Prima
N/A
More than helpful. Thank you ever so much for taking the time to repost them. It's given me a very good idea now of how they might look on mine 
Solar Panels
- Thread starter Hurricane
- Start date
Hurricane
Well-Known Member
On anchor in Santa Ponsa at the moment.
Between guests so have a few minutes available to update this thread on my thoughts now that I have a few days experience of the solar panels.
Very hot here at the moment but we will probably get the DinghyGo out later - have a spinnaker to fit to it but in the meantime, we are keeping out of the sun.
So, first I'll post some more pics - then some maths
Cala Portals (Vells) a couple of days ago - showing the solar panels from the drone.
Probably a bit antisocial tying back to the shore like this in a busy anchorage like Vells but it was only overnight to keep the bow into the swell.
Then, a couple of screenshots from the Victron MPPT solar controller.
This was the instantaneous display first thing this morning.
And this is the History display for the last few days
So, onto the maths.
I've started to look at the problem/solution in a different way.
The main object is to replace the electrical power that the boat has used overnight.
As previously stated, the generator will replace most of the power but to charge the batteries completely, it will need to run for most of the day.
The average boat's load is around 12amps at 24 volts - that means a daily load of around 6.912 kilo watt hours (12amps x 24 volts x 24 hours).
From the History display we are getting about 3.5 kilo watt hours per day.
So that leaves about 3.4 kilo watt hours for the generator/battery charger to do.
I think that makes sense.
This morning, the battery monitor indicated 75% charge after the night's discharge.
Incidentally, that was the same time as the instantaneous display above and the battery monitor was indicating that the solar panels were actually charging the batteries (only 1 amp but that was at 08:52!!)
When I switched on the generator, the batteries started charging at 100amps - after 2 hours, they were only taking 25 amps (and this is the point - to finish charging, the generator would have to run for the rest of the day).
This project has shown that there are lots of variables.
For example, my Mastervolt charger is rated at 100 amps but I've never seen a charge rate of 100amps before this morning.
I suspect this is because this is the third day that we have been in Santa Ponsa and the engine room temp (where that batteries are located) is now at a more acceptable temperature.
Usually, the Mastervolt charger only managed a maximum charge rate of 80amps
Then there is the swinging around - it is noticeable that the panels work best when facing directly into the sun.
And, of course, they don't work as well on cloudy days.
But maybe looking at the History display, gives a good indication of the success of this project.
Anyway, it is now back to enjoying being at anchor.
I hope you find this interesting - I do.
Between guests so have a few minutes available to update this thread on my thoughts now that I have a few days experience of the solar panels.
Very hot here at the moment but we will probably get the DinghyGo out later - have a spinnaker to fit to it but in the meantime, we are keeping out of the sun.
So, first I'll post some more pics - then some maths
Cala Portals (Vells) a couple of days ago - showing the solar panels from the drone.
Probably a bit antisocial tying back to the shore like this in a busy anchorage like Vells but it was only overnight to keep the bow into the swell.
Then, a couple of screenshots from the Victron MPPT solar controller.
This was the instantaneous display first thing this morning.
And this is the History display for the last few days
So, onto the maths.
I've started to look at the problem/solution in a different way.
The main object is to replace the electrical power that the boat has used overnight.
As previously stated, the generator will replace most of the power but to charge the batteries completely, it will need to run for most of the day.
The average boat's load is around 12amps at 24 volts - that means a daily load of around 6.912 kilo watt hours (12amps x 24 volts x 24 hours).
From the History display we are getting about 3.5 kilo watt hours per day.
So that leaves about 3.4 kilo watt hours for the generator/battery charger to do.
I think that makes sense.
This morning, the battery monitor indicated 75% charge after the night's discharge.
Incidentally, that was the same time as the instantaneous display above and the battery monitor was indicating that the solar panels were actually charging the batteries (only 1 amp but that was at 08:52!!)
When I switched on the generator, the batteries started charging at 100amps - after 2 hours, they were only taking 25 amps (and this is the point - to finish charging, the generator would have to run for the rest of the day).
This project has shown that there are lots of variables.
For example, my Mastervolt charger is rated at 100 amps but I've never seen a charge rate of 100amps before this morning.
I suspect this is because this is the third day that we have been in Santa Ponsa and the engine room temp (where that batteries are located) is now at a more acceptable temperature.
Usually, the Mastervolt charger only managed a maximum charge rate of 80amps
Then there is the swinging around - it is noticeable that the panels work best when facing directly into the sun.
And, of course, they don't work as well on cloudy days.
But maybe looking at the History display, gives a good indication of the success of this project.
Anyway, it is now back to enjoying being at anchor.
I hope you find this interesting - I do.
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Prima
N/A
Definitely interesting. Do you know which direction gives you the best charge rate? I assume due south, but I really am a complete spanner when it comes to things like this so forgive what may seem a silly question
MapisM
Well-Known Member
Hurricane, one curiosity if you don't mind a small o/t: have you ever actually used that loudhailer which you've got behind the horns?
I've got what appears to be the same bit of kit on the DP (connected to a Raymarine 430 unit), but I can't see myself ever using it, and I'm thinking to get rid of it altogether.
Together with the sat dome, but that's another story - and each to their own on that...
I've got what appears to be the same bit of kit on the DP (connected to a Raymarine 430 unit), but I can't see myself ever using it, and I'm thinking to get rid of it altogether.
Together with the sat dome, but that's another story - and each to their own on that...
GSL
Well-Known Member
Hi Mike
If the State of Charge (SOC) for your batteries does not go below 75% first thing in the morning I suspect you will find the batteries will last a lot longer than you have experienced in the past.
Please do let us know what the SOC is at the end of today (7.00pm).
I would suggest this has been a total success given that after a week away from the Marina you can see the SOC at 100%, totally unachievable in the past.
Graham
If the State of Charge (SOC) for your batteries does not go below 75% first thing in the morning I suspect you will find the batteries will last a lot longer than you have experienced in the past.
Please do let us know what the SOC is at the end of today (7.00pm).
I would suggest this has been a total success given that after a week away from the Marina you can see the SOC at 100%, totally unachievable in the past.
Graham
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Hurricane
Well-Known Member
Yesterday, Graham, the SOC was 100% by 16:00
But I'm beginning to wonder if your point about the SOC being the best indication.
Reason being that the voltage doesn't get back to the same level as it was on the shore supply - maybe thats a "float charge" thing.
However, I agree with your point - this does appear to be a success.
In previous years, the batteries would be getting pretty sad by now.
I'm even thinking that by mid afternoon, maybe there is somewhere else to put the harvested energy - batteries full by then.
Either by taking a risk with the morning charge (charging less) or (as I'm now thinking) making water!!
Actually, though, a water maker would more than "tip the balance" - definitely not got enough solar power to run a water maker and the rest of the ship's systems.
But I AM thinking that I could run a water maker in the hours before and after using the engines or before and after our morning battery charge session using the generator.
Thought now is to balance the "no of kilo watt hours per day"
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Hurricane
Well-Known Member
Hurricane, one curiosity if you don't mind a small o/t: have you ever actually used that loudhailer which you've got behind the horns?
I've got what appears to be the same bit of kit on the DP (connected to a Raymarine 430 unit), but I can't see myself ever using it, and I'm thinking to get rid of it altogether.
Together with the sat dome, but that's another story - and each to their own on that...
The loudhailer is connected to a Simrad VHF radio (standard fit) - (RS 87 - I think)
Actually, I don't rate the Simrad as a radio.
But it does have this great feature when used with a loudhailer.
You can pick up the handset and speak to the crew on the foredeck - thats the obvious bit.
But it also "listens" as a microphone so you can hear what the crew are saying about you after you have bellowed an order at them!!
Actually, that feature works very well.
Not sure that the same thing works with the Raymarine radio - but I think the Raymarine VHF bit will work better than the Simrad VHF bit.
GSL
Well-Known Member
Mike the next obvious thing to try, if the SOC is 75% in the morning, just run the Genset for less time, maybe up to 85% if the weather forecast is good and you are not planning to motor anywhere that day, and by Sundown your panels may have still got you to SOC 100%.
You stated;
"When I switched on the generator, the batteries started charging at 100amps - after 2 hours, they were only taking 25 amps (and this is the point - to finish charging, the generator would have to run for the rest of the day)".
What was the SOC when you turned off the Genset when it was only charging at 25 amps?
It will all become a balancing act on the day ahead, based on the amount of sunshine forecast / any motoring planned to try and run the Genset for just the amount required.
I would think the Watermaker would be best running during your morning Genset running as it is brings the batteries up to the required level that the Solar panels will do the rest by the end of the day.
My system always shows a lower voltage once the Shorepower has fully charged the batteries and moved onto a float charge.
You stated;
"When I switched on the generator, the batteries started charging at 100amps - after 2 hours, they were only taking 25 amps (and this is the point - to finish charging, the generator would have to run for the rest of the day)".
What was the SOC when you turned off the Genset when it was only charging at 25 amps?
It will all become a balancing act on the day ahead, based on the amount of sunshine forecast / any motoring planned to try and run the Genset for just the amount required.
I would think the Watermaker would be best running during your morning Genset running as it is brings the batteries up to the required level that the Solar panels will do the rest by the end of the day.
My system always shows a lower voltage once the Shorepower has fully charged the batteries and moved onto a float charge.
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vas
Well-Known Member
agree with GSL,
Mike, try for a day or two to NOT run the genny at all (or switch off the bat charger if you just need 220V for cooking or whatever)
If as GSL says you get 100% SOC by 17:00, then you're absolutely fine!
Considering your genny produces far more power than needed for cooking and/or charging, you could use the rest of that power on a watermaker.
If you want a decent 80-120lt/h piece of kit, they come with a 3Hp el.motor. Not sure it's worth getting a 24V one, just get a decent 220V and use it when you run the genny. An hour a day or two can produce enough water to avoid going to a port for as long as you wish.
My 2X300W panels are going to be fitted midweek, I've got a 100/30 victron mppt and I'll order the blutooth thingie tomorrow. Would be interesting to check and compare (although I'm on lower loads being much smaller altogether and I hope I can avoid running the genny fullstop)
cheers
V.
Mike, try for a day or two to NOT run the genny at all (or switch off the bat charger if you just need 220V for cooking or whatever)
If as GSL says you get 100% SOC by 17:00, then you're absolutely fine!
Considering your genny produces far more power than needed for cooking and/or charging, you could use the rest of that power on a watermaker.
If you want a decent 80-120lt/h piece of kit, they come with a 3Hp el.motor. Not sure it's worth getting a 24V one, just get a decent 220V and use it when you run the genny. An hour a day or two can produce enough water to avoid going to a port for as long as you wish.
My 2X300W panels are going to be fitted midweek, I've got a 100/30 victron mppt and I'll order the blutooth thingie tomorrow. Would be interesting to check and compare (although I'm on lower loads being much smaller altogether and I hope I can avoid running the genny fullstop)
cheers
V.
MapisM
Well-Known Member
Aha, all understood.
But technical differences aside, you actually didn't answer my question...
What I was wondering is if you (or anyone else, for that matter!) have actually ever used that bit of kit.
I just can't see myself shouting at S while maneuvering, without risking some retaliation when it's dinner time!
Besides, in a situation where shouting at someone would be necessary for some reason, I would think that using voice right away is easier and faster than grabbing the microphone, possibly pushing some buttons, or whatever...
It's not like the distance from the helm to anywhere onboard is anywhere near a cruise ship, after all!
Prima
N/A
I don't know where I got this thought from, but aren't they also used as foghorns?
Prima
N/A
There's a discussion here about loud hailer useage:
http://www.thehulltruth.com/marine-electronics-forum/316114-loud-hailer-do-you-use-yours.html
http://www.thehulltruth.com/marine-electronics-forum/316114-loud-hailer-do-you-use-yours.html
Hurricane
Well-Known Member
Aha, all understood.
But technical differences aside, you actually didn't answer my question...
What I was wondering is if you (or anyone else, for that matter!) have actually ever used that bit of kit.
I just can't see myself shouting at S while maneuvering, without risking some retaliation when it's dinner time!
Besides, in a situation where shouting at someone would be necessary for some reason, I would think that using voice right away is easier and faster than grabbing the microphone, possibly pushing some buttons, or whatever...
It's not like the distance from the helm to anywhere onboard is anywhere near a cruise ship, after all!
I do actually use ours as a loudhailer to the bow.
Hurricane
Well-Known Member
I can't remember - I'll check after this morning's generator charge cycle.
Hurricane
Well-Known Member
Definitely not an option.
The whole idea was based on getting the fastest part of the charge from the battery charger when it was able to put the most in.
And leave the solar panels to "finish off"
The solar panels would never be able to keep pace with our load on their own.
And some of it is about convenience.
Last night we ran the generator for a couple of hours to watch some "catch up" TV
This morning the SOC was 81%
So, today is starting off more charged than yesterday.
Dave100456
Well-Known Member
Great thread about solar panels and thanks for posting pics of actual data readout screens.
Cheers
Cheers
Hurricane
Well-Known Member
Just a little point whilst the generator is running.
Again, this morning it started at 100amps - after half an hour that has dropped to 50amps.
This is the big point that people don't understand.
Again, this morning it started at 100amps - after half an hour that has dropped to 50amps.
This is the big point that people don't understand.
jfm
Well-Known Member
Hurricane, that looks like a success. Great going. 53Kwh over 5 days is like running a 180 amp 24 battery charger for 10 hours. Well worth it, on a boat where you don't use genset for large chunks of the day anyway (for airco, STAR, etc).
Nice anchoring. MYAG would approve!
MapisM, I have that horn thing on my last 4 boats and almost never use it but I do think it is worthwhile. If/when I didn't have the kahlenbergs, I use it in fog, which means on average once every couple of years. On those occasions it is worth having imho - you don't want to do something manually when a machine can do it, in low viz situations.
I never use the hailer/shouting function. It seems a very inelegant way of communicating with the foredeck, and Ancam (TM) reduces the need for foredeck work anyway
Nice anchoring. MYAG would approve!
MapisM, I have that horn thing on my last 4 boats and almost never use it but I do think it is worthwhile. If/when I didn't have the kahlenbergs, I use it in fog, which means on average once every couple of years. On those occasions it is worth having imho - you don't want to do something manually when a machine can do it, in low viz situations.
I never use the hailer/shouting function. It seems a very inelegant way of communicating with the foredeck, and Ancam (TM) reduces the need for foredeck work anyway
vas
Well-Known Member
Mike,
today was my first day with the 2X300W solar panels on a hard top. Was sunny throughout the day and annoyingly hot, although I finished the installation at about 11:30AM.
I read on the manual that MPPT (mine is a 100/30, yours iirc is a 150/35) will start with 4h bulk and then will move on to float or whatever.
Well, till 5pm it was bulk charging! "Only" had 2 80lt fridges running.
1PM I noted 16Amps going to the batteries (that was using an amp clamp thing that does DC 20A or 2A scales) at 11:30 it was 14A, later dropped a bit.
Ordered the bluetooth dongle but not got it yet, so next week that I'll be in anchor wont be able to measure and plot carefully things.
If tomorrow morning both fridges are still working I'll be v.happy
cheers
V.
jrudge
Well-Known Member
Think you need to get an inverter for the tv !
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