bit of water but any leak will be manageable. Mine has been epoxied in since I fitted it. It's not going anywhere!

 

[dankilb]

I would have thought that a temporary repair with CT1 would work.

+1…
The stuff cures via humidity, IIRC. It certainly sticks like the proverbial. Maybe lightly key the GRP in the ‘seepiest’ bit to help it along?

 

[DownWest]

+1…
The stuff cures via humidity, IIRC. It certainly sticks like the proverbial. Maybe lightly key the GRP in the ‘seepiest’ bit to help it along?

Reading above, I was thinking similar. Use something like Sika 11FC, which is a PU and sticks to anything, doesn't mind a bit of damp.... Wipe the area and quickly gob some (lots) on. Sold at any B&Q or similar.
Recently cured a weep from a keel bolt with it, afloat. Dry as a bone now.

 

[dankilb]

Reading above, I was thinking similar. Use something like Sika 11FC, which is a PU and sticks to anything, doesn't mind a bit of damp.... Wipe the area and quickly gob some (lots) on. Sold at any B&Q or similar.
Recently cured a weep from a keel bolt with it, afloat. Dry as a bone now.

Or PU40 (depending whether Toolstation, Screwfix, or B&Q are most accessible!).

Also easier to remove later than epoxy.

 

[DownWest]

Or PU40 (depending whether Toolstation, Screwfix, or B&Q are most accessible!).

Also easier to remove later than epoxy.

Heat gun gets the epoxy off easily and at (at least)18yrs, I would be replacing the skin fitting anyway, so not concerned with heating that. But like you, I reckon a PU will do it better.

 

[pvb]

But like you, I reckon a PU will do it better.

Aren't PU-based products the ones which Nasa say you shouldn't use on their plastics?

 

[webcraft]

Well, no increase in the bilge overnight. It apparently only seeps when moving.

Will maybe leave it alone and head home gingerly end of the week for a lift-out - new skin fitting is on order. I will only bodge it if it gets worse.

(Weather is pretty benign for the rest of the week)

I really wish I had known about this issue before we launched! It would have been an hour's job tops!

So, everyone, a new skin fitting is less than 15 quid. If you have one of these and it is more than a few years old, change it next time you are out of the water! !

- W

 

[Deleted member 36384]

Well, no increase in the bilge overnight. It apparently only seeps when moving. ... Will maybe leave it alone and head home gingerly end of the week for a lift-out - new skin fitting is on order. I will only bodge it if it gets worse. ...

Probably the best idea, good luck and all the best with the rest of the week.

 

[webcraft]

Probably the best idea, good luck and all the best with the rest of the week.

I'm going to phone NASA and ask them about the silicone/sika issue, as everywhere says silicone should not be used underwater.

Also wondering if the issue was caused by the sling position. Will be watching that like a hawk on any future occasions.

- W

 

[pvb]

I'm going to phone NASA and ask them about the silicone/sika issue, as everywhere says silicone should not be used underwater.

Everywhere doesn't say that. There are lots of silicone sealants marketed for marine use which can be immersed in seawater. Here's just one - Geocel Marine Silicone Sealant Sealants Online -

 

[dankilb]

Aren't PU-based products the ones which Nasa say you shouldn't use on their plastics?

Sounds like it’s already on the way out…?!

For a (semi?)-permanent installation, could it just be epoxied in (as per TruDesign)? If they want you to glass the inside, it’s hardly like the silicon would make it easier to remove later (or stop any leaks that epoxy wouldn’t)?

Or is it that they’re not strong enough to become ‘part of’ the hull, as is the idea with TD composites?

 

[pvb]

Or is it that they’re not strong enough to become ‘part of’ the hull, as is the idea with TD composites?

I have suspicions, but couldn't possibly say, due to the risk of upsetting all the Nasa fans on the forum.

 

[LadyInBed]

I would need to get a new unit to fit first, so need to get the boat back to home waters.

I was thinking more of slapping some silicone grease on the O ring / some fast acting sealant around the fixing than putting in a replacement.

I might be able to dry out to fit it, but not here!

Where is here?

 

[webcraft]

I was thinking more of slapping some silicone grease on the O ring / some fast acting sealant around the fixing than putting in a replacement.

Where is here?

'Here' is currently Tiree.

I was going to use epoxy putty to permanently seal the leak and fasten the fitting to the hull, but if the outer flange that goes against the hull has broken off this would not be entirely satisfactory, a new skin fitting and glass it in seems the way to go.

- W