Speedseal vs DIY alternative

[TonyBuckley]

Why don't you just ask them??

Yes that's sort of the idea lol

 

[rob2]

Not too sure I would copy speedseal's design, easier (legally and morally better too) to put my hand in my pocket.

I agree, but there are many, many engines for which they do not manufacture the speedseal - mine amongst them. As there is nothing inherently wrong with the simple design they use, why re-invent the wheel when a Chinese copy gets you all the benefits?

Rob.

 

[BobnLesley]

If you're making the effort, why not go one step further?

About five years ago, an chap overwintering with us in Marmaris, proposed making a 'Speedseal' or similar copy for his engine - as I recall, it was a Volvo of around 30 - 40 hp - but using 10mm Polycarbonate so that it would be both easier to make and that he could also do a regular/easy visual check on his impellor; when he raised this idea at a weekly 'Skipper's Forum', I confess to being with the overwhelming majority in laughing at the idea.

Undeterred, Paul made the thing, in fact he made a spare one too, just using basic tools and a battery-drill in the boat's cockpit: The spare is still held in readiness and the original's still in place as of a few months ago; it still hadn't leaked, melted, cracked, distorted or indeed even scoured the face and gone opaque as we naysayers had all predicted. The mating face/edges had no gasket/seals fitted, beyond a 'thin smear of silicone'.

As to whether the foremost naysayer amongst us has yet 'eaten his hat' as promised, I've no idea.

 

[PetiteFleur]

My pump, on a Beta 25hp already has an 'O' ring in the brass cover but only 3 screws to secure it. I like the idea of the Socket Cap Screws in stainless - I have to look through my odds & sods box. Also thinking of the knurled screws.

 

[Aeolus]

I just came across nylon slotted head thumb screws which I think I'll try.

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=290953726697&ssPageName=ADME:L:OC:GB:3160

 

[TonyBuckley]

For something that is considered a weak point of failure - or at least a consumable just like oil, water and fuel, it is amazing just how tricky it is to get this right!

At some point, the impeller will fail. Belts are easy. My impeller looks nigh on impossible to replace without a 12 yo on hand.

I need to do something I think! Maybe start a new 12 year plan .

And yes, I know its meant to secondary power.

 

[ghostlymoron]

Sorry to resurrect an old thread but what equipment would you need to cut a circular groove in a steel plate?

It wouldn't be too difficult for even a rank amateur such as myself to turn up a replacement cover plate for the pump, incorporating the features of the original SpeedSeal. Just a very slight relief on the working face to match the original paper gasket thickness and a groove to hold an o-ring, selected to allow it to fully compress. The two drilled holes and two slotted holes can be drilled on a small drill press and slotted by hand if you don't have access to a mill.

Perhaps more interesting, or prone to errors if you like, would be to copy the design features of the later version with the separate wear plate. I suppose if you cut too much relief into the plate, some form of shim could be added to take up the slack, positioned under the wear plate. Bearing in mind the slight distortion visible in my pump's cover plate, I'm guessing the clearance isn't too critical sdo long as it doesn't bind or create a significant leak path.

Rob.

 

[charles_reed]

My Johnson raw-water pump has, as standard, an O-ring, on the faceplate.
In fact with the Jabsco raw water pump on the 2GM you had to take off the pump to get at the faceplate - so I saved the money on a Speedseal and had a spare pump - which I have continued on the 3YM, because impellers last about 600 hours and seals about 1200. So a Speedseal is a solution looking for a problem (and very expensive into the bargain).

 

[charles_reed]

Sorry to resurrect an old thread but what equipment would you need to cut a circular groove in a steel plate?

Plates on all the raw-water pumps I've had are of a flat brass plate - the groove in the Johnson is in the pump-body.
I never bothered with modifying the Jabsco pump on the 2GM, because it was much easier to transfer over the replacement pump and do the mending in a workshop. It was then dead simple to tap out the paper gasket.
The face used to wear - sufficiently to halve the pump's ability to prime - having the plate machined flat was a cheap and easy answer, but if in the wilds or offshore, just reversing it worked for me and lots of FV engineers.
I'd bet on finding a machine shop who'd do machine an O-ring groove in your current pump-body, in Halesfield, probably for nowt, but a lot cheaper and more effective than a Speedseal.
Send me a PM, I'll be back in Shropshire on 27th, after this statutory, half-term, grandparental duty in Soton.

 

[Hadenough]

My Johnson raw-water pump has, as standard, an O-ring, on the faceplate.
In fact with the Jabsco raw water pump on the 2GM you had to take off the pump to get at the faceplate - so I saved the money on a Speedseal and had a spare pump - which I have continued on the 3YM, because impellers last about 600 hours and seals about 1200. So a Speedseal is a solution looking for a problem (and very expensive into the bargain).

Not in my view of the speedseal life. The ability to run dry for up to 10mins has saved the impellor on my genset three times this season. It eats jellyfish, I have a raw water alarm but previously before I had time to switch the gen set off the impellor was trashed. I've had three alarms this season and apart from the first one (when I confess I wasn't trusting the run dry claims and needlessly opened the pump to check) I have not had to touch it. Just clear the filter, blow through the intake with a dinghy pump and restart. They are not cheap admittedly but worth the expense in my view. Got one on the main engine too.

 

[Tranona]

My Johnson raw-water pump has, as standard, an O-ring, on the faceplate.
In fact with the Jabsco raw water pump on the 2GM you had to take off the pump to get at the faceplate - so I saved the money on a Speedseal and had a spare pump - which I have continued on the 3YM, because impellers last about 600 hours and seals about 1200. So a Speedseal is a solution looking for a problem (and very expensive into the bargain).

On the other hand, if you have a Volvo where the water pump is a nightmare to remove, and the cover is held on with 5 or 6 tiny little screws which like falling in the bilge, and the paper gasket always tears when you take the cover off - a Speedseal is a godsend. Equally good if you have a Yanmar 1GM, which also has tiny little screws, one of which is almost inaccessible (unless you have long thin multijointed fingers) and a self destructing gasket you are also pleased when Father Christmas answers your request.

 

[ghostlymoron]

Yes but as I said earlier - speedseal don't make one for my model of pump (Volvo MD1). So even Santa can't get one. Hence my question about making one.

 

[DinghyMan]

Sorry to resurrect an old thread but what equipment would you need to cut a circular groove in a steel plate?

Fairly easily done on a lathe or milling machine.

Maybe another YAPP; laser or water jet cut brass or polycarbonate covers or just a plain circle with a machined O ring groove and a PTFE or similar wear washer?

Major issue is that Speedseal may want to protect their design & brand?

I just came across nylon slotted head thumb screws which I think I'll try.

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=290953726697&ssPageName=ADME:L:OC:GB:3160

I've got some of them and have used them for finger tight covers and they appear to be pretty strong so reckon stainless would be a better way to go, either knurled with a slot in or better still normal cap heads with a knurled outer to make hand fitting easier.

Yes but as I said earlier - speedseal don't make one for my model of pump (Volvo MD1). So even Santa can't get one. Hence my question about making one.

Have you got a spare cover or can you remove yours, draw around it including fitting holes, and measure diameter of the pump inner for the anti-friction washer? - Just realised an impeller kit comes with a paper washer which gives all the dimensions....

 

[ghostlymoron]

Dinghyman, I don't see how speedseal can object to me making a new cover for my pump as they don't produce one to fit. I rang them to order one but was declined. I suppose there is insufficient demand for one to fit a 40 year old pump but I can still get impellers and seals for it.
Yes I can get the cover off and draw a pattern. What have you in mind?

 

[DinghyMan]

Dinghyman, I don't see how speedseal can object to me making a new cover for my pump as they don't produce one to fit. I rang them to order one but was declined. I suppose there is insufficient demand for one to fit a 40 year old pump but I can still get impellers and seals for it.
Yes I can get the cover off and draw a pattern. What have you in mind?

If they aren't interested in making one then, as you say, they cannot really object if someone else does make one.

I was thinking of making a Yanmar one for my boat and offering to make you one for yours if you are interested?

 

[pvb]

I've got some of them and have used them for finger tight covers and they appear to be pretty strong so reckon stainless would be a better way to go, either knurled with a slot in or better still normal cap heads with a knurled outer to make hand fitting easier.

Speedseal sell their stainless hand screws as spare parts.

 

[rogerthebodger]

You could also lock-tight studs in the tapped holes and use wing nuts to clamp the cover on.

Gasket and cover always located and the wing nuts are easy to replace

 

[DinghyMan]

Speedseal sell their stainless hand screws as spare parts.

But as I have a lathe and mill I can just turn up some 316 like the rebreather head bolts I make shown in the first couple of pictures here: http://ffsystems.co.uk/rebreather_parts.html

It also means that I can make them much wider than the standard ones which would make finger tightening easier

 

[DinghyMan]

ghostlymoron please tidy your inbox - you have exceeded your quota

 

[lw395]

I use a smear of marine grease, which temporarily sticks the gasket to the face plate. Saves a lot of faffage!

In similar applications, it's common to stick the gasket to one side with something like gold hermatite, then grease the other side of the gasket.
I would still carry a spare gasket...

Studs and wingnuts works for me.