Update on Yachting Monthly and PBO

[Tomahawk]

What will happen to the forums?


I am sure I asked this before, but I can't find the post.

 

[robertj]

Pbo and YM I suspect will merge into an all encompassing magazine. It will have twice the content of a single title issue with further reduction in staff to make time more money. I suspect the catch for the reader will be a new 'special' price which will be more expensive but better value for money lol.
The new all encompassing good value magazine will start off well, but over a period of time be reduced to the thin content of their magazines now. What will we be left with then? Answer the new 'special' price!!

 

[Heckler]

Of course, you're a celeb!

?

 

[EBunting]

Great comments and suggestions here and some very good ideas for us to take on board. Will have another look at Destinations. Agreed about the forums. There's a mass of information here.

BTW, I always enjoy your comments and explanations Flaming - from cruising and club racing to foiling Minis, you seem to be on it!

Question: how could we make use of the forums? FB works for well for YW, as we have a lot of visual content and video that is shareable and so works well on that platform, and links to web posts make a signficant contribution to specific areas of our web content (as opposed to ybw.com, which is where the forums sit). We will be doing more with the other titles too and I'm thinking of creating a PBO 'Build, make, fix' closed group. But I'm very well aware of how much great advice and knowledge there is here, so I know that from a magazine perspective we're missing out. How and what would you like us post/think we should?

What about the other way round - is there some way we could make more use in the mags of the huge range of information and expertise here?

Thanks again for all the comments - all read and being inwardly digested.

Elaine

 

[Concerto]

Question: how could we make use of the forums? FB works for well for YW, as we have a lot of visual content and video that is shareable and so works well on that platform, and links to web posts make a signficant contribution to specific areas of our web content (as opposed to ybw.com, which is where the forums sit). We will be doing more with the other titles too and I'm thinking of creating a PBO 'Build, make, fix' closed group. But I'm very well aware of how much great advice and knowledge there is here, so I know that from a magazine perspective we're missing out. How and what would you like us post/think we should?

Elaine

I feel the reason that YW uses Facebook is because it is an easier format to include photos and video than the YBW forum. Perhaps it is time (no pun intended) for TIME to upgrade the forum with better software for a better classy look with more photos and videos.

Back in the mid 1960's another yachting newspaper (?Yachting and Boating) did article on a man (or family), the boat, and where it was moored (my late Father and family were featured with our new Kingfisher 30 based in Queenborough, Kent). This could be an interesting feature to make the readership feel more included in the magazine. You could include racing sailors, cruising sailors, restoration boat owners, etc - from all over the UK. It would be nice to hear their story and learn about where they sail.

I enjoy reading reviews of boat tests, more the secondhand boats than most new boats as they have so many different and interesting features than modern boats. YW in the past used to do mini rally tests and directly compared different boats of similar sizes. The large production companies probably do not want to have such a direct comparison with their competitors. To be honest, the personal buyer of most new yachts is really buying a slightly different version of a charter boat intended for a sunny climate. They are not designed for the climate, winds and waters of our shores, hence so few are ever sailed (or motored) in anything but mild conditions.

I started sailing in 1965 and have seen many changes to yachting over the past 50 years. I am a YM subscriber, recently transferred from PBO as I found some subjects starting to repeat. However I paid full cover price for the current PBO as there were a couple of articles that looked of great interest, the main one by Peter Polland was how production yachts have evolved from hand made boats to modern factory methods.

Any articles that help extend the knowledge of how boats are made, how to buy/survey secondhand yachts, how to maintain them, how to improve them, how to sail and navigate them, also mistakes people are prepared to own up to, should definitely be an aim the PBO/YM magazines should follow.

 

[Sticky Fingers]

I feel the reason that YW uses Facebook is because it is an easier format to include photos and video than the YBW forum. Perhaps it is time (no pun intended) for TIME to upgrade the forum with better software for a better classy look with more photos and videos...

That is definitely the case. Compared to many others (and I use a lot), this one is extremely difficult to include anything other than text. Uploading is painful, support for easy inclusion of non text content almost non existent, limits on file sizes and total storage usage are tiny. Leads people to use eg Photobucket vomit emoji or whatever.

 

[Kelpie]

Agree that uploading photos on this forum is a right pain.
Someone said that putting the forum behind a paywall would kill it- they are probably right. But how about giving YM/PBO subscribers some extra features- free image hosting, ideally some sort of access to the archived issues/articles. I'm not sure how you prevent people downloading these and passing them on to other people though.

I'd also echo comments about articles, in particular boat tests, being quite shallow. Let's see loads of technical info in there: polars, construction details (layup, core, thickness of teak if applicable, etc), and on used boat tests an honest appraisal of faults and their solutions.
With fifty years of boat tests, PBO ought to have a database of info that makes www.sailboatdata.com obsolete. Likewise the yachtsnet archive pages.

 

[Tin Tin]

What about the other way round - is there some way we could make more use in the mags of the huge range of information and expertise here?

I think that would be a no-brainer.

The trouble with British yachting magazines - IMHO - is the lack of content!!!!!!!!!
This is what makes a magazine worth reading - more than colourful layout and big, bright pictures.

An example: offshore passage planning - two articles - one UK, the other US

UK - Sailing Today: http://www.sailingtoday.co.uk/practical/technical-guides/atlantic-weather/

Slightly bland, only superficially touches some points.
More anecdotal than anything else. And, of course, with the almost compulsory ARC plug

US - Cruising World: http://www.cruisingworld.com/how-to-plan-passage?src=SOC&dom=fb#page-4

More in depth, practical and useful information.

By all means, be entertaining, but also teach me something (and I don't mean 'how to winterise your engine' for the umpteenth time), go off the beaten track (we've done Sunsail/Moorings charter destinations to death already), look at different/rarer boats. Why not have a reader's boats feature?

PS: and when you do reviews of boats/gear - dare to have a clear opinion.
And when it comes to gear, the manufacturer shouldn't lend you the equipment so you can test it.
Just buy the kit - like a normal punter - and then test it.

Etc...

 

[JumbleDuck]

Really sad to hear about all the redundancies at PBO. David, Ben and all the people in the Poole office are great and I hope they all find something.

Absolutely. Although I think the magazine has been a bit of a disappointment of late, I think they have all done wonders with very restricted resources - I am sure they didn't want to produce something with all the physical charm of the Screwfix catalogue.

 

[richardsn9]

With all due respect, I think you are asking the wrong people the wrong question. If you want to increase circulation, you should be asking people who don't buy the magazine what puts them off.

Years ago I was seconded to an organisation which ran holidays for children. They had huge problems finding customers, which puzzled them because they surveyed their regular customers to ask what they liked about the holidays and always got positive responses.

So I tried a rather different approach. I surveyed people who had asked for brochures but not booked what put them off and I surveyed customers who had booked once and never came back (95%!) to ask what the problems were. The responses were most enlightening. Alas before I could do much about it my secondment ended and they slipped back into their introspective ways ... ten plus years later they still have a smaller turnover than they did then.

A very good point to make. I wonder if they have contacted those who have cancelled their subscriptions in the last couple of years. You might need to offer a voucher or two to incentivize them to reply. I half expected them to contact me when I stopped PBO after 20+ years, but never heard from them again.

 

[ShinyShoe]

This may be just me... but say an article is describing a passage from Falmouth to Guernsey. It will seem to refer to a million places that perhaps people on the South Coast know. But they mean little to me. A "chart" with the place names on would be mighty helpful.

I think that one thing might make a paper content more useful than electronic equivalents or an internet site. Its much easier to flick back to the chart on a paper magazine to see where something is than to scroll up and down a web page. If the market remains paper (advertisers presumably know 3/4 of the forum readers ad block!) then making the paper do things that are hard on electronic has to be the way forward...

Electronic of course can do things paper can't - like animate, link, even embed video...

 

[Tin Tin]

This may be just me... but say an article is describing a passage from Falmouth to Guernsey. It will seem to refer to a million places that perhaps people on the South Coast know. But they mean little to me. A "chart" with the place names on would be mighty helpful.

I think that one thing might make a paper content more useful than electronic equivalents or an internet site. Its much easier to flick back to the chart on a paper magazine to see where something is than to scroll up and down a web page. If the market remains paper (advertisers presumably know 3/4 of the forum readers ad block!) then making the paper do things that are hard on electronic has to be the way forward...

Electronic of course can do things paper can't - like animate, link, even embed video...

I could be persuaded to take out a digital subscription to a mag, provide there was an incentive to do so (price!).

Years ago (prior to our Atlantic circuit) I used to subscribe (digital copy) to a US magazine: Blue Water Sailing.
A digital copy was 55% of the print price (including P&P).
IIRC, there is no significant discount in price when you take out a digital sub instead of a print copy for YBW mags.

I mentioned this a couple of years ago to Richard Shead at SIBS, and his reply was that they had a different business model.
No shit, Sherlock. And how's that working out for you?

 

[Concerto]

Printed articles could have QR Codes for access to extra photos and videos. These would only be available to purchasers of the magazine in print or digital form as an extra code from within the magazine would be necessary to view.

 

[Kelpie]

SWMBO had a digital subscription to YM. She lost all her back issues due to some sort of glitch. Went back to paper since it was the same price.

 

[snooks]

Printed articles could have QR Codes for access to extra photos and videos. These would only be available to purchasers of the magazine in print or digital form as an extra code from within the magazine would be necessary to view.

QR codes were tried and we could see how many readers scanned them. When it became apparent there were few people scanning the codes, resources were distributed elsewhere and it was stopped. As someone who produced the extra content at the time, it was disheartening to see the viewing figures. However the content it linked to was far more popular online than QR scans through from the magazine. So we concluded the content was right, but those whose read the magazine (at the time) had little interest or resources to follow through the content on line.

So it was up to the editor to decide where they spend their budget – does the money that was spent creating that content and putting it online go on the magazine for readers who buy it, or for those on the web who don't buy and get it for free?

Would putting it behind a paywall of sorts increase readership?

What works well in digital, can fall on it rse in print and vice versa.

It's a constant balancing act to find out what works and what doesn't.

 

[Seven Spades]

I can'tbelieve that Face Book is a good way to go. My guess is that I am not alone in having nothing whatever to do with Face Book which I think is for kids with nothing better to fill their lives.

 

[Time Out]

I could be persuaded to take out a digital subscription to a mag, provide there was an incentive to do so (price!).

Years ago (prior to our Atlantic circuit) I used to subscribe (digital copy) to a US magazine: Blue Water Sailing.
A digital copy was 55% of the print price (including P&P).
IIRC, there is no significant discount in price when you take out a digital sub instead of a print copy for YBW mags.

I mentioned this a couple of years ago to Richard Shead at SIBS, and his reply was that they had a different business model.
No shit, Sherlock. And how's that working out for you?

Don’t drag Richard Shead into it. What he said then was true, it cost money to churn out apps ( digital mags)

Anyhow he is now engaged in a very different and somewhat more profitable business model ...

 

[flaming]

I can'tbelieve that Face Book is a good way to go. My guess is that I am not alone in having nothing whatever to do with Face Book which I think is for kids with nothing better to fill their lives.

The "kids" who were at uni when Facebook first appeared and as such were the early adopters (it being originally limited to people with a university email address) are now in their 30s and some will be starting to think about buying a boat.

 

[flaming]

Don’t drag Richard Shead into it. What he said then was true, it cost money to churn out apps ( digital mags)

Anyhow he is now engaged in a very different and somewhat more profitable business model ...

And yet can't stay away.... (Not that I can talk on that front...)

 

[JumbleDuck]

The "kids" who were at uni when Facebook first appeared and as such were the early adopters (it being originally limited to people with a university email address) are now in their 30s and some will be starting to think about buying a boat.

Not just a university email address ... I got my Facebook account when you needed an email address at one of only two UK universities. Fnaww, fnaww, fnaww.