UK circum capable <27ft yacht?

[Stemar]

I don't think the bilge keel fans and fin keel fans are going to agree. What that means to me is that there are advantages to both. However, something like a BK Sadler 32, which should be in budget, might be a fraction slower than a fin, but put a decent set of sails on the BK and tired ones on the fin, and I know who'll be getting there first, and they can use drying harbours and anchorages.

As for timing, two months all the way round? That sounds like hard work. Far better, to my mind, to take two years over it, even if it's a week or a long weekend at a time, stopping to explore the nice places - may I suggest that Islay should take a week if you're a whisky lover - and waiting out bad weather at home.

 

[Gixer]

Moving on from the bilge keel and fin keel debate. Can we talk about size?
The original request was a sub 27f boat but people a advising 30f+ boats.
When going around the UK and every night being in a new port I would have thought a small or more manoeuvrable boat would be a huge plus when singlehanded like the op. Not necessarily the length but the extra beam and freeboard would be my worry.
From my own experience it takes longer to get from the helm to the rail on a bigger boat which can make all the difference when unexpected things happen. I know you can set up the boat and prepare but again, from my experience when you get it wrong on a bigger heavier boat its much more 'spectacular'. I'd be stressed when entering the little fishing ports in a bigger boat than a sub 27f boat.
When out of sheltered waters I always dream of a bigger, faster boat but when in ports (and antifouling) I'm happy with the 27 foot boat
These are just my thoughts and I'd be interested in others.

 

[Supertramp]

Moving on from the bilge keel and fin keel debate. Can we talk about size?
The original request was a sub 27f boat but people a advising 30f+ boats.
When going around the UK and every night being in a new port I would have thought a small or more manoeuvrable boat would be a huge plus when singlehanded like the op. Not necessarily the length but the extra beam and freeboard would be my worry.
From my own experience it takes longer to get from the helm to the rail on a bigger boat which can make all the difference when unexpected things happen. I know you can set up the boat and prepare but again, from my experience when you get it wrong on a bigger heavier boat its much more 'spectacular'. I'd be stressed when entering the little fishing ports in a bigger boat than a sub 27f boat.
When out of sheltered waters I always dream of a bigger, faster boat but when in ports (and antifouling) I'm happy with the 27 foot boat
These are just my thoughts and I'd be interested in others.

True, but depends if you plan port to port or anchoring en route. Anchoring gives more flexibility and is much less stressful than finding an unknown berth. Accepting that the N and E costs are a bit light on anchor spots.

 

[Refueler]

Moving on from the bilge keel and fin keel debate. Can we talk about size?
The original request was a sub 27f boat but people a advising 30f+ boats.
When going around the UK and every night being in a new port I would have thought a small or more manoeuvrable boat would be a huge plus when singlehanded like the op. Not necessarily the length but the extra beam and freeboard would be my worry.
From my own experience it takes longer to get from the helm to the rail on a bigger boat which can make all the difference when unexpected things happen. I know you can set up the boat and prepare but again, from my experience when you get it wrong on a bigger heavier boat its much more 'spectacular'. I'd be stressed when entering the little fishing ports in a bigger boat than a sub 27f boat.
When out of sheltered waters I always dream of a bigger, faster boat but when in ports (and antifouling) I'm happy with the 27 foot boat
These are just my thoughts and I'd be interested in others.

Totally with you there ....

I have a 25 and a 38ft ..... single handed : the 38 can be a handful coming in .... but the 25 is a doddle.

 

[MisterBaxter]

For a single-handed trip around the UK on a shorter timescale, a boat that can dry out easily would open up the options for getting a really good undisturbed sleep without needing a harbour or marina - if you dry out in some secluded cove or creek near the top of the tide you can get a solid nine or ten hours in without fretting about anchors, weather etc.

 

[dunedin]

Moving on from the bilge keel and fin keel debate. Can we talk about size?
The original request was a sub 27f boat but people a advising 30f+ boats.
When going around the UK and every night being in a new port I would have thought a small or more manoeuvrable boat would be a huge plus when singlehanded like the op. Not necessarily the length but the extra beam and freeboard would be my worry.
From my own experience it takes longer to get from the helm to the rail on a bigger boat which can make all the difference when unexpected things happen. I know you can set up the boat and prepare but again, from my experience when you get it wrong on a bigger heavier boat its much more 'spectacular'. I'd be stressed when entering the little fishing ports in a bigger boat than a sub 27f boat.
When out of sheltered waters I always dream of a bigger, faster boat but when in ports (and antifouling) I'm happy with the 27 foot boat
These are just my thoughts and I'd be interested in others.

For parking in unfamiliar harbours not sure there is much advantage in 27 foot vs 32 foot.
Avoiding a long keel and instead a fin (or bilge) keel for manoeverability is more important IMHO. And bigger is generally more stable and comfortable (hence again Concerto Fulmar a great compromise for such a trip - fast, comfortable and stable).

And as get bigger the method changes - by time reach 38-40 foot ideally a bow thruster with remote control, and change to using a mid rope to the genoa winch rather than hopping off onto pontoons.

 

[dunedin]

For a single-handed trip around the UK on a shorter timescale, a boat that can dry out easily would open up the options for getting a really good undisturbed sleep without needing a harbour or marina - if you dry out in some secluded cove or creek near the top of the tide you can get a solid nine or ten hours in without fretting about anchors, weather etc.

Where are all these drying harbours that people seem to think are so important? Going round Britain in a coupe of months need to be happy to do 60+ mile days when the weather suits. Most places other than the middle of East coast have plenty of deep water harbours.

 

[ridgy]

I think most people, with a range of experience across boat sizes, would agree that there isn't much difference in parking a 27 foot over 32 foot, especially older 32 boats in the OPs price range that will have modest freeboard and beam compared to newer models. However the difference in comfort both in port and at sea is substantial.plus the speed of course.

 

[Chiara’s slave]

There are some bad and some very good examples ... like anything else.

Maybe look at some of the other suggestions ?? Same age of boat ... no shudders with them ??

I’m fairly familiar with the Centaur. It’s not the quality of any specific example, I just find the whole design has not aged well. They’re cheap cos they’re a paid up member of the not that good at anything club. Not as good at motoring or shelter as a motor sailer, (like Super Anne) but sails not much, if any better, chiefly. I’d take a Contessa or Nic 26 any day, and I can’t say I’m much of a fan of either. Contessa hit the sweet spot with the 32, but it’s a thug of a boat to handle solo.the 26 is underpowered until it’s definitely not… out of all the suggestions the Hunter would get my vote. If I was considering doing the trip in a cruiser that won’t go to windward (which I would not, until I’m too old to grind) I might consider something vaguely comfortable with 2 hulls.

 

[Chiara’s slave]

I think most people, with a range of experience across boat sizes, would agree that there isn't much difference in parking a 27 foot over 32 foot, especially older 32 boats in the OPs price range that will have modest freeboard and beam compared to newer models. However the difference in comfort both in port and at sea is substantial.plus the speed of course.

As long as that 32 isn’t a Contessa, you’re right. But they would exclude themselves on budget. You’d barely buy one with a 6ft hole in the bottom for 30k

 

[Refueler]

I showed the Wife a few photos of interior of an Eclipse 43 ..... her response was when am I buying it !!

Given that I am investing in property at present - it may be a year or so before I do !

 

[Supertramp]

I’m fairly familiar with the Centaur. It’s not the quality of any specific example, I just find the whole design has not aged well. They’re cheap cos they’re a paid up member of the not that good at anything club. Not as good at motoring or shelter as a motor sailer, (like Super Anne) but sails not much, if any better, chiefly. I’d take a Contessa or Nic 26 any day, and I can’t say I’m much of a fan of either. Contessa hit the sweet spot with the 32, but it’s a thug of a boat to handle solo.the 26 is underpowered until it’s definitely not… out of all the suggestions the Hunter would get my vote. If I was considering doing the trip in a cruiser that won’t go to windward (which I would not, until I’m too old to grind) I might consider something vaguely comfortable with 2 hulls.

In defence of Centaurs and based on many cruises around the W and N Scottish coasts in one, they look after you in weather well beyond their pay grade. Twin keels have some benefits off the wind and a 25hp Volvo was useful to get round adverse headlands. Forgiving to beginners but capable when competent. My concern would be finding one with sound hull, keels, engine and rig.

A cruising catamaran would be interesting but not for the inexperienced and probably outdone to windward by a Centaur!

If time is king, windward performance really matters (Fulmar, Sadler, Ben/Jen/Bav 30-32ft). If you can wait for favourable weather, it's less critical.

Really you just need a capable, well found boat that you are happy with and have confidence in.

 

[Pye_End]

My personal round UK experience in a 26fter (56 days, via Caledonian, mix of single handed and 2 up, long keel, clockwise from Kent) a couple of years ago, I did not at all miss the ability to take the ground. If you take more time and want to explore more then I could see the attraction in a few places. Depends on what you are trying to do.

2/3 of the time there was not a particularly fair wind. Not impressive hard on the wind or in significant seas, but a comfortable motion and a boat well found and set up for the difficult times. This, for our trip, was probably a more useful feature - ie not overly concerned about rising wind (particularly across the Bristol channel, the Irish Sea and up to Scotland). From Peterhead passage had to be made with a minimum of F6 in the forecast as it was set in for the foreseeable, and fast (for us), long leg to England was made in largely F7 conditions, and allowed us at last (in July) to stop the need to keep pressing the Eberspacher 'on' button. Shorts came out in Yorkshire.

For singlehanded, I am more than content with a 26 footer, long keeler. 1.2m draft handy getting into a couple of places.

For 2, it was fine, especially for that time frame. Much longer and a bit more space would have been nice at times. Also, it would probably be harder if the crew was friend rather than family. Tried to make best speed given what we were doing, but didn't particularly miss a faster speed of a bigger boat - just worked with what we had. To me, the benefit of being in well found and sea kindly yacht was the more important feature. Some of the legs we made were quite long - others could avoid the length of most of these if wanted. Fin keel may well have reduced a few of the passage times, and perhaps have made us more likely to set sail to particularly troublesome days to get better VMG, but I would have to study the logs and think hard about that one.

I agree that engine hours were higher than I had expected.

A thoroughly enjoyable and interesting trip.

 

[Stemar]

I showed the Wife a few photos of interior of an Eclipse 43 ..... her response was when am I buying it !!

Given that I am investing in property at present - it may be a year or so before I do !

That could well find itself on my short list for a lottery win boat. Very nice.

 

[MisterBaxter]

@ Pye_End there's a passage in one of Claud Worth's books where he's discussing passage planning, and he talks about the desirability of boats in which you can cruise 'free from morbid anxiety about the weather'.

 

[Refueler]

That could well find itself on my short list for a lottery win boat. Very nice.

Myself and an Admirals Cup guy had the chance to sail one round to South of France for an owner years ago ... we had a few beers with the owner and it was only later we realised what we had turned down !!

It has always had a sweet spot in my list ... don't care for the 33 or 38 - they are poor relations IMHO. The 43 has it all.

 

[doug748]

I'm with the others, almost any boat could do the trip. When the great Tilman was asked how to join an expedition he replied: "Strap your boots on and go"

I hope the OP gets what he wants and sails off but, as a general observation, these threads often descend into a playground melee where the instigator walks off and keeps his head down. The usual barmpots then start sounding off about boats they are not fond of, maybe in order to validate some internal fetish, who knows?

Anyway, In a short time Seagull has asked a series of questions about buying power boats, steel boats, obscure Continental brands, racing yachts and motor sailors. Nowt wrong with that but good advice might be to get something the family can enjoy, test it and himself over a couple of seasons and, if going around the UK stills seems and attractive proposition, go for it.

Just for the look of the thing, for my pick, a Westerly Konsort would do the trick:

Westerly Konsort archive data - Yachtsnet Ltd. online UK yacht brokers - yacht brokerage and boat sales


.

 

[Refueler]

I’m fairly familiar with the Centaur. It’s not the quality of any specific example, I just find the whole design has not aged well. They’re cheap cos they’re a paid up member of the not that good at anything club. Not as good at motoring or shelter as a motor sailer, (like Super Anne) but sails not much, if any better, chiefly. I’d take a Contessa or Nic 26 any day, and I can’t say I’m much of a fan of either. Contessa hit the sweet spot with the 32, but it’s a thug of a boat to handle solo.the 26 is underpowered until it’s definitely not… out of all the suggestions the Hunter would get my vote. If I was considering doing the trip in a cruiser that won’t go to windward (which I would not, until I’m too old to grind) I might consider something vaguely comfortable with 2 hulls.

The Centaur headed up a range of boats that were very popular and sold well ... they took not only single handers but also families on cruises that before were literally dreams.
I can remember at Fareham Club ... like many clubs - the usual size of boat was 21 - 23ft ... along came a Centaur and the Club had a BBQ party with the boat alongside the old army pontoon for all to have a look at ... 26ft !! WOW ... No stopping that guy now.

The Centaur was one of the most popular cruising boats .... followed by the Colvics .. Mirage ... etc.

 

[Chiara’s slave]

I'm with the others, almost any boat could do the trip. When the great Tilman was asked how to join an expedition he replied: "Strap your boots on and go"

I hope the OP gets what he wants and sails off but, as a general observation, these threads often descend into a playground melee where the instigator walks off and keeps his head down. The usual barmpots then start sounding off about boats they are not fond of, maybe in order to validate some internal fetish, who knows?

Anyway, In a short time Seagull has asked a series of questions about buying power boats, steel boats, obscure Continental brands, racing yachts and motor sailors. Nowt wrong with that but good advice might be to get something the family can enjoy, test it and himself over a couple of seasons and, if going around the UK stills seems and attractive proposition, go for it.

Just for the look of the thing, for my pick, a Westerly Konsort would do the trick:

Westerly Konsort archive data - Yachtsnet Ltd. online UK yacht brokers - yacht brokerage and boat sales


.

That is a righteous little boat, it would do the trip, and much more. Substantially quicker and nicer to sail than my pet hate up there.

The Centaur was of it’s time. Not everything that merely served it’s purpose in years gone by is still worth it today. A bit like claiming a Vauxhall Viva is a fine classic car.

 

[Refueler]

I'm with the others, almost any boat could do the trip. When the great Tilman was asked how to join an expedition he replied: "Strap your boots on and go"

I hope the OP gets what he wants and sails off but, as a general observation, these threads often descend into a playground melee where the instigator walks off and keeps his head down. The usual barmpots then start sounding off about boats they are not fond of, maybe in order to validate some internal fetish, who knows?

Anyway, In a short time Seagull has asked a series of questions about buying power boats, steel boats, obscure Continental brands, racing yachts and motor sailors. Nowt wrong with that but good advice might be to get something the family can enjoy, test it and himself over a couple of seasons and, if going around the UK stills seems and attractive proposition, go for it.

Just for the look of the thing, for my pick, a Westerly Konsort would do the trick:

Westerly Konsort archive data - Yachtsnet Ltd. online UK yacht brokers - yacht brokerage and boat sales


.

If I was to stick in that size range .. and wanted only to cruise - the Konsort and its stablemate - the Duo would be high on my list.

But I would first make sure the keel reinforcement had been done.