Tiller Pilot advise...

[onesea]

Question for you all...

Having had minimal experience with tiller pilots...

I am considering one for a 35 foot 3/4 tonner about 4.5 Disp all up. Usage Coastal cruising very amateur ish racing...

She is a handful for one without pilot and with 2 it could make life easier.

She has Raymarine wind gear so I have been thinking Raymarine.

Off the shelf I guess it is the choice between:
Raymarine ST2000 at around £420
And the:
SPX5 at about £1000

How much of a pain are they to rig and unrig when not in use?

With tiller pilots do you have to take them off the tiller if you want to steer manually for any reason. What do you do with them??

The rudder is semi balanced with S/S stick inside S/S tube going through counter..

There is plenty of space down there, is there an option I could put a quadrant down there so I can just push button and Pilot is On/ Off?

Advice thoughts ideas appreciated...

 

[AngusMcDoon]

If you want to steer manually you just lift the pushrod off the pin on the tiller and let the tillerpilot just dangle or spin it out of the way.

Not suitable for using on a quadrant as you won't be able to steer manually without going below and lifting it off the pin.

When not in use I and I guess everyone else unrig them and put them somewhere safe. It takes moments - unscrew the plug and lift off.

They have a reputation for not being waterproof. I protect mine in a raincoat.

It sounds like you need a beefier below deck pilot system which will cost you ££££.

 

[greenalien]

Of the two you mention, I'd go for the SPX-5 - the 2000 is going to be at the limits of its capabilities.

 

[Picks]

Just a small note to add. When you remove the pilot to steer manually press the Auto/Set ( or equivalent button on yours ) otherwise the tiller pilot will still be trying to steer the original course and will start beeping angrily at you!!

 

[Tranona]

You are on the margins with that size boat. It really depends on what you want to use the pilot for. If it is just to hold a course while you setand adjust sails or relax in light airs or under motor, then a 2000 will probably do. However, it is unlikely to cope with heavier going.

You will find them quite easy to use, and it might be worth getting a 2000 and see how it goes - given the big price differential. If it is really not up to it you can always sell it and buy the more powerful unit.

 

[prv]

The rudder is semi balanced with S/S stick inside S/S tube going through counter..

There is plenty of space down there, is there an option I could put a quadrant down there so I can just push button and Pilot is On/ Off?

If you have access to the rudder shaft below deck then you could fit a quadrant and ram there and have push-button control. Certainly the Rolls-Royce solution, at a price. At this point it's no longer a tillerpilot though - it's identical to what a boat with a wheel would use, and just called a "below decks" pilot.

Do consider the implications of the water-level in your stainless tube if there's no seal at the bottom end of it, though

Pete

 

[barnaclephill]

You are on the margins with that size boat. It really depends on what you want to use the pilot for. ..... However, it is unlikely to cope with heavier going.

might be worth getting a 2000 and see how it goes - given the big price differential. If it is really not up to it you can always sell it and buy the more powerful unit.

Mounting issues easy-peasy as in the previous post or 2.

2nd paragraph: if the a/p you use isn't up to the job, you can attach it to a trim tab as in a previous PBO article (with user feedback): http://s1064.photobucket.com/albums/u367/boatscans/#!cpZZ2QQtppZZ24

It's the article on page 2, titled "Self steering with a servo" or Vanes 31; 32 and 33 in my scanning endeavours.
Hope this helps.

 

[Pete7]

If you have access to the rudder shaft below deck then you could fit a quadrant and ram there and have push-button control. Certainly the Rolls-Royce solution, at a price. At this point it's no longer a tillerpilot though - it's identical to what a boat with a wheel would use, and just called a "below decks" pilot.

Do consider the implications of the water-level in your stainless tube if there's no seal at the bottom end of it, though Pete

How would you disconnect it when you need to move around a marina? turning it off doesn't reduce the load which you would hve to push against.

Our ST2000 is connected to the tiller, although we also have wheel steering. With a 5100kgs cruising weight the ST2000 copes with the boat and the extra resistance for the wheel etc without a problem. Its a great piece of kit, completely independant of everything else and just works. Would love a spare ST2000 but the second hand price is nearly as much as a new one.

Pete

 

[AngusMcDoon]

How would you disconnect it when you need to move around a marina? turning it off doesn't reduce the load which you would hve to push against.

On the below deck ones with a remote control box, when you press the standby button something somewhere below in the works goes clunk, and it is then disconnected for manual steering.

Different mechanism to the tillerpilotds.

 

[snooks]

It's the article on page 2, titled "Self steering with a servo" or Vanes 31; 32 and 33 in my scanning endeavours.

Don't let something like infringement of copyright spoil your day...

 

[Pete7]

On the below deck ones with a remote control box, when you press the standby button something somewhere below in the works goes clunk, and it is then disconnected for manual steering.

Different mechanism to the tillerpilotds.

I thought we were talking about an ST2000 which you couldn't do this with. The OP did ask about the ST2000 or the SP5.

Pete

 

[wiggy]

I've got the SPX5 on Beneteau First 31.7 great bit of kit, keeps an excellent course which I think is due to the Rate Gyro Compass, vastly superior to the st2000.

 

[AngusMcDoon]

I thought we were talking about an ST2000 which you couldn't do this with. The OP did ask about the ST2000 or the SP5.

Pete

He was, but I like rambling, digressing and generally drifting about.

 

[onesea]

Don't let something like infringement of copyright spoil your day...

Snooks do not panic, it did not help where I am I cannot get photo bucket ebay and various others So will book mark page till I get home UNless some one can PM me

He was, but I like rambling, digressing and generally drifting about.

Yeah but also you hit the nail on hte head I guessed there wold be special units out there that did that sort of thing... Below Decks unit I now know what to Google.
For that one I would need to do some home work, strengths of supports and costs etc.. Not certain what I have down there that will take the loadings of of small quadrant, compared with long tiller...

You are on the margins with that size boat. It really depends on what you want to use the pilot for. If it is just to hold a course while you setand adjust sails or relax in light airs or under motor, then a 2000 will probably do. However, it is unlikely to cope with heavier going.

You will find them quite easy to use, and it might be worth getting a 2000 and see how it goes - given the big price differential. If it is really not up to it you can always sell it and buy the more powerful unit.

I like your thinking RE cheaper and selling it as presently I only envisage para 1 but...

You know who these things go...

Thanks for all the advise

 

[lustyd]

I feel someone needs to add that the weight or mass of your yacht is utterly irrelevant to these devices since the device doesn't steer the boat. Your tiller and rudder will continue to steer the boat and as such it is the force required to move the tiller that would change and this is not necessarily related to boat size or weight but rather the design of the system. If your boat can be steered in any weather using your little finger then you don't need anything more than the lowest model. If on the other hand you need two people pushing with all their might then none of the models will help you.

Does anyone know for a fact that the higher models are capable of more thrust? The article in the mags recently Appeared to use a 40kg scale and concluded that the thrust was 40kg so wasn't convinced of that!

 

[prv]

How would you disconnect it when you need to move around a marina? turning it off doesn't reduce the load which you would hve to push against.

Yes it absolutely does. When you put it in standby the motor is disconnected from the moving parts. It probably adds some tiny amount of drag, but not enough that I've ever noticed.

Your mistake is in thinking I was suggesting improvising using a tillerpilot, when I specifically said this application would require a "below decks" pilot. This issue is precisely why I said that.

Pete

 

[lustyd]

Forgot to add, a friend of mine uses a tp10 bottom of the range one on a 40 footer and that coped fine on a trip to Scotland in a F7 which is what leads me to this scepticism

 

[prv]

He was, but I like rambling, digressing and generally drifting about.

Yeah but also you hit the nail on hte head I guessed there wold be special units out there that did that sort of thing... Below Decks unit I now know what to Google.

I think I've just been Lakesailored

Pete

 

[snooks]

Forgot to add, a friend of mine uses a tp10 bottom of the range one on a 40 footer and that coped fine on a trip to Scotland in a F7 which is what leads me to this scepticism

Guess it depends on how you set your sails and the balance of the rudder.

A modern boat with a fully balanced spade rudder, flat sails, well reefed with the main sheet down the track, very little pressure on the rudder...Older boat unbalanced rudder, shagged sails, over canvassed with no main sheet track will be a different animal altogether

 

[lustyd]

Guess it depends on how you set your sails and the balance of the rudder.

A modern boat with a fully balanced spade rudder, flat sails, well reefed with the main sheet down the track, very little pressure on the rudder...Older boat unbalanced rudder, shagged sails, over canvassed with no main sheet track will be a different animal altogether

But again, not related to the weight of the boat so a bit of common sense can be applied to the purchase.