The pro's and cons of steel boat building

[Tranona]

Because plastic is extremely heavily promoted ,giving the impression that it is one's only option, and because steel options are based on grossly outdated building methods, making them prohibitively expensive to buy or build ,and because conclusions about steel are based on poorly built, painted, maintained or designed boats, not on the better ones.

Will you please stop calling GRP "plastic" It is a moulded composite.

The almost universal use of gRP for leisure boat hulls is absolutely nothing to do with "promotion". Not only do you display a high degree of ignorance on amany other things, you clearly have not got a clue about what motivates people to choose one product over another. Human beings are in general rational intelligent beings and if they choose GRP it it is because the product satisfies their needs.

You may think you are smart by implying that all these people are idiots because they choose something different from you, but in fact all you are doing is denying their intelligence by claiming that you know better.

IF your boats were so superior, everybody would buy them, but they are not and people don't.

 

[Brent Swain]

GRP stands for " Glass reinforced PLASTIC!
Got it ? Keep reading this until you do.
Yes, more advertising and promotion means more sales ,or they wouldn't bother advertising and promoting, period!
People kept believing the world was flat , for thousands of years. Did that automatically make it a "Superior " theory?

 

[john_morris_uk]

YOU are making a fool of yourself again, suggesting that little thing, is the equivalent of a full sized barge, tied solidly to a dock, or that little toothpick is the equivalent of a meter diameter, first growth fir log 14 meters long, in a swell, or suggesting that plastic boats never hit anything. Any builder can show off, by building the bow of a plastic boat 100mm thick, then making sure all videos are of the boat hitting that spot only ,or implying that plastic boats can't hit something on a dark, moonless or foggy night, if the skipper is "Plastic boat infallible." as you imply all are.
I remember meeting Patrick in Tahiti in 73, on 'Trismus" a copy of Berrnard's "Joshua" a 39ft steel boat.I later heard he dragged on to Rangiroa in a hurricane , and abandoned her when she filled thru a vent. Ten years later the locals refloated her and beagn using her to move coconuts around .
What became of Patrick? He was lost without a trace, while crossing the Atlantic in a plastic boat!

I don’t think you’ve watched the video as if you watch it properly you’ll see that they tried collisions at various angles and against various parts of the hull.

And don’t tell me that sailing at hull speed into rocks (at various angles) isn’t a proper test and as bad as any wild scenario you have described. They sailed the keel onto the rocks at hull speed as well as the bow and the side of the boat. Sailing into rocks or a steel barge or large floating log; they’re all as bad as each other or you might argue the rock is worst.?

If you wish to keep using the term plastic please add the glass reinforced bit. The strongest layups try to minimise the resin and have maximum glass in the Composite. You’d be better to refer to boats built of resin and glass or carbon fibres as Composite boats.

You’re rather childish (IMHO) attempts to use ‘plastic’ as a loaded term in such a derogatory way doesn’t help your argument.

Perhaps other people should refer to all steel boats as ‘rust buckets’ or ‘tin sheds that float’? We don’t because it would be just as silly.

 

[DownWest]

Actually Brent should, by his own reasoning, refer to his boats as iron, since that is the main component of steel. More so than resin (plastic..) is in a GRP hull. But then, he is not interested in reason.

 

[Mister E]

BS it should be Glass Reinforced Polyester.
As that was what was used.

 

[JumbleDuck]

By what they have already survived. Try a steel pickaxe on a piece of standard 12 meter plastic hull , then try a fibreglass pickaxe on a piece of 3/16th steel plate.

Why? Are there many flailing pickaxes floating around the oceans?

 

[JumbleDuck]

GRP stands for " Glass reinforced PLASTIC!

I know. It's a terrible name. because in fact the glass does almost all of the load carrying and the plastic is just there to support and protect it.

 

[bbg]

Oh, the irony. BS will not like this:

http://www.ybw.com/forums/showthrea...cht-what-would-you-pick&p=6516928#post6516928

 

[daveyw]

Steel is recyclable. At the end of its life a steel yacht can be broken up and the steel reused. What do we do with old grp?

 

[dom]

Oh, the irony. BS will not like this:

http://www.ybw.com/forums/showthrea...cht-what-would-you-pick&p=6516928#post6516928

That's not fair, the Irish Sea is lacking in the reefs necessary to hold such vessels up!

 

[[70521]]

By what they have already survived. Try a steel pickaxe on a piece of standard 12 meter plastic hull , then try a fibreglass pickaxe on a piece of 3/16th steel plate.
A 303 British will shoot thru 23 inches of douglas fir ,but barely make it thru 3/8th steel plate. Haven't tried the fibreglass comparison. Give it a try, and give us the results. Should be interesting .

Not a good test as I've not encountered either a steel or fiberglass pickaxe floating at sea.

 

[newtothis]

A 303 British will shoot thru 23 inches of douglas fir ,but barely make it thru 3/8th steel plate. Haven't tried the fibreglass comparison. Give it a try, and give us the results. Should be interesting .

Brent, until your tin can survives a bunker buster or MOAB, your ordnance challenges are somewhat redundant. There's a much chance of being shot at sea by either, so why don't you set up a real challenge? Float your bathtub over here and I'm sure the Royal Artillery will test your theory for you.

 

[GHA]

Oh, the irony. BS will not like this:

http://www.ybw.com/forums/showthrea...cht-what-would-you-pick&p=6516928#post6516928

No mention of why it went down..?

 

[Tranona]

GRP stands for " Glass reinforced PLASTIC!
Got it ? Keep reading this until you do.
Yes, more advertising and promotion means more sales ,or they wouldn't bother advertising and promoting, period!
People kept believing the world was flat , for thousands of years. Did that automatically make it a "Superior " theory?

You are such a simplistic person. do you seriously think that people buy things just because of promotion and advertising.

The characteristics of the products are well known. Steel has been on offer (and heavily promoted, not least by you) for decades - and still almost nobody builds boats from it..

Nothing to do with "theory" of flat earth, all to do with empirical evidence. GRP boats dominate the market because the evidence shows that on balance it is the best material for the job, and nothing you say changes that.

Other materials may have specific advantages that might appeal for some uses, but also have disadvantages that make them less suitable for others. This is exactly the case with steel for leisure yachts. The disadvantages far outweigh the advantages, so people make a conscious choice not to use steel.

Nothing you say will ever change this. The ultimate decision makers - buyers - have already decided.

 

[bbg]

No mention of why it went down..?

Too much water inside?

 

[solent clown]

you know those steel boat drivers, always looking for stuff to hit. I think they tend to stay close to stuff so they can grab it quick in case they sail off the end of the flat earth.

 

[JumbleDuck]

Meh. Steel is for wusses. If you want a really strong boat, go for ferrocement. Sure, there is some steel in there, but most of it is basically stone, and every single time a steel ship has tried its luck with the Isle of Portland, the stone won.

 

[GHA]

Meh. Steel is for wusses. If you want a really strong boat, go for ferrocement. Sure, there is some steel in there, but most of it is basically stone, and every single time a steel ship has tried its luck with the Isle of Portland, the stone won.

The boat I'm in now is apparently the only boat, out of must have been a lot, which didn't sink in Portland harbour in the 1987 big storm. Imagine, all those really tough plastic boats everyone has been banging on about and a steel one was the one which didn't sink? Strange things happen, eh

 

[Robin]

The boat I'm in now is apparently the only boat, out of must have been a lot, which didn't sink in Portland harbour in the 1987 big storm. Imagine, all those really tough plastic boats everyone has been banging on about and a steel one was the one which didn't sink? Strange things happen, eh

Just as my Liz 30 on an exposed Poole mooring did also when all around foundered. It also survived a rough ride in the western approaches during Fastnet 79

My W33 survived a fight with Poole Bar buoy too when it hit it at hull speed some years later despite being holed (just above the waterline) by the steel blades forming the cone shape of the starboard buoy.The 'hole was cut out and expertly replaced by a custom moulded patch, no welding required, no repair visible. The 'hole' hung on my office wall for several years thereafter.

 

[alant]

By what they have already survived. Try a steel pickaxe on a piece of standard 12 meter plastic hull , then try a fibreglass pickaxe on a piece of 3/16th steel plate.
A 303 British will shoot thru 23 inches of douglas fir ,but barely make it thru 3/8th steel plate. Haven't tried the fibreglass comparison. Give it a try, and give us the results. Should be interesting .

I was on a Beneteau first 40.7, when it mightily thumped a steel buoy in the Solent, at about midships, with no obvious damage, due I suspect to the hull shape being well rounded at that area. If it had been a flat section convinced it would have holed & possibly sunk. Early 'plastic' dinghies were changed from chine (plywood design) to round bilge, when built, an example being Ian Proctor's Wayfarer & his first 'plastic' Kestrel, which have similar sizes, but design adapted to suit material. So 'strength' isn't simply a material issue.