True costs - sorry another dream chaser

[NE_Jonny]

Hi,

I've been a dinghy sailor since childhood. I'm in NE England with a family of 5. I am chasing my dream of yacht (!) ownership. I've got much investigation ahead of me which will include taking loads of advice, and what better place to start? I figure I can afford about £10k for a used boat to sail around the beautiful Northumberland coast with the family, including some overnights. We can hack roughing it (regular campers) so currently assume 26-30 footer. Does that sound fair? Never been on a bigger boat at all but I am looking forward to training. Is RYA day sailor enough.

The real point? Before I chase this dream I'd better know it's achievable (if tough). What are the real regular costs of ownership? I don't mean what if the engine blows or the sails get destroyed etc. I mean fees, insurances, servicing, what else?

All advice gratefully received. I don't have any bigger boat friends...yet.


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[webcraft]

We have an Albin Vega 27ft 4 berth, 30 years old - cost £11,000 original engine, useable sails and some useful gear (eg wind generator, windlass). You can modify the saloon easily to include a pilot berth to sleep 5 if one or two of them are youngish children.

A boat like this can take you anywhere from a potter down the coast for the day to round the world. We have just circumnavigated Ireland in ours.

Other seaworthy boats in this size and price range include the Halcyon 27, see one <font size=1><A target="_blank" HREF=http://www.bluemoment.com>http://www.bluemoment.com</font size=1>

 

[robbieg]

Bear in mind with an old boat (indeed any boat!)something is always going to go wrong. Some things you can live with, some you can fix yourself but others you may feel you need help with. Bit like a building project work out what you expect the cost to be & add a %-I use 15%. Still nearly always underestimate but its nearer to the true cost.

As regards specific costs you may want to think about:

1. Purchase costs-survey £300/haul out £150-£180.
2. Safety kit for the boat, lifejackets/flares etc unless they come with the boat.
3. Radio course & licence £80-100.

Hope this is of some help.

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[ex-Gladys]

We did the same thing last year (not 5 kids mind or in the NE). You will need to look at a lot of boats to meet your goal. The price seems to bear no relation to the condition; we saw several that we just turned around and walked away from because they looked as if they'd been abandoned and were in a shocking state. 26-30ft for £10k will be stretching. Change your requirements into "we need x berths, y draft, z would be nice". GO and look at a few boats as areality check soon. Marina based brokers are a good starting point as they will usually have several on site.

<hr width=100% size=1>Larry Botheras

Anderson 26 "Amber"

 

[bendyone]

A lot of people go sailing in small old boats, It is sad that today you must have a 35 foot boat as a started boat.
Look at old Westerley's, Sabres, Snapdragons, or Colvics. you will find a good 5/6 berth boat for around 10K. If possible look at winter staorage costs - would it be possible to trail it home for the winter?
Best of luck with your search

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[graham]

I agree that the Vega and Halcyon are excellent boats but will be very cramped with 5 aboard .Westerly Centaur or Colvic sailor26 would fit the bill.Not as quick as the other two but.

Strong seaworthy 5 berth galley and toilet.Bilge keel s can make drying moorings available which are cheaper than those that stay afloat all the time.

Usually a yacht club mooring is far cheaper than a marina.

Check out the moorings available in your area before you buy a boat.

My Yacht club charges £150 /year for family membership and £10/foot /year for swinging or fore and aft river moorings.

Theres a wide variation in mooring costs.If moorings are very cheap try to find out why.

Most things are a compromise but you cant compromise safety.Budget about £50 each for a gas lifejacket with harness. Ones left on boats after being sold need looking at carefully by an expert.About £75 for coastal flares.and maybe £40 for a man over board buoy.

If the standing rigging is of uncertain age (over 10 years)the insurance co may insist on replacement (about £700).

Im not trying to put you off ,just to help you consider the facts.If the whole family are into it then you can save the cost of a holiday abroad which would finance your boat for a year if carefully budgetted.

Best Wishes Graham



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[Stemar]

I did this last year with half your budget, but needing less room. From my experience, may I suggest that if your total budget is £10000, you try not to pay more than around £8000 - £8500.

That way, any unforeseen expenses are more likely to be incidents than disasters, and on an old boat there will be unforeseen expenses, even with a full survey. Surveys do have their uses, but most surveys I's seen (not many, admittedly) are more interesting for what they exclude than for what they cover.

Anyway good luck!

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[NE_Jonny]

Thanks to you all for some very good replies.

I can't believe Clubs can be cheaper than Dinghy clubs! Also not 5 kids, 3's enough.

I think the message is running costs are more than I hoped, but better to know that now than promise the accountant it'll be cheap and then get into diffulty later so thanks for that. She's the only one not yet convinced anyway.

How long does rigging last (all of it) and motors for that matter. Most private ads appear to refer to "new this and that" implying refits are regular affairs.

Also what is the norm for wintering boats of this size. My dinghy guy takes bigger boats but is that the norm, wintering in a barn?

Thanks again for the really helpful comments.

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[copterdoctor]

The life of rigging is about 15 years (depends on demands of insurance company). My boat stays on the water for all but three weeks a year, I resent paying for two places to park at once.
My engine is over 20 years old.
The truth is sailing CAN cost more than you expect but is worth every penny.

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[ex-Gladys]

Standing rigging lasts 10 years (according to insurance companies), running you replace as you need, probab;y bits every year. Engines last until the parts or rebuild get too expensive. Ours is (unnecessarily) on her second engine in 22 yrs. Previous Owner upgraded for more power... we now have an over propped, over powered boat. 20 years is nothing for a well maintained diesel. Sails will last longer than racing dinghy sails. We have some of Ambers 22 yr old originals... again replaced by PO....

Winter storage is usuallu ashore but outside. Nice to be in if possible. Half the year out allegedly helps osmosis onset....

<hr width=100% size=1>Larry Botheras

Anderson 26 "Amber"

 

[pragmatist]

When we sailed on the E Coast there were many cheap older boats - it's a bit of a disappointment in Devon to discover they seem mostly to start at 35-40 feet and be new - but then the horrific prices charged for moorings and marinas is probably to blame.

We had a swinging mooring in a nature reserve for £160 pa and our 26 footer cost less than £5k - sailed appallingly but had ample room for a family of 5 and gave us 3 seasons fun before we could afford something which sailed better.

Buy cheaply and go and have fun ! Nearly 2 decades later we're still hooked.
(oh and we fitted 2 large dogs in as well as 4 of us)

<hr width=100% size=1>a pragmatist is an optimist with a boat in the UK