GrahamM376
New member
I've already been in one African country several times during an insurgent war and have no intention of visiting another. Those guys don't play by civilised rules.
UK Navy captures Somali pirates
- Thread starter webcraft
- Start date
I've already been in one African country several times during an insurgent war and have no intention of visiting another. Those guys don't play by civilised rules.
Rigger Mortice
N/A
We do and should continue to do so.
OGITD
Active member
About time!
But also IMHO:
They are conducting themselves in this manner (committing acts of piracy) due to their social and economic backgrounds (not much of a choice for anything else in Somalia?).
So!
Arrest & detain in purpose built holding cages / cells (converted storage units on the cheap).
Strip of all possessions apart from shorts and t-shirt providing the most basic of care.
Scuttle their vessel and dispose of weapons at sea once records have been taken.
Capture their identity for process on an international database (prints, DNA etc).
Return to Somalia at our convenience to help deter anyone else thinking of becoming involved in such actions… plus we don’t want any more dependants on our already overloaded welfare system (even if International / European funding is provided).
Track down the people and monies gained from this activity to close them down (and on a permanent basis if need be).
Get the international authorities to help turn Somalia around…. & what’s our DFID doing about this?
But also IMHO:
They are conducting themselves in this manner (committing acts of piracy) due to their social and economic backgrounds (not much of a choice for anything else in Somalia?).
So!
Arrest & detain in purpose built holding cages / cells (converted storage units on the cheap).
Strip of all possessions apart from shorts and t-shirt providing the most basic of care.
Scuttle their vessel and dispose of weapons at sea once records have been taken.
Capture their identity for process on an international database (prints, DNA etc).
Return to Somalia at our convenience to help deter anyone else thinking of becoming involved in such actions… plus we don’t want any more dependants on our already overloaded welfare system (even if International / European funding is provided).
Track down the people and monies gained from this activity to close them down (and on a permanent basis if need be).
Get the international authorities to help turn Somalia around…. & what’s our DFID doing about this?
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A1Sailor
...
I think that may be what the American's did at Guantanamo Bay. How long do you propose to detain the alleged pirates?
VADROUILLE
New member
hmmmmm
Well i think i should put some people to bed here. Reading this does anoy me in some what. Having recently been on RFA Fort Victoria, as a civilian i might add ( The RFA is manned by civilians) there is a lot we can do out there.
Infact, for the month of november there were no reported pirate attacks for the area we patrolled.
Most pirates who get caught get tried by the relevent country. If there is evidence that they have attacked another vessel, then which ever country the vessel they attacked is registered to, deals with the pirates.
So the pirates that we caught on the monte cristo, i can assure you they wont be having a cushy life in an italian jail.
We are also limited to people higher up, just like the same case as the chandlers. If we get told by people sat in there high chair in some fancy office that we cant board a suspect ship then we have to sit there and just watch. Thats the government for you, if you dont like it change it, thats why you all get to vote!
It comes down to the fact that if there is a potential of loss of life to civilians then we have to leave them be.
to the person who posted about how much firearms it takes to slow down a dhow. Its simple.
Unless they shoot at us we cant do a dam thing. Thats why they are warning shots. We dont know who the hell they are untill we get on board and find out whos on the suspected ship. Untill we get there and on board it could be popeye steering for all we know.
you cant shoot at inocent people thats the law for you. even though you and me both know different.
It takes so much to stop these guys, they dont want to get caught, most are just kids believe it or not. Im surprised they got caught with firearms onboard, praise should be given to the men and women on the U.S Navy ship and Fort Vic as normally they have ditched the lot over the side by the time we get on board.
I spent 4 months on Fort Vic, and i was proud at what me and my fellow ship mates acheived, all you who think we do sod all and dont make a difference should talk about stuff you actually know about.
Well i think i should put some people to bed here. Reading this does anoy me in some what. Having recently been on RFA Fort Victoria, as a civilian i might add ( The RFA is manned by civilians) there is a lot we can do out there.
Infact, for the month of november there were no reported pirate attacks for the area we patrolled.
Most pirates who get caught get tried by the relevent country. If there is evidence that they have attacked another vessel, then which ever country the vessel they attacked is registered to, deals with the pirates.
So the pirates that we caught on the monte cristo, i can assure you they wont be having a cushy life in an italian jail.
We are also limited to people higher up, just like the same case as the chandlers. If we get told by people sat in there high chair in some fancy office that we cant board a suspect ship then we have to sit there and just watch. Thats the government for you, if you dont like it change it, thats why you all get to vote!
It comes down to the fact that if there is a potential of loss of life to civilians then we have to leave them be.
to the person who posted about how much firearms it takes to slow down a dhow. Its simple.
Unless they shoot at us we cant do a dam thing. Thats why they are warning shots. We dont know who the hell they are untill we get on board and find out whos on the suspected ship. Untill we get there and on board it could be popeye steering for all we know.
you cant shoot at inocent people thats the law for you. even though you and me both know different.
It takes so much to stop these guys, they dont want to get caught, most are just kids believe it or not. Im surprised they got caught with firearms onboard, praise should be given to the men and women on the U.S Navy ship and Fort Vic as normally they have ditched the lot over the side by the time we get on board.
I spent 4 months on Fort Vic, and i was proud at what me and my fellow ship mates acheived, all you who think we do sod all and dont make a difference should talk about stuff you actually know about.
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A1Sailor
...
Thank you.
OGITD
Active member
Hey Doc!
The absolute minimum time to deliver them back to whatever hole they crawled out of / sailed from…. but at our convenience…. and absolutely never theirs.
Don’t want any information (they’re guilty), so no interrogation, just take them out of the equation.... eh!
The absolute minimum time to deliver them back to whatever hole they crawled out of / sailed from…. but at our convenience…. and absolutely never theirs.
Don’t want any information (they’re guilty), so no interrogation, just take them out of the equation.... eh!
OGITD
Active member
OK how!?
How can Civilians be issued with ROE’s (rules of engagement) or would be trained and / or prepared to engage armed and desperate personnel?
But it’s good to hear there are patrols in place and a programme of arrest, detention and prosecution for these unfortunate people.
How can Civilians be issued with ROE’s (rules of engagement) or would be trained and / or prepared to engage armed and desperate personnel?
But it’s good to hear there are patrols in place and a programme of arrest, detention and prosecution for these unfortunate people.
Reverend Ludd
New member
How can Civilians be issued with ROE’s (rules of engagement) or would be trained and / or prepared to engage armed and desperate personnel?
But it’s good to hear there are patrols in place and a programme of arrest, detention and prosecution for these unfortunate people.
I must confess I wondered that myself?
Who are the unfortunate people ?
VADROUILLE
New member
How can Civilians be issued with ROE’s (rules of engagement) or would be trained and / or prepared to engage armed and desperate personnel?
But it’s good to hear there are patrols in place and a programme of arrest, detention and prosecution for these unfortunate people.
Because allthough we are civvies we are under the mod. its complicated to say the least. We had a dedicated Royal Navy team on board for our deployment, (there still is one) so they get all the inteligence in and basically tell us where to go. We then have the marines on board who do boarding on the ships that we get permission to board.
All RFA ships are designed to protect themselves, they all carry guns from mini guns to a phalanx. i am trained to maintain all handguns and 20,30mm guns. The stwds,cooks, deckies have tickits to fire them. so when we engage on a target all upper decks ar out of bounds, guns are manned.
As RFA personel we run the ship and look after it. we launch the boats for the marines and thats about as close as we get.
The RFA work alongside the Royal Navy, without the Navy we would not exist, and if they Navy did not have us they would not exist. (well they would exist, but they would have to get there fuel and stores from someone else)
On normal deployments its rare to have Navy personel on board, if the RFA ship has a flight deck then we may have a navy flight on board but that about it. Its only these special deployments where we really do have to work together as a team to get the job done.
This website will explain things better for those unsure http://www.royalnavy.mod.uk/The-Fleet/Royal-Fleet-Auxiliary
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Sybarite
Well-known member
For once I (almost) agree with RL....
Firing accross the bow is an ultimate warning to stop, the implication being that if you do not you will be attacked. If this is not followed up automatically it loses all meaning.
Perhaps an intermediate step would be to maintain a line of fire along the original warning path and then see if the pirates want to sail through it.
wazza
Member
+ 1 ... so much a +1
Reverend Ludd
New member
Thanks.
I'm sure it's frustrating for you to read the uneducated talking about something you are involved in. However you did the right thing and try to educate those folks. Me included
Reverend Ludd
New member
Koeketiene
Well-known member
More here
webcraft
Well-known member
prr
New member
Somalia is a sad & desperate place.
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Bosun Higgs
N/A
.
Nothing but moan moan moan about how the Navy never does anything , and when they do something positive no-one has anything good to say either
- W
They havent done anything positive. Capturing them, taking away their AK47s and then letting them go free is simply a waste of effort and money.
They should do what they used to do with privateers - string them up. It might just be a disincentive to piracy.
maxi77
Active member
Yes very true, if we just executed suspected pirates what would seperate us from them. The whole point of being civilised is to live by rules.
Just shooting people randomly at sea will not solve the problem, but trying to resolve the problems that currently make Somalia ungovernable might.
The real problem is that the warlords who run the piracy business are untouched by any enforcement activity, and have an endless supply of cannon fodder to send out to seaIt is easy to suiggest summary execution, but in the end it will achieve little until the warlords are stopped.
Mind you pointless rants about Human Rights may make you feel better, especialy on a rainy Algarvian day
Sandyman
Well-known member
Don't think so. This lot are just small fry doing the work for their masters. Stringing them up
would make no difference. Plenty more where they came from. Its the Mr Big's that need taking out and that's not going to happen either.