Talking of Rockets up Jacksies

[PaulF]

Tom Issit raised the title in his response to the mailing query, but he also raised the subject of breath tests in his editorial, this is followed by an article in Wavelength.

I certainly think we dont need this legislation but as it looks like we ARE going to get it. What I found dissapointing, to say the least, is that the RYA are backing the scheme, so it applies only to motorboats that exceed 17 knots. Just a touch discriminatory huh?
This is also damn silly, a drunk in charge of a 20ton sailing yacht in a harbour is every bit as likely to cause damage as a drunk on a personal waterbike. Navigation wise the same things apply. If drunk you are not fit to skipper anything.

David Jamieson is the Cabinet Minister involved but we have to voice opinion via our own MP's.
Done mine already. If you dont know who he or she is, key in David Jamieson MP into Google and an MP search link comes up.

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[Deleted User YDKXO]

Its shameful as you say for the RYA to support this proposal as its totally discriminatory and probably says a great deal about the RYA's natural bias against motorboating - they even abandoned the motor cruising comittee last year
And who exactly is going to police this system? The poor old rozzers have a hard enough time prosecuting retailers selling in lbs and oz as well as protecting Muslim clerics so I guess its not going to be them although its got to be a good excuse for some jobsworth to splash out a bit of taxpayers dosh on some whizzy new enforcement boats. Seeing as its only 17kn+ motorboats that are being targeted, they going to have to be tooled up with something quick, maybe a Sunseeker Superhawk or a flame logo'd Cigarette
Either way, one thing's for sure, its more of our money down the drain in the name of political correctness

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[milltech]

HOWEVER, I was particularly upset some years ago whe my neighbour who runs a commercial livery yard, was valued commercially for rates and in his defence against it cited all the other people in the area who took in liveries. I gave notice to our three because I didn't want my house commercially rated.

The point to the story is that whilst it might be unfair only to penalise boats over 17 knots, it advantages nobody to claim one is being discrimated against if the end result is that the new law gets applied to everyone.



<hr width=100% size=1>John
<A target="_blank" HREF=http://www.allgadgets.co.uk>http://www.allgadgets.co.uk</A>

 

[Deleted User YDKXO]

If its going to be applied, which is a nonsense of course, then it should be universally applied

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[cptshed]

I couldnt agree more with your thoughts,but,I wonder who's gonna have to pay for the joy of having more fuzz whizzing around in fast boats?........Perhaps.....Gatso's in the estuary 8knt limit.....or......RED DESIEL INCREASE!!!!!!!!
Maybe we should all take up morris dancing instead. Oh no, cant say morris dancing,only perfomed by male gender,not politically correct.....any other ideas?

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[Tomsk]

Morris Dancing IS politically correct as it is performed by both genders. It is mainly the Cotswolds style of morris dance (I think) that does not allow female dancers... Northwest, Border and many others allow both genders... and then there are the female only teams that don't allow men..

Ooops perhaps I shouldn't admit that I know this! /forums/images/icons/blush.gif

<hr width=100% size=1>Tomsk -

What the hell... it's only money!

 

[milltech]

Well you can be over the limit in charge of a horse on the Queens Highway, or on foot on the Queens Highway, so universality is not 100% even on the roads. I think cogent argument against the law is a better way forward than claiming discrimination which invites universality so all may suffer, that's all.



<hr width=100% size=1>John
<A target="_blank" HREF=http://www.allgadgets.co.uk>http://www.allgadgets.co.uk</A>

 

[simongoldthorpe]

Damn good reason to cancel membership of RYA.............

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[duncan]

think you will find there are offenses in law for both these John, and in particular areas you don't even need to be over the limit (eg motorways) because of thedangers to all.

however getting back to the main issue surely we need to understand the reasons for the 'new law' in order to debate the validity of a speed value alone? How about a 'momentum value' for all waterborne craft?

personally I am very concerned that the application of the law as proposed will make our politicions look stupid - and will be writing to one to that effect. As examples I suspect that both the Bo Bell and the thing that hit Hythe pier were 'sub 17knot' craft - no doubt someone will have details?

<hr width=100% size=1>madesco madidum ..../forums/images/icons/smile.gif

 

[PaulF]

Duncan,

Yes the the recent Hythe pier fiasco seems a useful point. I wonder whose bright idea the 17 knot bit was. RYA made the statement but I suspect it came from somebody with a vested interest, like a 16knot boat owner!

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[jhr]

Agreed about Hythe Pier and Bowbelle, though I guess the counter argument would be that they are commercial craft and thus already covered by legislation.

Like you, I'm mystified by the rationale for a cut off speed point: any boat is a potentially lethal weapon in the hands of a p*ss artist, it doesn't suddenly become dangerous at a certain speed. My guess is that they have talked to a couple of insurers, and discovered that 17 knots is the critical point at which they start insisting on extinguisher systems in engine rooms and putting limitations on damage to underwater gear, and have computed two plus two as equalling five.



<hr width=100% size=1>Je suis Marxiste - tendance Groucho

 

[milltech]

That's in the consultation document, the notion of 17 knots is exactly because it's an acknowledged standard already via the insurance industry.

Re: Duncan. I'm sure you are right about the offences, drunk and disorderly etc., but I don't think there's specifically a drink level above which you may not walk or ride on the highway, though I don't claim special knowledge, there may be.

Regarding my posting generally I don't want it to appear I'm in favour, only that I think it's not a good defence, or a kindness, to attempt to widen the scope of the legislation by saying "but what about him".



<hr width=100% size=1>John
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[Andrew_Fanner]

Re 17 knots, it will be in your insurance, defining a speed boat clause. If you can do > 17 knots by design you are a speed boat. Not me then officer, 16 past the House of Commons last Monday

<hr width=100% size=1>Two beers please, my friend is paying.

 

[tripleace]

Is 17knots the average speed many boats get onto or start the cross over onto the plane. ???



<hr width=100% size=1><A target="_blank" HREF=http://www.boating-ads.co.uk/boating-ads/Froggie1.htm> Broom 38 details</A>

 

[miket]

As one of the old RYA Motor Cruising Committee members who was dumped when the new slimmed down Cruising committee was formed I am still connected to the RYA as a "Corresponding" member.
This means I receive advance notice of most of these topics that RYA are lobbying on our behalf.
On receipt of this "drink drive" topic I expressed my displeasure that there should be a 17 knot breakpoint and gave the same reasons as you.
Just goes to show how ineffectual we Corresponding members are!
I suspect it was just a sop' to make us feel we had something to contribute.

Incidentally the current chairman of the Cruising committee is a Motor Boat man.

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[Dave_Snelson]

Errm, yes!

<hr width=100% size=1>Madoc Yacht Club
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[duncan]

agree your general principle - and would therefore only suggest that the legislation is renamed 'speedboat drink drive legislation'

<hr width=100% size=1>madesco madidum ..../forums/images/icons/smile.gif

 

[Sunnyseeker]

Does this 17 knot thing apply to sailing boats? we never knew what speed we were doing in a 30 footer as at around 16-17 knots the paddle wheel was out of the water! so speed thingy dropped to 0...we thought it was broken until we saw a phot of us flying across the solent.
Personaly I need a couple of beers to push it beyond 20 knots...as tyhings get a little hairy on the old raggy boats!

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