VAT Status post Brexit

[Mistroma]

No intention of stirring up further discussion about whether or not to apply for a T2L. I just thought it was worthwhile giving an update on my application.

I posted the form with a covering letter and copies of some documents on 30th January. HMRC stamped the form without delay on 4th January. Slight hiccup as I did not include SAE but form arrived today after paying £2 for postage and administrative charge.

It was my fault for not reading RYA documentation about SAE and using information from another source. The Lagos Navigators link said "(No need for a stamp addressed envelope to your UK 'home address')". I assumed that meant any SAE would be a waste and HMRC would send it back in one of their envelopes.

No harm done, process is simple as others have said.

Complete and sign the form, include copies of something to prove the boat is of EU origin (e.g. Bill of Sale etc.) and send to HMRC withSAE.

Address:
HM Revenue & Customs National Clearance Hub
Ralli Quays
3 Stanley St
Salford M60 9HL

Copy of the form I used is here. It is a PDF with help text and dropdown to select code. I left it on my website on the off chance it might be of use. Just download it and type in where indicated, seems to work with most PDF viewers.
Default code is for 12m+ sailing boat but other codes are listed.

 

[nortada]

Oooops!

No intention of stirring up further discussion about whether or not to apply for a T2L. I just thought it was worthwhile giving an update on my application.

I posted the form with a covering letter and copies of some documents on 30th January. HMRC stamped the form without delay on 4th January. Slight hiccup as I did not include SAE but form arrived today after paying £2 for postage and administrative charge.

It was my fault for not reading RYA documentation about SAE and using information from another source. The Lagos Navigators link said "(No need for a stamp addressed envelope to your UK 'home address')". I assumed that meant any SAE would be a waste and HMRC would send it back in one of their envelopes.

No harm done, process is simple as others have said.

Complete and sign the form, include copies of something to prove the boat is of EU origin (e.g. Bill of Sale etc.) and send to HMRC withSAE.

Address:
HM Revenue & Customs National Clearance Hub
Ralli Quays
3 Stanley St
Salford M60 9HL

Copy of the form I used is here. It is a PDF with help text and dropdown to select code. I left it on my website on the off chance it might be of use. Just download it and type in where indicated, seems to work with most PDF viewers.
Default code is for 12m+ sailing boat but other codes are listed.

Sorry about that, I owe you a virtual beer (or a real one if you venture into these parts).

My only defence is “it were free mailing when I done it” back in 2016; before that referendum.

Requiring extra documentation is also another new requirement. Did they return the supporting documentation

Possibly, they are being overwhelmed and times is getting hard.

Given the farce it all is, the next step could be they stop providing a T2L altogether.

Blame Brexit.:encouragement:

I have amended the offending thread, accordingly and sorry again for the inconvenience and extra expense

 

[Mistroma]

Re: Oooops!

Sorry about that, I owe you a virtual beer (or a real one if you venture into these parts).

My only defence is “it were free mailing when I done it” back in 2016; before that referendum.

Requiring extra documentation is also another new requirement. Did they return the supporting documentation

Possibly, they are being overwhelmed and times is getting hard.

Given the farce it all is, the next step could be they stop providing a T2L altogether.

Blame Brexit.:encouragement:

I have amended the offending thread, accordingly and sorry again for the inconvenience and extra expense

Not a problem. It did sort of make sense about not including SAE. I thought they'd have a system and form would just end up in one of their standard envelopes.

HMRC seemed to process and stamp the T2L within 1-2 working days of receipt. I was expecting a delay and the processing speed seems to indicate that they aren't being swamped ("yet" ).

The T2L vanished after stamping on 4th and appeared on 15th when Royal Mail asked for money to cover 1st class postage and admin.

My worry was that they might decide to make processing more difficult or even stop doing it for boats. A friend with HMRC still can't understand why I wanted a T2L an thought it was completely misusing the document.

The stamped T2L was the only thing returned. I assume that the Bill of Sale and registration copies were just binned. They might be filed somewhere, but I doubt it very much.

Thanks for updating the Lagos Navigators thread.

 

[greeny]

Re: Oooops!

Just an update. Sent my form in to HMRC Salford last Monday and got it back signed and stamped this morning. No problems. Didn't send any supporting paperwork, just the form correctly filled in with the information needed.

 

[nortada]

To SAE or not to SAE, that is the question?

Just an update. Sent my form in to HMRC Salford last Monday and got it back signed and stamped this morning. No problems. Didn't send any supporting paperwork, just the form correctly filled in with the information needed.

Did you send a SAE?:encouragement:

 

[davethedog]

Re: To SAE or not to SAE, that is the question?

Sent off for the T2L last night...see if it makes any difference.

 

[Mistroma]

Re: Oooops!

Just an update. Sent my form in to HMRC Salford last Monday and got it back signed and stamped this morning. No problems. Didn't send any supporting paperwork, just the form correctly filled in with the information needed.

I suspect that the request for documentation is just a belt and braces thing in case the person stamping it had a bad day. I was always pretty certain the documents went into the bin. Fairly easy to guess a Jeanneau, Bavaria or Moody was built in EU and little risk for HMRC.

Not exactly in the same league as some bulk shipment of electronic items with dodgy documentation. I guess that HMRC mostly stamp it without a thought now it is not such an unusual request.

I'd still include some documents if you have them. Lack of documents wouldn't stop me trying as the worst that can happen is that you don't get it stamped. Nothing to prevent you trying again.

 

[greeny]

Re: To SAE or not to SAE, that is the question?

Did you send a SAE?:encouragement:

No, but it came back in an envelope addressed by hand and with no stamp. The posties delivered it with the rest of the mail and didn't ask for postage, don't know why.
If I was doing it again I would put a stamped addressed envelope in the application I think.

edit - this was to a UK address by the way.

 

[Mistroma]

Re: To SAE or not to SAE, that is the question?

No, but it came back in an envelope addressed by hand and with no stamp. The posties delivered it with the rest of the mail and didn't ask for postage, don't know why.
If I was doing it again I would put a stamped addressed envelope in the application I think.

edit - this was to a UK address by the way.

You lead a charmed life, buy a lottery ticket this week.

I was obviously unlucky, at least I now know that SAE is a good idea.

 

[nortada]

Re: To SAE or not to SAE, that is the question?

No, but it came back in an envelope addressed by hand and with no stamp. The posties delivered it with the rest of the mail and didn't ask for postage, don't know why.
If I was doing it again I would put a stamped addressed envelope in the application I think.

edit - this was to a UK address by the way.

So would I and I have changed the aide memoire accordingly.:encouragement:

 

[blampied]

Looks remarkably like it.

Remember you only have to send page 4 direct to HMRC Salford and no original supporting paper work. As it may not be returned.

The page 4 will be returned, signed and sealed and be your T2L.

https://www.tapatalk.com/groups/lag...ide-memoir-british-flagged-vessels-t1885.html if you require more detail.

Hope this helps.

Hi, thank you very much for providing the T2L information.
I have been filling in in as per your instructions
I have a motor boat rather than a sail yacht.
For box 33 you give the code 88-03911000 sailing yacht.
I'm assuming I will need a different code for a motor boat?
Please can you let me know where I would find the correct code

Thank you

 

[greeny]

Hi, thank you very much for providing the T2L information.
I have been filling in in as per your instructions
I have a motor boat rather than a sail yacht.
For box 33 you give the code 88-03911000 sailing yacht.
I'm assuming I will need a different code for a motor boat?
Please can you let me know where I would find the correct code

Thank you

just follow the link and then work your way through to find the correct code.
https://www.gov.uk/trade-tariff


Difficult to find so follow this link. https://www.trade-tariff.service.gov.uk/trade-tariff/a-z-index/b and then follow the boat .

Prefix 88 looks wrong to me - it says spacecraft on the list. Boat is 89 prefix.

 

[blampied]

Thank you very much.

 

[davethedog]

Received mine back less than a week later and no copies of any documents returned.

Another question, is it worth trying to be in say cherbourg for brexit day and then coming back to the UK straight after as would that then give both parties vat status. As in can go to the eu without vat issues and time limits and also retain UK vat paid status?

 

[macd]

Another question, is it worth trying to be in say cherbourg for brexit day and then coming back to the UK straight after as would that then give both parties vat status. As in can go to the eu without vat issues and time limits and also retain UK vat paid status?

That's an interesting speculation. Of course it's not inevitable that such a test of status would be imposed. But it could be.

The EU 'model' for status lies in the "transitional arrangements" for VAT compliance when a common approach was adopted in the 90s. In particular, this (from our old friend VAT Notice 8):
Certain vessels that were in use as private pleasure craft prior to 1 January 1985 and were in the EU on 31 December 1992, may be deemed VAT paid under the Single Market transitional arrangements. As Austria, Finland and Sweden joined the EU later, the relevant dates for vessels in these countries are ‘in use’ before 1 January 1987 and moored in EU on 31 December 1994.

Like T2L, your proposed trip is unlikely to do any harm (well, unless it's blowing F9 on the day...)

Of course you might acquire the same paperwork by popping across on the ferry and paying for a marina berth for a boat you'd left behind.

 

[Chris_Robb]

That's an interesting speculation. Of course it's not inevitable that such a test of status would be imposed. But it could be.

The EU 'model' for status lies in the "transitional arrangements" for VAT compliance when a common approach was adopted in the 90s. In particular, this (from our old friend VAT Notice 8):
Certain vessels that were in use as private pleasure craft prior to 1 January 1985 and were in the EU on 31 December 1992, may be deemed VAT paid under the Single Market transitional arrangements. As Austria, Finland and Sweden joined the EU later, the relevant dates for vessels in these countries are ‘in use’ before 1 January 1987 and moored in EU on 31 December 1994.

Like T2L, your proposed trip is unlikely to do any harm (well, unless it's blowing F9 on the day...)

Of course you might acquire the same paperwork by popping across on the ferry and paying for a marina berth for a boat you'd left behind.

Mac. Getting a formal invoice from a marina should be better than a T2L as the commission has already indicated that those yachts in an EU27 port on Brexit will maintain their VAT status.
If you dial forward in time, when you come to sell, VAT is always an issue especially the proof that you maintained your EU status. So this would be an extremely important bit of paper for selling your yacht.

 

[macd]

Mac. Getting a formal invoice from a marina should be better than a T2L as the commission has already indicated that those yachts in an EU27 port on Brexit will maintain their VAT status.

Thanks, Chris: that decision seems to have passed me by. Now all we need to know is when Brexit will actually happen, which is far from a given. I anticipate plenty of last-minute Channel crossings (actual or virtual).
Do you have a source for your info, or more chapter and verse? And do you happen to know whether the UK indicated its own decision on the same issue?

Fair winds.

 

[Graham376]

Mac. Getting a formal invoice from a marina should be better than a T2L as the commission has already indicated that those yachts in an EU27 port on Brexit will maintain their VAT status.
If you dial forward in time, when you come to sell, VAT is always an issue especially the proof that you maintained your EU status. So this would be an extremely important bit of paper for selling your yacht.

What we don't know is what the VAT status will be in the UK in later years if/when the boat returns either in same or, changed ownership. At the present time, IIRC there's a three year limit for re-import.

 

[sailaboutvic]

What we don't know is what the VAT status will be in the UK in later years if/when the boat returns either in same or, changed ownership. At the present time, IIRC there's a three year limit for re-import.

Graham , I'm not sure I would worry about that , we know many that's been out of the EU a lot longer then three years , returning back no one question it .

 

[GHA]

Quick one - will any of this matter on a pre 1985 boat?