Staying on my swinging mooring all year round?

[prv]

winter sailing means short, usually calm days under engine and long damp nights - I've tried it a few times and concluded it doesn't really work, and that was in a marina with a 240v fan heater.

Can't say I've noticed any particular problem with damp in winter. Maybe the difference is that a diesel heater blows fresh (warmed) air into the boat?

I wouldn't fancy living aboard permanently over winter, but for the odd Friday and/or Saturday night it's no problem.

As mentioned a lot depends how close you live to the boat.

That's certainly true. Most winter outings are likely to be fairly unplanned and spontaneous, not major expeditions.

Not having had a boat based on a mooring I don't know how much difference that makes; I suppose probably not too much if you have a decent tender and it's part of your normal routine.

Better to get the boat ashore and go like mad to get any work done well before Christmas, as between then and late Spring the weather is awful - just sitting in the boat or club sharing cups of tea and moaning...

Or cut out the moaning and crack on . I rebuilt Kindred Spirit's aft deck in the snow - hung a tarp over it and directed a fan heater in to let the new GRP cure properly...

Mind you, the majority of jobs I had to do on Ariam were inside, or at least in the cockpit which I could put a tent over. I don't mind the cold, but outdoor work in the rain's not much fun

Pete

 

[Seajet]

We stay in over winter but in marina berth and have limited use . I have sadly seen a number of swinging moorings end up on the shore so main risk apart from damage to sails etc would seem to be the concrete block deciding it would prefer to be say on the beach at Prinsted as opposed to off Thornham marina and taking a stroll while you are awy. I am sure this is a rare occurrence but I just wonder if you might get more use and be safer in winter if in marina where someone is checking lines etc ? Ultimately it depends on your budget but I just wonder if those rows to and from the mooring might be off putting after a while ?

Boats on moorings at Prinsted suffered badly in the October '87 Hurricane, loads washed ashore - and quite a way inland - off their moorings; it's not particularly exposed or anything, far from it, just happened to be the wrong place when it went through, a row of boats on moorings at Itchenor were sunk, 13 boats on my moorings at Langstone near Northney marina were blown ashore off their moorings and dozens of boats ashore at yards all round were toppled like dominos.

My fathers' boat stayed put on the mooring we had recently laid very thoroughly with the help of the club, but got clobbered by the other boats which had broken free...

My Anderson was safely tucked away in Poole, while my Carter 30 was sheltered behind a high wall at Hayling Yacht Co; the deck floodlight halfway up the mast actually had the bulb sheared in half -not simply destroyed - by the wind, it was a whole new set of physics that night.

It took me hours to get to the club, dodging fallen trees and finding backroads; I found a gang of vehicles following as if I knew where I was going, but I was making it up and guessing as I went

Since then I try to make my boat and mooring - and the other club moorings I help with - ' Hurricane Proof ' though one can't dictate re deck fittings...

I'm not surprised most insurers are wary of swinging moorings in winter since, and one really must ' prepare for the worst, hope for the best '.


Since then I have tried to make my mooring and boat ' Hurricane Proof ' but i'm happy when she's lifted out for the winter - not only for an annual refit, I also go out in the tender and renew the mooring topchain and swivel every 3 years - it's about £16.00 for chain, swivel and shackles plus a bit of monel locking wire, which seems a bargain to me.

 

[Seajet]

Can't say I've noticed any particular problem with damp in winter. Maybe the difference is that a diesel heater blows fresh (warmed) air into the boat?

I wouldn't fancy living aboard permanently over winter, but for the odd Friday and/or Saturday night it's no problem.



That's certainly true. Most winter outings are likely to be fairly unplanned and spontaneous, not major expeditions.

Not having had a boat based on a mooring I don't know how much difference that makes; I suppose probably not too much if you have a decent tender and it's part of your normal routine.



Or cut out the moaning and crack on . I rebuilt Kindred Spirit's aft deck in the snow - hung a tarp over it and directed a fan heater in to let the new GRP cure properly...

Mind you, the majority of jobs I had to do on Ariam were inside, or at least in the cockpit which I could put a tent over. I don't mind the cold, but outdoor work in the rain's not much fun

Pete

I live 1.5 hours away from the club, so the round trip in bad weather is a pain.

I and other members do indeed ' crack on ' with work until Christmas - but last winter hit early and hard .

I have plenty of pics of Silent Running and the club covered in snow, some as I worked on her, some in the hoist during launching.

A lot of people - probably inc me in early days - seem to forget this sailing lark is supposed to be FUN, not an audition for the SBS !

Andy

 

[Stemar]

Jissel has lived on a drying mooring in Gosport since we've had her, coming out every 2 or 3 years if we've got work to do. We've had some pretty strong blows and the odd boat's ended up in Portchester, but a properly maintained mooring has little to fear, unless you're downwind of an ill-maintained one. The worst blow was while most boats were in the water. I decided I'd spend the time on board in case something happened, but soon decided that, in our crowded moorings, I'd never get the engine going and things under control before I hit something, so I went on the club pontoon, doubling up my lines. I had the best of intentions to wander up the pontoon, checking lines but, when I saw the way the pontoon was leaping around, I changed my mindAs for winterising, I don't normally do much. The water temperature very rarely gets down to 0, so water systems are unlikely to suffer unless we get a prolonged spell of -10. Should that happen, a gentle chug, hot soup in hand, around the harbour will warm everything up, and it'll take a few days for the temperature to drop anywhere near freezing again. You're far more likely to have problems on the hard; I was out last winter, but was too ill to winterise properly this year so the Beast from the East had me worried, but no damage was done.

 

[Iain C]

Going on from my "yeah..do it" bit earlier, it's probably worth saying that the actual setup of your boat will make a huge difference too. When I got her my Sabre had bare GRP in the forepeak, and it was obviously a pretty miserable experience. Once lined out in that stretchy carpet style van lining stuff, it was beautifully dry and snug...and in fact I really miss the lined GRP forehatch on that boat compared to the big perspex condensation trapping one on my AWB!

The Sabre also had an Eberspacher with one outlet into the saloon...which was kept running permamently on winter sailing weekends. The comfort levels were just in another place...totally cosy and snug down below of an evening, and of course 5 mins below when sailing on even the coldest sailing days made all the difference. The Bav has outlets in all cabins so that's really cheating...

I think an Eber or similar is an absolute no brainer. For what they cost...especially the cheap Chinese ones...to extend your sailing season to all year round for minimal investment by comparison to the overall running costs of the boat, just seems absolutely the logical thing to do.

I think we also get a bit hung up on "winterisation". We have an incredibly temperate climate here compared to much of the world. Average temps in 2017 were about 5 degrees in Feb and 17 in July. So that's a measly 12 degrees difference, with a range of probably far less than that in your engine room. Why go to town over winterisation? Just keep it in the water and run it every so often!

 

[Channel Sailor]

As OP is in Chichester they might recall more recent events in the Spring of 2016 when a number of yachts were blown from their moorings onto adjacent mud flats. There was maybe three at the Bosham creek to Itchenor Reach junction and I understand there were several more round by Emsworth. At least one of these (a larger sized steel yacht) I saw on the mud had taken its concrete block ground anchor with it! I do not recall any of the yachts in the more sheltered end of the Reach having any mooring breakage problems. My conclusions were do not use the more exposed moorings over the winter (those exposed to SW, W and NW particularly in strong wind over tide locations) which locally that means those at the western end of Itchenor Reach, when securing your yacht think of 50 or even 60kts of wind with a Spring tide chop, ensure your deck fittings can take the strain and pounding of any bad weather and reduce windage by taking off mainsail/genoa/other deck clutter. The sails and covers will probably go mouldy anyway which means more non sailing time expended to clean them.

In December last year I was unfortunately left on a pontoon for a few days at the exposed end Itchenor Reach, then in came a strong wind with a Spring tide. The yacht's mooring bow line snapped mainly because of the bucking action of the chop. Luckily no damage done as I had a 2nd bow line in place just in case.

 

[Cactus Sailing]

Apologies for thinking ahead to "winter" but insurance and club membership deadlines are on the horizon so I am doing a bit of forward thinking, and wondered what "the panel" think......
I am tempted to try one winter and get out of my comfort zone (literally) but should the swinging mooring be a deciding factor against the plan. Interested what people think.

I spent this winter in and plan to be in this winter too.

It can be a little earie being one of only a handful of boats out on moorings, need to check your insurance but mine was ok with it.

what I learnt was if it's above 5° then there's some good sailing to be had especially if the suns out, colder than that well... call me a fair weather sailor but living on a swing mooring getting into a dinghy and travelling out to a cold frosty boat and handling freezing mooring lines isn't the most fun.

as long as you have some decent clothing and wet weather gear you will be fine, but even my decent gloves fall foul to freezing mooring lines covered in slime, Once it was that cold the gas wouldn't stay on! so making a warm drink was even a challenge.

We took our boat out early Feb for two weeks for some works then put it back in during the snow! that was some interesting sailing.

I kept my sails on, just tightly wrapped with lots of ties and wraps of sheets etc, as I did sail quite often all the way through. January was challenging and we didn't go far because it was just far too cold and once we had fought with the cold in the dinghy getting to the boat, going out into less sheltered waters wasn't the most appealing idea and that was the only time I thought id made the wrong choice as we had some strong storms too, but ensuring our lines were all good and everything wrapped tightly we came out ok, it doesn't help you sleep better knowing the boat is sat in 50knts though.

The most difficult months are Dec/Jan/Feb often we would decide on the day to go sailing so being ready to cast off was needed.

My overall learning though if its worth anything, I would much prefer to be in a marina during the winter, and while this year I will stay in the water I have managed to get a great winter rate within a marina, its actually cheaper than hauling it out and will make winter sailing more pleasant that's for sure!

 

[eddystone]

And you can get insurance, I'm sure you're not the type to ' wing it ' and put others at risk in the event of an accident involing your boat or the mooring breaking.

Think the fact you can get insurance indicates insurers OK with it as winter mooring. Just to complete the picture I’m 3.5 - 4.5hours drive away (although can ask local boatyard togosnd check as it’s cheaper than the diesel)

 

[FairweatherDave]

All good stuff and it is helping me with my decision making, (a slow process) so thanks folks.
Inevitably people do what works for them in their particular situation, and there are pro's and cons.
And then there is luck and the weather, luck if the sunny day is when you can sail, bad luck if you get a hurricane. I am sorely tempted to try it for one winter, even if it is not this one. What has been good is feeling it is definitely do-able. The significance of the difference between being afloat and being ready to sail stands out for me, pretty obvious really, but just going to check on the boat in a kayak and dry suit is a winter pleasure even if I fail to persuade my wife to "join the Special Boat service" and come sailing. Boat heating installation hmmmmmmm, should have sorted that really.
On the serious note of preparation I have been in e mail contact with the Moorings officer (it is a Conservancy mooring). He advises a snubbing line between the swivel and mooring cleat (as well as the chain strop) and I can move the boat to the sheltered end of Itchenor Reach if I feel the need (Sweare deep is only really vulnerable in a NW gale with a Spring High tide). That does presume being in a position to spot the forecast and get to the boat.
I'm sure insurance will be do-able, just need to shop around if the current people won't do it. Boat has had a survey for insurance purposes last November.

 

[FairweatherDave]

Perhaps I should add I really enjoy reading what people write about surviving and enjoying those cold sunny days, slimmey ropes and long dark nights, That's what motivates me re winter sailing, as opposed to winter boat storage afloat. I love the harbour out of season, low sun, bit of mist. It's got to be done at least once, and if you get it right , repeat!

 

[Cactus Sailing]

Perhaps I should add I really enjoy reading what people write about surviving and enjoying those cold sunny days, slimmey ropes and long dark nights, That's what motivates me re winter sailing, as opposed to winter boat storage afloat. I love the harbour out of season, low sun, bit of mist. It's got to be done at least once, and if you get it right , repeat!

well the real winter is pretty short and there's plenty of nice days in between, everyone's level of "survival" is different though

 

[FairweatherDave]

Well good news. Insurance (GJW Direct) will cover me for no extra to stay afloat and in commission on my mooring.

 

[nicappotamus 2]

When we were young (20s ) we always sailed through the winter

some amazin days and it's quieter

going to do the same and come out every third year.

the swinging mooring would worry me as we lost a boat from a mooring in portsmouth in March with a southerly gale that saw about 6 of our club boats run ashore (we got clobbered by one going past us). we don't live close to the area so can't move the boat off the mooring if a gale is forecast.

we are wintering in a marina

 

[Seajet]

I've tried winter sailing in a UK cruiser a few times, and gained memories of noisy high voltage draw Ebersmashers, damp, or smelly meths heaters which don't last the advertised 12 hours - so a cold wake up.

I came to the conclusion it's best to get the cruiser ashore for work during the winter, and sail fast dinghies for a couple of hours then ashore for hot showers, mulled wine and crumpet

 

[nicappotamus 2]

I came to the conclusion it's best to get the cruiser ashore for work during the winter, and sail fast dinghies for a couple of hours then ashore for hot showers, mulled wine and crumpet [/QUOTE]

sadly these days I don't attract much crumpet (not sure I ever did)

 

[TSB240]

Nothing better than getting out on the water for one of those crisp winter sails.

[video]https://www.facebook.com/100000910750100/videos/vb.100000910750100/2021072784599727/?type=2&video_source=user_video_tab[/video]

We had quite a bit of snow last year but had at least three sails with similar blue skies and gentle winds with snow covered mountains as a backdrop.
Not a soul else out on the water!

I think that day it never got above 1 degree all day, Right clothing, Eber full on, Plenty of warm drinks and one of the most pleasurable days out.

Temperature does plummet with wind-chill and night-time so having arctic climate clothing and quality warm bedding is essential. If you can be marina based for an odd-night out an electric blanket is very effective at ensuring a dry, aired and warm bunk before you climb in. Marinas often do a very cheap one night deal midwinter!

A spray hood for protection is essential, especially if the sea water is turning to ice!

You will only get a damp boat if either you don't use it in the winter or don't have enough ventilation!

We are fortunate to not need the annual lift out for antifouling being based in a freshwater dock. Summer time is best for us to quickly get any major out of the water maintenance done. All other maintenance is easily carried out whilst afloat.

Steve.

 

[peteK]

Well good news. Insurance (GJW Direct) will cover me for no extra to stay afloat and in commission on my mooring.

GJW have consistently refused to insure me on a sheltered swinging mooring all year round although other insurers will,been on swinging mooring for 40 years with no claims.After the Holyhead fiasco perhaps they have decided that a swinging mooring is a better bet.

 

[Seajet]

My insurers, Haven - or whatever they're called now - won't cover me for over winter on the mooring, not that I fancy it anyway; as well as the winter gales, a boat out there alone seems a magnet for thieves.

GJW were very good to a friend whose boat was swept off her mooring ( summer season ) and written off in a series of gales, he just couldn't get out even in a rescue boat to check her - the rope strop chafed through, which is why I'm a firm believer in well maintained chain.

 

[TLouth7]

You need to consider your lifestyle, personally I have lots of demands on my weekends so would not be keen to hold them open on the offchance of nice weather for sailing. On the other hand if your weekends (or weekdays) are mostly spent pottering around at home then you can go sailing whenever the weather plays ball.

My experience of cold weather sailing is that you want to minimise rope/sail handling as it is hard to keep your hands warm. Difficult to achieve when short-tacking in the snow, but can be improved with careful set-up. For example you could consider ghosting around Chichester harbour under main alone so you wouldn't have to faff around with winches.

Sailing club winter opening hours make a difference, check whether you can get a hot chocolate on your return...

 

[Seajet]

When I used to sail dinghies in the winter it was in Chichester Harbour at CYC, it was just to have a rescue boat handy - I like to sail fast, but not all the hollering and shouting of racing, I'd rather go my own way as has been recognised by sailing clubs surviving nowadays holding dinghy cruising and ' fun on the water ' events.
In the winter the cruisers are ashore for maintenance.

Sailing cruisers in the winter was generally pretty cold even in marinas with 240v fan heaters, a chilly trip to get a meal in the evening and short daylight hours - I'm used to night sailing, but stuff the cold !