UK Sailors And Expats In The EU - Run Up To Friday 29th March 2019 & Beyond?

[RAI]

If everything goes pear shaped it might lot like this, in terms of passports. Visas are extra.
https://www.gov.uk/government/public...no-brexit-deal

 

[nortada]

If everything goes pear shaped it might lot like this, in terms of passports. Visas are extra.
https://www.gov.uk/government/public...no-brexit-deal

You can renew your passport upto 9 months early and the unexpired time is credited to your new passport so the passport issue is a non-event.

 

[ANDY_W]

You can renew your passport upto 9 months early and the unexpired time is credited to your new passport so the passport issue is a non-event.

If I've read the rules correctly, in the case of a citizen from a ' third country ' , passports may not be valid for more than 10 years, so an early renewal with previous unexpired time added would render it invalid until the extra time has expired.

Andy

 

[macd]

You can renew your passport upto 9 months early and the unexpired time is credited to your new passport...

A small issue in the scheme of things, but they seem recently to have put a stop to the unexpired time bonus: https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news...-up-to-nine-months-validity-after-rule-change

 

[nortada]

If I've read the rules correctly, in the case of a citizen from a ' third country ' , passports may not be valid for more than 10 years, so an early renewal with previous unexpired time added would render it invalid until the extra time has expired.

Andy

I think you are looking too deep.

A passport has an expirary date. If you arrive in a Schengan country, provided you have more than 6 months left on your passport, nobody is going to show any interest.

As is now, in certain circumstances, carriers will not transport you unless you have a stipulated period of unexpected time on your passport, so will it be in the future.

For me a non-issue.

For me the real issue is how I can continue my current arrangement, splitting my life between the UK and Portugal but remaining British.

From what I have researched, post Brexit (whatever form it takes) we should still be able to get a long term visa leading to a Portuguese 5 year Residence Permit and eventually Portuguese Residencia so then is no need for precipative action.

However, one issue, can a long-term berth qualify as a residence? I understand a rented property can.

I intend to persue this point when next in Portugal and will advise progress.

 

[nortada]

A small issue in the scheme of things, but they seem recently to have put a stop to the unexpired time bonus: https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news...-up-to-nine-months-validity-after-rule-change

Not according to the current UK Government Website.

Note the Guardian article leads with ‘could’.

On the face of it a rediculas change but agree this is not a big issue in the overall picture.

 

[nortada]

Re: Open Letter To The Moderators - Please Make This Thread A Sticky.

I realised that but still thought it worth posting. Sadly I think cruising sailors are gong to be a grey area for some time after Brexit even if there is a deal. Perhaps it might be wise to pick a country and only cruise there for a year or two after Brexit to give the dust time to settle?

Sound advice but I anticipate it will only take a season for things to settle down and a new order of things to emerge.

Half empty marinas in poor southern EU countries could concentrate minds. Unfortunately, by then the dye, will be set and the absent Brit berth-holders will be reluctant to return - worst of all worlds for both parties.

A similar situation could occur in the Brit mobile home community that would further impoverish already poor communities.

A good reason to lay as many of these ghosts as soon as possible and not invent spurious new ones.

Frightening the horses is in nobodies best interests and having got the Moderators to move this thread back into a discussion forum I would be very sad to see it returned to Anything Brexit.

 

[DownWest]

Bit more on the French front: Talking over food to an expat advisor, he said that the Carte de Sejour interview waiting times are into May next year and driving licenses are causing headaches over the length of time for processing. At least one Brit has no license, as his Brit one has expired and his French one is has taken months. So far, the police are 'tolerant', after they stopped him.

 

[RAI]

Different countries different problems. In Belgium my first residents permit took 5 months, maybe they wanted me to go away. Since then, ID card and driving licences get replaced in a week (they say it might take two).
When in Germany, it's all in the computer and changes in paperwork took no time at all.

 

[dslittle]

Re: Visas & Residency In Portugal

Expatica provides a similar brief for those looking to settle in Spain at: https://www.expatica.com/new/es/moving/visas/visas-and-immigration-102354/.

Had a quick look and it appears that, unlike Portugal where you can have dual nationality, if you want Spanish Residencia you will have to renounce your British Nationality and exchange your UK Passport for a Spanish one. A big step!

Nortada
Thanks for the research that you have done to date.
I have not read anywhere as much as you but, in relation to Spain, my parents lived there for nigh on twenty years. Both had NIE numbers and Residencia. They both kept their UK Passports and Nationality and received medical care on the EHIC. They both had to return Spanish Tax returns.
I believe that is the norm where they lived, however they had bought and lived in a villa 365 days a year so it may not be relevant to cruisers.

 

[nortada]

Re: Visas & Residency In Portugal

Nortada
Thanks for the research that you have done to date.
I have not read anywhere as much as you but, in relation to Spain, my parents lived there for nigh on twenty years. Both had NIE numbers and Residencia. They both kept their UK Passports and Nationality and received medical care on the EHIC. They both had to return Spanish Tax returns.
I believe that is the norm where they lived, however they had bought and lived in a villa 365 days a year so it may not be relevant to cruisers.

Dslillle

Thanks for this valuable input.

To be honest, although we have a family house in Ayamonte, as we rarely visit Spain (Christmas & Easter), I have put the majority of my efforts into getting my head around what is the best course of action for itinerant Brits in Portugal.

My comment on Spain was taken from a quick read of https://www.expatica.com/new/es/moving/visas/visas-and-immigration-102354/ which I believe states (unlike In Portugal) one cannot hold dual UK/Spanish nationality or hold 2 passports. You have to surrender your UK passport to get a Spanish one but is this enforced?

On question, I see you post is in the past tenths so assume your parents no longer live in Spain so may I ask which part of Spain were they in and when were they there?

More to the point, the details about you folk living in Spain may just serve to highlight how, in Iberia, rules, regulations and reality can be very different.

 

[laika]

Not according to the current UK Government Website.

Note the Guardian article leads with ‘could’.

“Could” is there because it depends on the time left on your passport. You “will” lose remaining time as of September 10th. I can confirm this because I lost 12 days when I renewed my passport on Monday.

 

[nortada]

“Could” is there because it depends on the time left on your passport. You “will” lose remaining time as of September 10th. I can confirm this because I lost 12 days when I renewed my passport on Monday.

Laika,

Many thanks for this clarification.

Given all that is going on this change seems bizarre and flies in the face of the interests folk in the UK for no obvious reason.

A mistake (soon to be rectified?) or is there deeper thinking to make Brits going abroad less attractive?

Whatever, very small beer so will have a corresponding limited impact. So why do it?

 

[nortada]

Re: Visas & Residency In Portugal

Nortada

Thanks for the research that you have done to date.
I have not read anywhere as much as you but, in relation to Spain, my parents lived there for nigh on twenty years. Both had NIE numbers and Residencia. They both kept their UK Passports and Nationality and received medical care on the EHIC. They both had to return Spanish Tax returns.

I believe that is the norm where they lived, however they had bought and lived in a villa 365 days a year so it may not be relevant to cruisers.

Possibly for clarification, I started this thread in the hope that the discussions that followed would be EU wide to the benefit of all.

It quickly became apparent that, although Brussels would love to be in the driving seat for all things, because of widely varying regulations and attitudes across the EU and the fact that access to their states is largely in the hands of individual countries, the scope of this thread is too broad.

Therefore, I made it clear that I intended to concentrate on Iberia and specifically Portugal. Nevertheless, inputs from other communities (France) will still be useful and must add to the common good.

So where am I now - still in the UK but with a clear game plan to try to get Portugal to clarify the position of long-term berth holders with regards to a qualifying address and obtaining a residence permit, leading to residencia (should they wish it).

My dilemma is how to achieve my objective without creating a knee-jerk response which could jeopardize the whole aim. This is to a back drop where currently everything is just fine and I am becoming ever more convinced that the UK crashing out of the EU is becoming increasingly unlikely.

In which case, I have just expended a lot of nugatory effort.

 

[One A.]

Re: Visas & Residency In Portugal

Possibly for clarification, I started this thread in the hope that the discussions that followed would be EU wide to the benefit of all.

It quickly became apparent that, although Brussels would love to be in the driving seat for all things, because of widely varying regulations and attitudes across the EU and the fact that access to their states is largely in the hands of individual countries, the scope of this thread is too broad.

Therefore, I mad it clear that I intended to concentrate on Iberia and specifically Portugal. Nevertheless, inputs from other communities (France) will be useful and must add to the common good.

So where am I now - still in the UK but with a clear game plan to try to get Portugal to clarify the position of long-term berth holders with regards to a qualifying address and obtaining a residence permit, leading to residencia (should they wish it).

My dilemma is how to achieve my objective without creating a knee-jerk response which could jeopardize the whole aim. This is a back drop where currently everything is just who we want it and I am becoming convinced that that the UK crashing out of the EU is becoming increasingly unlikely.

In which case, I have just expended a lot of nugatory effort.

In Greece to obtain a mobile contract you have to have a tax number, in Govia and in Agios Nikolaos the marina have given me letters to say I was a resident of the marina. Someone will correct me if am am wrong Govia is privately owned and Ag Nik is state owned.

 

[nortada]

Re: Visas & Residency In Portugal

In Greece to obtain a mobile contract you have to have a tax number, in Govia and in Agios Nikolaos the marina have given me letters to say I was a resident of the marina. Someone will correct me if am am wrong Govia is privately owned and Ag Nik is state owned.

Thanks for this One A.

In Portugal, as berth holders, we have had fiscal numbers for the past 15 years.

When we got our fiscal numbers you were supposed to have an address and your request was backed by a notary who (at a price and annual fee) stood guarantor.

Our address was/is Marina de Lagos and we applied direct, with no legal intervention (or costs). Seem to recall getting a fiscal number cost €5 for departmental expenses.

Of late, no need for the fiscal guarantor and it has been increasingly easy for berth holders to get a fiscal number.

Part of my argument to Portugal is that if a visitor has a fiscal number can they then have a residence's permit?

 

[One A.]

Re: Visas & Residency In Portugal

Thanks for this One A.

In Portugal, as berth holders, we have had fiscal numbers for the past 15 years.

When we got our fiscal numbers you were supposed to have an address and your request was backed by a notary who (at a price and annual fee) stood guarantor.

Our address was/is Marina de Lagos and we applied direct, with no legal intervention (or costs). Seem to recall getting a fiscal number cost €5 for departmental expenses.

Of late, no need for the fiscal guarantor and it has been increasingly easy for berth holders to get a fiscal number.

Part of my argument to Portugal is that if a visitor has a fiscal number can they then have a residence's permit?

In Greece (which I know is no good to you) yes you can have a residents permit, I know at least one full time liveaboard with one.

 

[Graham376]

Re: Visas & Residency In Portugal

Part of my argument to Portugal is that if a visitor has a fiscal number can they then have a residence's permit?

IIRC, the EU rules are that if you are in a country for more than 183 days, you are resident. I would suggest you go to the local Camara with your fiscal number and any proof you may have such as old phone and marina contracts which indicate your long term presence here and see what happens. Possibly a letter from the marina stating how many years you have held a berth there would back your story. If they say you don't qualify then you may have to arrange a residential address, either by renting somewhere or lodging.

 

[DownWest]

I know a bunch down the other end of the Algarve ( Tavira & VRdSA) who have moved there recently from here to take advantage of the pension tax break. AIUI, they had to show a rental contract to qualify. They have a useful Portuguese lawyer who helps them out.
I will flag this thread up to them and see what the think.

 

[Tony Cross]

Re: Visas & Residency In Portugal

In Greece (which I know is no good to you) yes you can have a residents permit, I know at least one full time liveaboard with one.

You have to be VERY careful with the terminology here. I (and several others in Greece) have registration documents, these are an EU requirement (that not all countries bother with) that you are supposed to apply for if you are in a country for more than 90 days. These are NOT residence permits although several people I know of call them residence permits. They're not, they give you no right of residence at all.