volvo ips problems

[Deleted User YDKXO]

The IPS does not produce any improved fuel economy on my boat.

Mark good to hear that you finally seem to have been sorted although the whole process must have been very stressful. Just out of interest, how do you know that IPS on your boat does not produce improved fuel economy?

 

[Mark Anderson]

IPS performance on Silverton

I have the test results from the boat manufacturer (Silverton) with 480 Hp Volvo straight shafts (traditional drives) and for the 370 Hp IPS 500 drives. The fuel economy at cruise is about identical (0.85 statute miles per gallon) at cruise (approx. 25 mph). I have verified these numbers for the IPS drives with my boat (I had initially hoped that the IPS drives would do better). The IPS only deliveries better economy at wide open throttle. Interestingly, at speed ranges between 11 mph to 19 mph the traditional drives have better fuel economy. I attribute this to the downward angled traditional drives providing a component of lift the helps the boat get onto plane. It is unfortunate, because the spped range in the 11 mph to 19 mph can be useful under certain sea conditions.

I suspect that when Silverton changed to IPS drives they shifted the CG of the boat aft, and did not make any hull shape changes. Hence, with IPS the boat is a bit tail heavy. It the boat had been optimized for the IPS units then an overall performance improvement might have been seen.

Mark

 

[Deleted User YDKXO]

I have the test results from the boat manufacturer (Silverton) with 480 Hp Volvo straight shafts (traditional drives) and for the 370 Hp IPS 500 drives. The fuel economy at cruise is about identical (0.85 statute miles per gallon) at cruise (approx. 25 mph). I have verified these numbers for the IPS drives with my boat (I had initially hoped that the IPS drives would do better). The IPS only deliveries better economy at wide open throttle. Interestingly, at speed ranges between 11 mph to 19 mph the traditional drives have better fuel economy. I attribute this to the downward angled traditional drives providing a component of lift the helps the boat get onto plane. It is unfortunate, because the spped range in the 11 mph to 19 mph can be useful under certain sea conditions.

I suspect that when Silverton changed to IPS drives they shifted the CG of the boat aft, and did not make any hull shape changes. Hence, with IPS the boat is a bit tail heavy. It the boat had been optimized for the IPS units then an overall performance improvement might have been seen.

Mark

Mark thats v interesting. I think quite a few builders did what Silverton did in the early days of IPS and, as you say, just fitted IPS into their shaftdrive designs without thinking too much about weight distribution or for that matter taking advantage of IPS in terms of increasing accomodation space. Your experience tends to bear out what commentators are saying over here in that IPS gives greater fuel economy improvement in sports boats rather than in flybridge boats. Nobody seems to know quite why that is but it may have something to do with the different weight distribution characteristics of flybridge boats, I don't know. Anyway, good to hear that your IPS pods seem finally to be working and here's hoping you get some fun out of your boat this year

 

[erik_plus8]

I have the test results from the boat manufacturer (Silverton) with 480 Hp Volvo straight shafts (traditional drives) and for the 370 Hp IPS 500 drives. The fuel economy at cruise is about identical (0.85 statute miles per gallon) at cruise (approx. 25 mph). I have verified these numbers for the IPS drives with my boat (I had initially hoped that the IPS drives would do better). The IPS only deliveries better economy at wide open throttle. Interestingly, at speed ranges between 11 mph to 19 mph the traditional drives have better fuel economy. I attribute this to the downward angled traditional drives providing a component of lift the helps the boat get onto plane. It is unfortunate, because the spped range in the 11 mph to 19 mph can be useful under certain sea conditions.

I suspect that when Silverton changed to IPS drives they shifted the CG of the boat aft, and did not make any hull shape changes. Hence, with IPS the boat is a bit tail heavy. It the boat had been optimized for the IPS units then an overall performance improvement might have been seen.

Mark

My first post here

Just out of interest, Mark - what top speed do they achive with the shafts vs pods respectively?

My thought was that if the top speeds are similar then the pods increase efficiency since they achieve that speed with only 370hp instead of 480hp.

Still, something seems to be off since the fuel economy is the same at a given speed, where a smaller engine should be more frugal. In theory, at least...

BR,

/Erik

 

[Mark Anderson]

IPS economy and durability

The top speeds with both options at wide open throttle is very similar (about 31 statute miles per hour), and at this speed the IPS drives do indeed get better economy. However, in the speed range of 23 mph to 27 mph (cruise) the fuel economy is almost identical on both engine/drivetrain options. From 11 mph to 22 mph the traditional shaft with the 480 Hp Volvos has better fuel economy--sometimes significantly. I believe that the reason is that the boat is tail heavy with the IPS drives--and in the region where the boat is not fully on plane the more forward weight distribution with the traditional drives and the slightly downward thrust of the straight shafts helps lift the stern of the boat and achieve plane more easily. I have also noticed this in specifications on other boat comparisons between IPS and traditional drives.

I would still be interested in hearing any comment on the durability of the IPS drives. Are there any out there that now have 2000 to 10000 hours on them, and how are they holding up?

Mark

 

[rgrogan]

I have just purchased a 2008 boat with Volvo Penta IPS drives. On the first day of our voyage home, we encountered a limp home cut down no less than seven times. Mattos Marine of Fort Meyers, FL, diagnosed the problem down to the wires that were on the top of the engine that terminate at the cut off push button switch. The technician disconnected the wires, brushed them with a wire brush and reinstalled them. We believe this has fixed the problem. I trust your solution will be something this easy. Mattos is deep in their knowledge base and very responsive. If you are near them, I couldn't recommend them more highly.

 

[barefootviking]

We have twin Volvo 1200 IPS with a complete Garmin suite (8215's and GHC10 pilot). The upper station (fly bridge) auto pilot will not work when the upper station is selected. It is acting like a slave to the lower station (pilot house). In other words, the upper pilot works when the lower station is active, so kids or guests can mess with the boat!

This problem showed up when Volvo installed their newest version of the software over 6 months ago. Volvo and Garmin has spent some time trying to figure this out w no success. Volvo claims that switching to Simrad will not solve this problem.

Does anyone else have a problem with Volvo IPS and multiple auto pilots? Were you able to solve it?


***we have had various electronic techs in Chicago, Michigan, Toronto and Fort Lauderdale look at this w no success***
barefootviking is online now Report Post

 

[Jofcata]

I'm sorry to hear your story and IMHO you have been badly advised. IPS was launched around 2005 so your boat would have been one of the earliest examples of an IPS equipped boat with all the potential problems that might involve. Not only that but it sounds like you bought your boat for liveaboard bluewater cruising and I think that the simplicity of traditional shafts would have been a far wiser choice than the complex and not yet proven IPS system for that kind of cruising

Hi, this is a good advice as my double ips system blew up, one at 400 hours, second one at 800!!! 16 000 euros reparation. Volvo refused to pay for it saying of course that the boat had gone out of the two year guaranty... They "commercially" offered to install an "optimized" lubrifying kit to replace both old ones. Of course it means that the old ones were not good enough for the ips 500 then. Was just furious.

 

[volvopaul]

Hi, this is a good advice as my double ips system blew up, one at 400 hours, second one at 800!!! 16 000 euros reparation. Volvo refused to pay for it saying of course that the boat had gone out of the two year guaranty... They "commercially" offered to install an "optimized" lubrifying kit to replace both old ones. Of course it means that the old ones were not good enough for the ips 500 then. Was just furious.

Hmmm I've not heard about this optimised lubrifying kit, what's all this about then? I know the early ones suffered from oil going black due to clutch slippage and full rebuilds required at ridiculous low hours.

 

[Neil_Y]

You don't say where you are or where you bought the boat, but had it been a UK purchase you would be protected by sale of goods act for 6 years against faulty goods/fit for purpose over reasonable expected life, which for a leisure marine engine should be over 1000hrs I would hope. In the UK the manufacturers warranty/guarantee is extra to any consumer protection laws.

 

[Jofcata]

You don't say where you are or where you bought the boat, but had it been a UK purchase you would be protected by sale of goods act for 6 years against faulty goods/fit for purpose over reasonable expected life, which for a leisure marine engine should be over 1000hrs I would hope. In the UK the manufacturers warranty/guarantee is extra to any consumer protection laws.

Hi, you are right to mention this. I am in the south west of France
The boat was bought in pornichet near Vannes in France. France meaning that the "sale of goods act " here is only for two years. Every maintenance schedule has been perfectly respected and done by official Volvo dealer in Corsica and Cannes.

 

[Portofino]

Re SoG in whatever domain .
I think you would be hard pushed and spend more than the repair to " have your day in court " and WIN .
IPS is a complicated engineering solution ( to a exactly what problem ?) relying on multiple gears ,seals , ,sensors , tube, pipes , bearings, bushes, rams ,black boxes to control inc IT issues with a joystick ? Soak most of it in the sea !
Then exposé the rest to sea air in a damp enviroment

2-3 years in from new what were you expecting ?

Also with SoG you may end up in years of a row between the installer ( builder ) and VP -witness a buck passing exercise

 

[Latestarter1]

Re SoG in whatever domain .
I think you would be hard pushed and spend more than the repair to " have your day in court " and WIN .
IPS is a complicated engineering solution ( to a exactly what problem ?) relying on multiple gears ,seals , ,sensors , tube, pipes , bearings, bushes, rams ,black boxes to control inc IT issues with a joystick ? Soak most of it in the sea !
Then exposé the rest to sea air in a damp enviroment


2-3 years in from new what were you expecting ?

Also with SoG you may end up in years of a row between the installer ( builder ) and VP -witness a buck passing exercise

Although I do not totally embrace aspects of IPS I do not think my view would be quite so negative, engineering reliability into electronic/mechanical integration is pretty run of the mill stuff these days and I believe end user has every right to expect better product reliability.

Having been a party to legal proceedings on more than a few occasions when a power systems manufacturer gives the builder engineering sign off of an installation that manufacturer assumes responsibility warts and all. IF the builder has done something screwy in the installation and it is not picked up on that is a failure in the power train providers or their agents approval process the buck still stops there. End user is not a spectator in a pi##ing competition.

 

[Jofcata]

When you buy something that is super expensive and supposed to be in the top 3 of the quality products, then you expect your little toy to last a little bit. Just imagine a brand new Bentley engine giving up at 20 000 miles and 3 or 4 years. ? .
Should we wait for Dacia in Romania to build boat engines at a very low cost? It might certainly last longer than Volvo and if it doesn't, at least you can buy 10 dacia for a one unit Volvo price!

 

[Jofcata]

In fact my previous post is not fair, you cannot compare Volvo with Bentley, this is an insult for the GB car builder!

 

[Cheery]

.

 

[Valente86]

Hello all, I wonder if anyone could offer any advice... my relative has a Rodman 38 IPS late 2007. its a really nice example and has low engine hours. he has owned the boat for app a year now. since purchasing it has had 2 services, one major service last month including full engine removal and service. it has 2 D4 motors, IPS pod drive, full ray marine and auto pilot.

that's the nice part... now for the issue!

a short while after taking delivery and after using the boar for a few hours here and there. the port engine went into limp mode (reduced revs etc) he had this looked at and no reason was found. I have seen on the thread people have suggested the autopilot etc and the mechanics did the same thing, still no reason was found. it happened again and after checks they found a loose connection on a wire somewhere (don't ask me where). fast forward (the boat is abroad and not used very often until hes there, and its happened again. this time the boat has had a full service, the dash on the upstairs helm was removed and work done, and a new upstairs screen was fitted. yesterday afer spending almost £15k on the service and maintenance, it happened again, on the port engine.

Mechanically everything is perfect and the engines when running purr, but this issue renders the boat almost unusable. if you switch the inside helm the problem goes away and it works perfect again, but being somewhere nice you always use the upper deck.

does anyone have any experience or advice. I feel he is throwing money at the problem in the hopes of solving it, he always pays the mechanics even thought they have already been paid to sort it out. Volvo attended (at a cost to him) and didn't find anything of any consequence.

from a common sense point of view, I think they have miss wired something creating the issue, but obviously I can be sure.

does anyone have any ideas, quick responses would be appreciated.

thank you

 

[volvopaul]

Hello all, I wonder if anyone could offer any advice... my relative has a Rodman 38 IPS late 2007. its a really nice example and has low engine hours. he has owned the boat for app a year now. since purchasing it has had 2 services, one major service last month including full engine removal and service. it has 2 D4 motors, IPS pod drive, full ray marine and auto pilot.

that's the nice part... now for the issue!

a short while after taking delivery and after using the boar for a few hours here and there. the port engine went into limp mode (reduced revs etc) he had this looked at and no reason was found. I have seen on the thread people have suggested the autopilot etc and the mechanics did the same thing, still no reason was found. it happened again and after checks they found a loose connection on a wire somewhere (don't ask me where). fast forward (the boat is abroad and not used very often until hes there, and its happened again. this time the boat has had a full service, the dash on the upstairs helm was removed and work done, and a new upstairs screen was fitted. yesterday afer spending almost £15k on the service and maintenance, it happened again, on the port engine.

Mechanically everything is perfect and the engines when running purr, but this issue renders the boat almost unusable. if you switch the inside helm the problem goes away and it works perfect again, but being somewhere nice you always use the upper deck.

does anyone have any experience or advice. I feel he is throwing money at the problem in the hopes of solving it, he always pays the mechanics even thought they have already been paid to sort it out. Volvo attended (at a cost to him) and didn't find anything of any consequence.

from a common sense point of view, I think they have miss wired something creating the issue, but obviously I can be sure.

does anyone have any ideas, quick responses would be appreciated.

thank you

Needle in a haystack I'd say. One thing as its common to use from the upper helm it could be the HCU , maybe just a bad connection from upper to lower helm HCU, check all connections for water ingress and corrosion, loose plugs etc.

 

[Valente86]

Needle in a haystack I'd say. One thing as its common to use from the upper helm it could be the HCU , maybe just a bad connection from upper to lower helm HCU, check all connections for water ingress and corrosion, loose plugs etc.

Hi Paul, thanks a lot, that's the second advice which has recommended checking those. Also the motors are D6 not D4 (apologies). The engineer wants to swop the HCU downstairs to upstairs to see if the fault switches positions. Do you think that's a good idea ? My issue is I don't want to have more issues after ! The boat is under an extended warranty so he may now contact the warranty provider.

 

[Andyroonot]

Has the local engineer checked the fault codes that are being triggered when the alarms sound? If so, what are they? Even if this doesn't give you the specific item causing the issue, it should assist with which item to swap first.

Have you got the engine serial numbers? Depending on the EVC generation, it may be possible to read active fault codes yourself without the need for the diagnostic tool.

Does the fault occur at the same time every time-ie, at the same rpm/lever position etc.?