UK cruising/circumnavigation planning - big questions so far

[ylop]

I would imagine sailing single handed brings its own problems, such as launching and recovering a tender. Not doing it has a degree of solution, doesn't it .

Well staying at home is a solution! Or not going round the U.K. but you criticised those who dismissed the OPs plans as being too ambitious! It’s not like arriving in unknown marinas on visitor moorings is a trivial exercise for the physically challenged single handed sailor either.

 

[capnsensible]

Well staying at home is a solution! Or not going round the U.K. but you criticised those who dismissed the OPs plans as being too ambitious! It’s not like arriving in unknown marinas on visitor moorings is a trivial exercise for the physically challenged single handed sailor either.

So what has it got to do with any of us then what Ddb decides to do with his tender? It's certainly got nothing to do with the op question and quite why you want to compare the two seems odd. I'm sure I'm not alone in getting the feeling that ddb was being picked on by the tone of some of the posters. So I decided to question a remark.

That's it.

 

[Bristolfashion]

We have a small solid tender inverted on the foredeck - bonus is that you can open the deck hatch underneath it for ventilation when raining and lift the front on a halyard for a wind scoop should hot conditions even occur. Oh, and when we do tow it (calm conditions in sheltered waters) , there's no stuck on rubber attachment point to pull off!

 

[ylop]

So what has it got to do with any of us then what Ddb decides to do with his tender? It's certainly got nothing to do with the op question and quite why you want to compare the two seems odd. I'm sure I'm not alone in getting the feeling that ddb was being picked on by the tone of some of the posters. So I decided to question a remark.

That's it.

DDB joined a thread on going round Britain, and, as he has done on previous occassions, said (and I'm paraphrasing) Scotland was a waste of time and it all looks the same. He's perfectly entitled to have that view and to share it, but then others can challenge it. My experience is that most people who go round the UK have almost the opposite view - that the W of Scotland is the "best" bit and they wished they'd spend more time there.

It is potentially helpful for the audience, whether the OP or anyone in the future reading the thread, to be able to put DDB's comments in context. It is relevant that he doesn't anchor and prefers marinas. If that is your style of sailing you will miss large bits of the W of Scotland. I think its legitimate to question why. When a large part of the reason profferred is that tenders are too much hassle, I think it is reasonable to highlight that lots of sailors overcome those inconveniences because they bring benefits. If you choose to journey in Scottish waters and follow diffferent practices from most other sailors in those waters and come to a quite different conclusion from most other people about the enjoyment of those waters it seems pertinent to ask if the problem is the area (as DDB suggests) or the approach to cruising there (as I'm suggesting).

Why is that relevant to the OP (although YBW has never been that hot on sticking religiously to the original question after 160 posts!)? Simple - because if the OP is considering taking a charter boat round Scotland they might well want to consider what their tender arrangements will be - it's not their boat; it's not uncommon for charter boats to charge extra for an outboard; if they have limited space on deck they might want to consider pumps - and maybe even buying an electric pump if it's a daily activity. If they are to follow in DDB's footsteps and stick to marinas they might similarly be disappointed.

 

[capnsensible]

DDB joined a thread on going round Britain, and, as he has done on previous occassions, said (and I'm paraphrasing) Scotland was a waste of time and it all looks the same. He's perfectly entitled to have that view and to share it, but then others can challenge it. My experience is that most people who go round the UK have almost the opposite view - that the W of Scotland is the "best" bit and they wished they'd spend more time there.

It is potentially helpful for the audience, whether the OP or anyone in the future reading the thread, to be able to put DDB's comments in context. It is relevant that he doesn't anchor and prefers marinas. If that is your style of sailing you will miss large bits of the W of Scotland. I think its legitimate to question why. When a large part of the reason profferred is that tenders are too much hassle, I think it is reasonable to highlight that lots of sailors overcome those inconveniences because they bring benefits. If you choose to journey in Scottish waters and follow diffferent practices from most other sailors in those waters and come to a quite different conclusion from most other people about the enjoyment of those waters it seems pertinent to ask if the problem is the area (as DDB suggests) or the approach to cruising there (as I'm suggesting).

Why is that relevant to the OP (although YBW has never been that hot on sticking religiously to the original question after 160 posts!)? Simple - because if the OP is considering taking a charter boat round Scotland they might well want to consider what their tender arrangements will be - it's not their boat; it's not uncommon for charter boats to charge extra for an outboard; if they have limited space on deck they might want to consider pumps - and maybe even buying an electric pump if it's a daily activity. If they are to follow in DDB's footsteps and stick to marinas they might similarly be disappointed.

Still got nothing to do with ddb not wanting to launch and recover his dinghy single handed. He's clearly not gonna join those thousands of others who do it every day.....

At least I agree that everyone is entitled to their opinion about places they have sailed to.......

 

[Fr J Hackett]

Still got nothing to do with ddb not wanting to launch and recover his dinghy single handed. He's clearly not gonna join those thousands of others who do it every day.....

At least I agree that everyone is entitled to their opinion about places they have sailed to.......

Part of dab’s rationale was that managing a dinghy was a faff that was beyond him and it was that which was challenged in terms of being a reason not to sail the west coast of Scotland

 

[capnsensible]

Part of dab’s rationale was that managing a dinghy was a faff that was beyond him and it was that which was challenged in terms of being a reason not to sail the west coast of Scotland

We see things differently. I read Ddb making some lighthearted comments about Scotland that ruffled some Tartanista feathers.

And I see the dinghy issue differently. But of course having those different opinions keeps forums alive.....

Personally, I've really enjoyed sailing round Scotland. Even the challenge of being on a friends Prout Catamaran one very cold February for an extended weekend on the Forth. Coldest I've ever been...Methil, dark and raining. Climbing up a harbour wall, crossing some railway lines to visit a down market pub full of staring local geezers. Fortunately, I was younger, braver and my oppo was a very loud Aussie who ended up entertaining everyone.

So each to their own, eh?

 

[Daydream believer]

DDB joined a thread on going round Britain, and, as he has done on previous occassions, said (and I'm paraphrasing) Scotland was a waste of time and it all looks the same.

I have never said Scotland is a waste of time. I challenged the comments about how wonderful it is, by pointing out the repetitiveness of some of it. ( When you have seen one rocky crag you have seen them all) I pointed out the problems that I personally would have with a dinghy & mooring. But I sail SH. If one is sailing with, say, a sailing school on a round UK trip, it might be fantastic. Sailing with a group just for the camaraderie & learning, as well as piloting the area, makes a difference. Sailing it to fill in the bucket list is another reason to go.
However,
When I challenged Dunedin as to why he thought Scotland was so good his reply in#132 was not exactly enlightening.
He said that it was peace & quiet. Well, how does that work if you have kids?
Perhaps we should ask those that did it Why? Was it really for peace & quiet? Or bucket list--which really has little to do with rocky crags does it?

 

[Fr J Hackett]

I have never said Scotland is a waste of time. I challenged the comments about how wonderful it is, by pointing out the repetitiveness of some of it. ( When you have seen one rocky crag you have seen them all) I pointed out the problems that I personally would have with a dinghy & mooring. But I sail SH. If one is sailing with, say, a sailing school on a round UK trip, it might be fantastic. Sailing with a group just for the camaraderie & learning, as well as piloting the area, makes a difference. Sailing it to fill in the bucket list is another reason to go.
However,
When I challenged Dunedin as to why he thought Scotland was so good his reply in#132 was not exactly enlightening.
He said that it was peace & quiet. Well, how does that work if you have kids?
Perhaps we should ask those that did it Why? Was it really for peace & quiet? Or bucket list--which really has little to do with rocky crags does it?

Sailing the west coast of Scotland offers everything that sailing is about it can be as challenging as you want or if you prefer as sanitised as you wish. There isn’t a single aspect of sailing a yacht that is missing. It deservingly is the premier cruising ground of the UK but if you want muddy creeks or days of unrelenting sun and bikini clad damsels then it’s not for you like all the good things in life it demands a little something from you to enjoy it.

 

[srm]

Sailing the west coast of Scotland offers everything that sailing is about it can be as challenging as you want or if you prefer as sanitised as you wish. There isn’t a single aspect of sailing a yacht that is missing. It deservingly is the premier cruising ground of the UK but if you want muddy creeks or days of unrelenting sun and bikini clad damsels then it’s not for you like all the good things in life it demands a little something from you to enjoy it.

Agree totally, yet for just a little more effort and one overnight passage the west coast of Norway opens up, including lots of sheltered anchorages where one may be the only boat, no need for full foul weather gear almost every day and a few damsels clad in less than a bikini.

 

[capnsensible]

Agree totally, yet for just a little more effort and one overnight passage the west coast of Norway opens up, including lots of sheltered anchorages where one may be the only boat, no need for full foul weather gear almost every day and a few damsels clad in less than a bikini.

I enjoyed sailing in Norway. But it did rain a bit!

Plus I got to see utsire of gale warning fame up close.

 

[AntarcticPilot]

Agree totally, yet for just a little more effort and one overnight passage the west coast of Norway opens up, including lots of sheltered anchorages where one may be the only boat, no need for full foul weather gear almost every day and a few damsels clad in less than a bikini.

And a swinging cost of living! OK if you're on a Norwegian salary, but we poor Brits need to take out a mortgage to buy a beer!

 

[Bristolfashion]

I have never said Scotland is a waste of time. I challenged the comments about how wonderful it is, by pointing out the repetitiveness of some of it. ( When you have seen one rocky crag you have seen them all) I pointed out the problems that I personally would have with a dinghy & mooring. But I sail SH. If one is sailing with, say, a sailing school on a round UK trip, it might be fantastic. Sailing with a group just for the camaraderie & learning, as well as piloting the area, makes a difference. Sailing it to fill in the bucket list is another reason to go.
However,
When I challenged Dunedin as to why he thought Scotland was so good his reply in#132 was not exactly enlightening.
He said that it was peace & quiet. Well, how does that work if you have kids?
Perhaps we should ask those that did it Why? Was it really for peace & quiet? Or bucket list--which really has little to do with rocky crags does it?

1. Truly astonishing anchorages courtesy of the Antares charts - you'd never believe you can get in there! Secret pools, "cracks" between islands etc
2. Fantastic scenery from intimate coves to impressive mountain scenery.
3, Brilliant passages around & between islands & lochs
4. Wildlife - sea eagles, golden eagles, otters, dolphins & whales etc
5. (Almost) swell free sailing & always somewhere to go.
6. Intriguing canals
7. Great little treats - the most remote pub in the UK, fantastic fish, some real corkers of hotels (Colintraive inn for example) - and the best black pudding & scallop pizza EVER (Lochmaddy Hotel) and so on. Oh, and you'll find local whisky, seafood, charcuterie, preserves, beer ......
8. Brilliant towns and communities - Eigg, Tarbert, Stornoway etc
9. Lovely walking
10. Fantastic, friendly people
11. A fun mix of anchoring, mooring, traditional harbours, small community pontoons & marinas.
12. History, culture & art.

They're just some of the reasons I loved it off the top of my head - I'm sure our resident Scotland fans have more.

Oh, and a lot of the rocky crags are pretty good too!

 

[capnsensible]

And a swinging cost of living! OK if you're on a Norwegian salary, but we poor Brits need to take out a mortgage to buy a beer!

I took a case of whisky with us when we left Port Edgar.

 

[Daydream believer]

I seem to recall that general advice among yachting circles back in 2012 was to stay clear of Port Edgar. Was that the case? Perhaps they have undertaken some reconstruction of the place since.

 

[capnsensible]

I seem to recall that general advice among yachting circles back in 2012 was to stay clear of Port Edgar. Was that the case? Perhaps they have undertaken some reconstruction of the place since.

Dunno, loooong time ago!

 

[srm]

And a swinging cost of living! OK if you're on a Norwegian salary, but we poor Brits need to take out a mortgage to buy a beer!

Conversation with our local shopkeeper in Shetland after our first Norway cruise, mid 70's.
"You have been to Norway?"
"Yes"
"For five weeks?"
"Yes"
"It was expensive?"
"No, - we did all our shopping here before going and only had to buy fresh bread and milk, plus some diesel" (Drinks were stocked up duty free in Lerwick and the Norwegian customs officer kindly turned a blind eye when we checked in).

 

[Daydream believer]

1. Truly astonishing anchorages courtesy of the Antares charts - you'd never believe you can get in there! Secret pools, "cracks" between islands etc

Just so long as you do not have to exit one SH in the pitch black at night with no sight of land & no anchor winch
2. Fantastic scenery from intimate coves to impressive mountain scenery. The scenery along the NI coast up to Forth William is Ok if the mist is not hiding it. Trayvallick is pretty good too. Why go further north
3, Brilliant passages around & between islands & lochs Well there is always sounof cuin, luin & lots of lochs in the Cally canal if lochs float your boatetc
4. Wildlife - sea eagles, golden eagles, otters, dolphins & whales etc I saw a pair of Falcons chase the eagle away on Kerran Dolphins off Newlyn, & a Dolphin whale on the east coast. Did not need to go far north. My Uncle was a baliff in galashiels so showed me loads of ottars as a child. Saw him catch salmon too
5. (Almost) swell free sailing & always somewhere to go. Sort of Sailing you get from Port Ellen right through to Inverness via Cally canal then
6. Intriguing canals. Cally canal & yes I did the Norfolk broads in my dads Silhouette when I was 15 years old
7. Great little treats - the most remote pub in the UK, fantastic fish, some real corkers of hotels (Colintraive inn for example) - and the best black pudding & scallop pizza EVER (Lochmaddy Hotel) and so on. Oh, and you'll find local whisky, seafood, charcuterie, preserves, beer ......Dont eat seafood Great pizza place in Burnham Buy the whiskey in the shop in Oban& who on earth eats black pudding. Loads of pubs in the world to choose from no different to " the last one before the M25 in Thurrock" just a gimmic really
8. Brilliant towns and communities - Eigg, Tarbert, Stornoway etc Oban, Eyemouth, Berwick Upon Tweed on the way home
9. Lovely walking. Get a bus
10. Fantastic, friendly people. After your money the further north you go
11. A fun mix of anchoring, mooring, traditional harbours, small community pontoons & marinas.The only interest for that is marinas & they are few & far between
12. History, culture & art. Well on the way home go to Eyemouth. Go on the bus to berwick & walk the castle walls, If you like hiking get the bus to Wooler Walk another 10 miles ( as I had to when I was 6- many Sundays) & have a hike up Cheviot & look at it as you sail south. Or you could take a ride to holy island. But to be honest one ruined castle is a bit like the next. A ruin.

They're just some of the reasons I loved it off the top of my head - I'm sure our resident Scotland fans have more.

Yup Midges lack of readily available amenities, spa shops flogging stale food


, and a lot of the rocky crags are pretty good too! Yes but all the same & if you have seen as many as I have they get a bit- shall we say- samey

No need to go further north than the cally canal. You get the experience & less hassle.

 

[SaltIre]

I seem to recall that general advice among yachting circles back in 2012 was to stay clear of Port Edgar. Was that the case? Perhaps they have undertaken some reconstruction of the place since.

Are any of your opinions about sailing in Scotland based on recent visits?

 

[Daydream believer]

Are any of your opinions about sailing in Scotland based on recent visits?

Why? Have the rocky crags been re painted?