vic008
Well-Known Member
How far below the sea surface should the bottom rung be please ?(not as agile/young as once was) Thanks
Swim ladder design
- Thread starter vic008
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thinwater
Well-Known Member
ISO and ABYC both say 22 inches or two full steps. ABYC went on to say that 34 inches is much better (which it is). Go with 34 inches.
anoccasionalyachtsman
Well-Known Member
I recently found that approaching three feet isn't enough when in wet jeans and with an inflated life jacket. I had to be hauled out, helpless. Four feet would probably have worked, but if you can do five then why on earth not?
thinwater
Well-Known Member
Try getting your feet under you and your weight in close to the ladder, not leaning back. For example, most people cannot climb a rope ladder, because they try to push away against the rungs, rather than pull them in towards their body. By getting your weight in you can use you legs, and wet jeans wouldn't make much difference (they don't weigh anything in the water, only as you climb out).
anoccasionalyachtsman
Well-Known Member
You've not tried stairs let alone a ladder in wet jeans I take it? It's not the weight but the restriction on knee bend. And you can't get close enough to a short ladder in an inflated life jacket. If I'd been on my own I'd have had to deflate it, and that was a bit of a scary thought.
anoccasionalyachtsman
Well-Known Member
I should add that it was a ladder hanging from the edge of a swim platform that was somewhat lacking in the hand grips department. That aspect needs consideration too.
coopec
N/A
How did they haul you out when you found 3ft wasn't enough?
anoccasionalyachtsman
Well-Known Member
Two people standing on the platform pulled on my life jacket and clothes. Vertical lift.
coopec
N/A
My yacht hasn't really got a platform
It is a bit scary that some one may go overboard and the crew not have the strength to haul the person back on board. Is it feasible to have a small winch (or block and tackle) on board.
I just did a google? and found the exact type of winch I want!
Rescue flush-mount davit with mounting bracket | Harken Industrial
Daydream believer
Well-Known Member
But that has to be mounted high up , otherwise one cannot swing the MOB on to the deck. Would you have something high enough & strong enough & in the correct place to attach it? Then you need to have a gate in the guard rail etc.My yacht hasn't really got a platform
It is a bit scary that some one may go overboard and the crew not have the strength to haul the person back on board. Is it feasible to have a small winch (or block and tackle) on board.
I just did a google? and found the exact type of winch I want!
Rescue flush-mount davit with mounting bracket | Harken Industrial
Why not just have a large hook on the spinnaker halyard ( assuming a yacht) & run the other end to a winch. Then winch the MOB over the side by the shroud where the crew have something to hold on to for safety
coopec
N/A
Mine are only about 26in which is a bit of a worry. (There's one step you can't see. Couldn't get back far enough) They are nice wide treads though. Will that help much?
Moodysailor
Well-Known Member
I was always taught that denim has no place on the water for a few reasons, so I can understand the concern in post 2.
The answers are pretty much here - go as deep as you can (within practical limitations). Also, handholds above the ladder are very important. A deep ladder with no way of supporting or helping yourself up is impractical also. This doesn't have to be anything fancy - a rope with a loop in the end will be a good starting point....
The answers are pretty much here - go as deep as you can (within practical limitations). Also, handholds above the ladder are very important. A deep ladder with no way of supporting or helping yourself up is impractical also. This doesn't have to be anything fancy - a rope with a loop in the end will be a good starting point....
coopec
N/A
My ladder is in the above photo. Yes there is a gate in the pushpit. The pushpits will have to be mounted very strongly as the liferaft will be mounted on the starboard one.
But if I mounted the winch on top of the pushpit it wouldn't be high enough? Maybe I should hook a block and tackle on to the mizzen mast boom?
DeepKeel
Well-Known Member
When I sailed with young kids in the Irish Sea, I always had a permanently rigged tackle, on a spare halyard, with a helicopter strop on the end with the last few feet tied down to the toe rail. We tested it several times and showed that the kids could use it to get me out of the water if necessary - I had to provide some muscle after the lift had started, but they could get the strop to me in the water and tension everything up. And I could easily recover them or their mother from the water.
anoccasionalyachtsman
Well-Known Member
For the helpless, and/or lacking a deep enough ladder, as @Daydream believer and @DeepKeel point out, a sailing boat is covered in lifting gear. Forget about the stern though, halyards work best with the load alongside, and in any waves the one in the water won't need a crash helmet.
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thinwater
Well-Known Member
I fact, I hate jeans. My suggestion is to not wear them on the boat. That is only one of their poor properties. But yes, I have been in the water in jeans (requirement of lifesaving class, for exactly the reason you mentioned).
34 inches should still be enough, though not comfortably. A short laddder, certainly, is not, and you make a good case for even longer. Surprisingly, many or most boats have none.
Praxinoscope
Well-Known Member
Unfortunately I had to replace the long wide ladder on the stern which the boat came with when I bought it, for a short narrow one, it was either a case of altering the position of the stb‘ aft mooring cleat (not a straight forward proposal) or changing the ladder as the stb’ mooring strop was riding on the ladder bracket and slowly getting cut through,.
As in almost 50 years of sailing I have never had to rescue a fully dressed overboard crew member I felt that I could risk the easier option of changing the ladder, in favour of moving the cleat.
As in almost 50 years of sailing I have never had to rescue a fully dressed overboard crew member I felt that I could risk the easier option of changing the ladder, in favour of moving the cleat.
thinwater
Well-Known Member
Yes, very important. That really increases the difficulty and requires at least one additional step, if not two.
LadyInBed
Well-Known Member
anoccasionalyachtsman is speaking from personal experience, and mine is the same.
When I was young, I could pull myself up the short ladder, get a knee on the bottom rung and raise the other foot to that rung. Those days are long gone!
As a guide, I would say that the ladder needs to be as long as it needs to be able to raise a foot to the bottom rung when the boat is stood on the hard. An important feature should be that it doesn't swing forward (towards the prop) when pressure is applied.
anoccasionalyachtsman
Well-Known Member
I don't want to divert the thread into some kind of personal crusade, but in almost 50 years of sailing I'd never fallen off a boat until I did it three years ago. Repeating it this year gave fresh learning opportunities.
I'm not advocating that everyone should go out and and fit six foot ladders for the benefit of any stranger who might need to use it, nice as that would be, but that yachtbuilding management (and I was one) should be encouraged to try the jeans test and fit something that might actually help.
ps. I've mentioned this elsewhere but it bears repeating. Make sure that your ladder is easily pulled down by any passing stranger - it may save their life. Pay attention to the ladders fitted to pontoons around your mooring (I drifted past four without realising).
