Security

[Sea Change]

Something that's been on my mind as I ponder my eventual departure to sail to distant lands.

I'm used to being pretty lazy about security. Live in a quiet part of the world where it's rare to lock your door, or your car. Wouldn't think twice about leaving my dinghy and outboard pulled up on the shore.

Assuming I end up doing an Atlantic circuit, taking in the usual sights, what is security going to be like? Do you just take your chances and leave your dinghy somewhere, hoping it will be still be there. Or is is normal to find a marina, or other secure area, and/or padlock the dinghy/outboard, etc? What about stuff left aboard the yacht- laptops, cash, passport, etc?

I guess this will vary from place to place, but I'm trying to work out whether my idyll of lazily cruising the world with few cares is actually possible?

 

[geem]

I would assume the worst and expect the best. Take security seriously and you will be fine. If you don't and you get robbed, you will definitely take security seriously.

 

[tcm]

I've done a few circuits and think you'll be fine with your relaxed attitude, and just a few precautions. Main issues are

1 Someone hopping on the boat in a marina or at anchor, pinching stuff and zipping off quickly
To combat this, of course you could lock down the boat every time you leave it, but I really don\'t think it that vital in most cases. A marina I wouldn't stay at is Vieux Fort in St Lucia (not cos of recent attack there, but because my own outboard got nicked from anchorage round there and the dink left behind...). They are moslty very friendly ashore, highlighting the fact that that there aren't "loads" of thieves - there's just a few and sometimes only one, and mostly none at all. One good ruse I saw was to leave a radio playing in the cockpit when you aren't on the boat. A few leave a "fake" wallet" in the boat, with a few $10 plus lots of paper and out-of date credit cards. Making friends with neighbours also wise (and fun of course) so that you look after each other. Inviting people to your boat makes it look (and be) "known" rather than "alone". Having a spare dinghy, even a petrol station useless thing would be fantastic, anything to make the boat look occupied and make a potential thief choose another boat, another place, another day.

2 Someone stealing the dinghy
In some places, dinghies are targeted (St Martin is one such place...) and leaving the dink in the same place, off the davits is a risk. But often, dinghies drift off cos people unravel a few dinghies to get to their own, and don't tie them up again properly. It's only once you start to travel a little further away from the UK that you will tend to live at anchor more and more, and when your boat is your house like this, the dink is your car. So, (until I parked it up for weeks and it got nicked...) I used a not-unwieldy padlock of which i had a few of the same type and key, so if i dropped the lock i had a spare key, or v-v, and the bronze ones seemed best, buy them in a set, I think ARBUS brand not bad in permanenet salty environmnt. Leaving the dink in the same place for days on end not a good idea, cos thieves can scope it out and test the situation before actually stealing it. Usually, it's fine leaving the dink on a beach... but as with all these issues, it depends on the situation ... in southern carib a dink or a boat represents untold wealth, and lots of people are skint with little or no opportunities other than crime/drugs.

3 Someone stealing the entire boat
Hum, really unlikely! depends on the boat i suppose. You could get a tracker thing. Avoid being in the emptiest anchorages in less-developed areas.

4 A physical boarding, attack and theft (very unlikely)
Hum even more unlikely, but be ready to give up everything. Keep cash split in a few different places on the boat. Note that theives might easily be on drugs, so there won't always be a lot of "reasoning with them" other than to plead that they don't shoot you.

Mostly, though, it'll be fine.

 

[KellysEye]

Buy a length of stainless chain that will reach from the handle on the outboard through the fuel tank over the bows and then long enough to the reach a dock, padlock both ends in a loop. Lift the dinghy on deck at night. Do not put the boat name on the dinghy it's an invitation for the bad guys to nick it when you are off the boat. Always lock the boat when you leave it and leave some cash and out of date credit cards on the chart table. Hide any other cash and valuables, passport etc, we had a small safe box hidden under the starboard front berth that nobody would be able to find. If carrying anything valuable, like a camera, put it in a local supermarket bag. Don't wear an expensive watch or jewellery.

For personal protection on the boat if you stop in Jolly Harbour, Antigua the fishing tackle shop sell a spray which is a mix of pepper and CS gas.

Bear in mind that most cruisers fit out their boat to go sailing the French go sailing to fit out their boat, there is a French ISBN book on cruising which has a chapter on how to steal things. They usually steal things all the cruising season then mainly dinghies and outboards, and including at least one yacht from the BVI's, in May/early June when they go back over the Atlantic. Martinique is the worst island for theft in that period but be aware if French yachts are near where you are in that period.

Be careful going out at night and if you do go mob handed. St John the capital of Antigua is not safe at night as is Trinidad. Avoid Venezuela at all costs, except the out islands if you are on your way to Bonaire/Curacao.

Also expect French yachts to anchor right on top you with their stern about 12 feet from your bow, they are a complete nightmare. They did that to us in St Lucia, the BVI's and English harbour Antigua where they dragged down on us at night but we were in the cockpit so fended the boat off. Moral of the story move if one anchors in front of you or keep a watch all night.

 

[sailaboutvic]

I think most would Agee the days have gone when you could go off and leave the boat open , although I am alway being told off for forgetting to do so , every year we see or met up with people who had a brake in so had dingy taken last year our friend had dinghy stolen from Sicily they found the dinghy next day without the engine .
One thing you could coincided is what we use to keep horses fence in with an electric
Fence box connected to tape and around the guard rails , it won't kill them but it will keep them off the boat . Just remember to turn it off before you try to get on .
Although you would have to work out how you are going to fix the ground side of it. , and off course there the legal issues .
Wouldn't use it in Europe but some where like the further afield I might and only at anchor
I can't see a thief reporting you to the police .

 

[charles_reed]

Something that's been on my mind as I ponder my eventual departure to sail to distant lands.

I'm used to being pretty lazy about security. Live in a quiet part of the world where it's rare to lock your door, or your car. Wouldn't think twice about leaving my dinghy and outboard pulled up on the shore.

Assuming I end up doing an Atlantic circuit, taking in the usual sights, what is security going to be like? Do you just take your chances and leave your dinghy somewhere, hoping it will be still be there. Or is is normal to find a marina, or other secure area, and/or padlock the dinghy/outboard, etc? What about stuff left aboard the yacht- laptops, cash, passport, etc?

I guess this will vary from place to place, but I'm trying to work out whether my idyll of lazily cruising the world with few cares is actually possible?

Escape from theives, however avidly desired is probably not possible.

Rule-of-thumb - avoid "popular" places - and you'll find little differences to UK (which is probably not an accolade)

My thefts (off boat or boat associated) have been, as follows:-
UK - 3 small thefts in 12 years
France - 1 bike theft @ Pornichet (in 11 years in French waters) none in Mediterranean France
Spain - 1 theft in Barcelona (despite rigourous security) of cameras, passport and 6 lenses, and a theft of a bike in Cartagena. As I only spent 18 months in Spanish waters...
Malta - boat break-in @ Msida marina and about £12k of gear taken, including running rigging, electronics, foul weather gear and an old laptop. I was in Malta for 2 years. Malta has an unenviable reputation for boat-theft - so watch out SailaboutVic
Italy - 1 attempted bike theft - the criminal fell into the Darsena Traiano whilst awaiting the arrival of the police. Apparently an ethnic Romanian Roma. 1 inflatable stolen whilst ashore in Siracusa. Apparently the 8th inflatable theft in 4 weeks including a 23' RIB with twin Yamahas in the marina there, the "haul" landed up in Napoli and was finally stopped by action by the local famiglie, not the police.
Greece in 4 years no disappearances apart from the annoying ones of water-hose adaptors, clearly by fellow-marina users. Others have experienced thefts from boats at anchored but only in a couple of locations. IMHO Greece is probably the most honest country of all those I've visited. In any case most boat thefts are probably by fellow-visitors.

My bike (carefully disguised to look really shabby) is locked to an immovable object with a 7mm SS chain (which weighs more than the carbon-aramid frame), the dinghy has a similar chain of 5m, locked to the OB and with a lock to its shoreside mooring ring. The mainhatch has a proximity switched siren with an on-off keyswitch in the cockpit locker and the washboards have twin barrel-locks. I haven't bothered to lock the liferaft in position, though it is double-strapped.
There are dire stories about the Caribbean - again I suspect that these problems only occur in the highly visited places. Interestingly, in the two N African countries I've visited, theft appeared to be uncommon.

 

[sailaboutvic]

Escape from theives, however avidly desired is probably not possible.

Rule-of-thumb - avoid "popular" places - and you'll find little differences to UK (which is probably not an accolade)

My thefts (off boat or boat associated) have been, as follows:-
UK - 3 small thefts in 12 years
France - 1 bike theft @ Pornichet (in 11 years in French waters) none in Mediterranean France
Spain - 1 theft in Barcelona (despite rigourous security) of cameras, passport and 6 lenses, and a theft of a bike in Cartagena. As I only spent 18 months in Spanish waters...
Malta - boat break-in @ Msida marina and about £12k of gear taken, including running rigging, electronics, foul weather gear and an old laptop. I was in Malta for 2 years. Malta has an unenviable reputation for boat-theft - so watch out SailaboutVic
Italy - 1 attempted bike theft - the criminal fell into the Darsena Traiano whilst awaiting the arrival of the police. Apparently an ethnic Romanian Roma. 1 inflatable stolen whilst ashore in Siracusa. Apparently the 8th inflatable theft in 4 weeks including a 23' RIB with twin Yamahas in the marina there, the "haul" landed up in Napoli and was finally stopped by action by the local famiglie, not the police.
Greece in 4 years no disappearances apart from the annoying ones of water-hose adaptors, clearly by fellow-marina users. Others have experienced thefts from boats at anchored but only in a couple of locations. IMHO Greece is probably the most honest country of all those I've visited. In any case most boat thefts are probably by fellow-visitors.

My bike (carefully disguised to look really shabby) is locked to an immovable object with a 7mm SS chain (which weighs more than the carbon-aramid frame), the dinghy has a similar chain of 5m, locked to the OB and with a lock to its shoreside mooring ring. The mainhatch has a proximity switched siren with an on-off keyswitch in the cockpit locker and the washboards have twin barrel-locks. I haven't bothered to lock the liferaft in position, though it is double-strapped.
There are dire stories about the Caribbean - again I suspect that these problems only occur in the highly visited places. Interestingly, in the two N African countries I've visited, theft appeared to be uncommon.

Thanks for the warming Charles , I can only say that I have sailed in Malta on and off for 15 years and it about the only place I have never had a problem or know of any one who had , you was very unlucky , But off course the times are chancing as Bob said and there are lot of boat people here , so yes it time to lock up here too .
It just show you different people experience the worst place I had for Thefts is Greece , two years ago I personal know for 12 thefts I. One year and one of them was in messilonghi Maria where a yacht was strip of thousand of pounds of gear .

 

[mocruising]

Ten years in the Med. the boat was broken in to in Sardinia and lots of gear stolen. In Kos two years ago had a bloke on board trying to steel my fishing rods but dropped them in to the harbour as I swiped him with an oar. We always lock the boat as its an insurance requirement (Must be forced entry). We have given up on an Atlantic circuit too many horror stories about security and dangers.

 

[TQA]

Well I am in my 11th year as full time liveaboard around the Atlantic circuit but mostly Caribbean. One dinghy/OB stolen OB was 28 yr old Johnson [go figure]. It was on a wire security link which was cut. I lift my new one every night.

There has been a lot of discussion about boat invasions as there have been two separate incidents with serious outcomes. Best advice seems to be to have a panic button which switches on VERY bright cockpit lights and a VERY loud horn.

Working on fitting mine.

 

[sailaboutvic]

Well I am in my 11th year as full time liveaboard around the Atlantic circuit but mostly Caribbean. One dinghy/OB stolen OB was 28 yr old Johnson [go figure]. It was on a wire security link which was cut. I lift my new one every night.

There has been a lot of discussion about boat invasions as there have been two separate incidents with serious outcomes. Best advice seems to be to have a panic button which switches on VERY bright cockpit lights and a VERY loud horn.

Working on fitting mine.

NOW that's a great idea . Just had an email from our friends in st martin and three time over the last few weeks someone have try to get into some one boat , they have now anchored way out in hope at they are not the next victim .

 

[KellysEye]

>There has been a lot of discussion about boat invasions as there have been two separate incidents with serious outcomes. Best advice seems to be to have a panic button which switches on VERY bright cockpit lights and a VERY loud horn.

It is indeed a great idea. TQA what about suggesting it to the Caribbean Safety and Security net, I think they will jump at broadcasting it.

 

[AndrewB]

I've not now had any thefts from the boat for 30 years, during which I've visited the Caribbean several times including many of the most notorious anchorages. (The one and only time was on the Medway). But for most of that time I owned a steel yacht to which I fitted steel bars across all the hatches, which made it difficult to break in. Far too many yachts have very weak locking, a temptation to thieves.

Be very careful if you carry active security. The nearest I came to using it was very late one night at a remote anchorage in Tonga, when I heard an intruder climbing onto the deck. I climbed out armed with a cylinder of CS gas (bought in Spain, by the way). Just in time I realised that it was a foolish youngster trying to sell bananas, who scuttled away very frightened when I yelled at her. I hate to think what the villagers might have done if I had squirted her with CS.

 

[Roberto]

Bear in mind that most cruisers fit out their boat to go sailing the French go sailing to fit out their boat, there is a French ISBN book on cruising which has a chapter on how to steal things. They usually steal things all the cruising season then mainly dinghies and outboards, and including at least one yacht from the BVI's, in May/early June when they go back over the Atlantic. Martinique is the worst island for theft in that period but be aware if French yachts are near where you are in that period.

Would you confirm what you just wrote please ?

 

[sailorgirl]

Being too lazy to battle to lift our dinghy in strong winds that seem to blow almost every night since we arrived in the Carib we purchased a long strong steel dog tether and lock it to both dinghy and boat. Added advantage is that being v long it ensures we are good neighbours at the dinghy dock keeping the dinghy well off the dock too.

Cockpit lights and hatchbars mean we can sleep soundly at night, though it helps that we usually anchor away from the shore to avoid nightclub and other noise.

 

[temptress]

Something that's been on my mind as I ponder my eventual departure to sail to distant lands.

I'm used to being pretty lazy about security. Live in a quiet part of the world where it's rare to lock your door, or your car. Wouldn't think twice about leaving my dinghy and outboard pulled up on the shore.

Assuming I end up doing an Atlantic circuit, taking in the usual sights, what is security going to be like? Do you just take your chances and leave your dinghy somewhere, hoping it will be still be there. Or is is normal to find a marina, or other secure area, and/or padlock the dinghy/outboard, etc? What about stuff left aboard the yacht- laptops, cash, passport, etc?

I guess this will vary from place to place, but I'm trying to work out whether my idyll of lazily cruising the world with few cares is actually possible?

Security is an issue wherever you are. Common sense and a few precautions are mostly what you need. We have sailed in the Med, Indian, Pacific and other places wihtout much troubloe. We heard all sorts of spotries about the Carribean but it is no worse than anywhere else.

 

[BobnLesley]

"Security is an issue wherever you are. Common sense and a few precautions are mostly what you need...all sorts of stories about the Carribean but it is no worse than anywhere else..."

Agreed, in 10 years UK - Med - Caribbean our only loss/theft has been our folding bikes: The first went in London and difficult to get rid of it was too: We were in Limehouse and nobody on the marina wanted the thing and we were told it couldn't go into the skip there, so I had the bright idea to ride it around to the DLR station and leave it parked there unlocked; it was over two days before someone did me the courtesy of nicking it!

Having kept (but rarely used) the other one we had it's seat stolen whilst in a boatyard in S Spain; as the bikes had cost me £15 for the pair and a new seat was going to be €35, I unlocked the bike and left a note on it (In Spanish & English) inviting whoever had taken the seat to take the rest of it too; it was still awaiting collection when we left a week or so later; perhaps it's still there?

 

[ukmctc]

Security of your boat and belongings are a problem where ever you are, always take the best precautions you can afford make sure you use them and make sure the insurance company you are with agrees with what you have, that's security and property, then when making a claim if anything happens there's no worries. Expect the worse and you can only be pleased with everything else.
We have a safe on board (hidden) and the usual padlocks and cables, even one for securing to the dock if required. Our insurance covers everything on, in, off and about.

 

[demonboy]

Gotta say some people's lax attitude towards security used to amaze me (I don't mean people on this forum. just general liveaboards we met). Perhaps it's a generational thing, or it could be because Liz's house got ransacked a few weeks before we departed England's fair shores (£15,000's worth of gear, I kid you not), but we NEVER leave the boat unlocked. Ever. If nothing else, your insurance company is unlikely to cover you if you do get caught out and left the boat unlocked. Of course the further east we've travelled, the less of a problem this has become (either on land or on the water), with the Red Sea, India and Thailand being extremely safe, but we still don't risk it. Let's face it, it takes an extra few seconds to lock the boat up. No big deal.

Of course there's the issue of dragging anchor and starting a stranger's engine to help him out, which has happened on one occasion (a bunch of us worked out how to get into the boat and start the engine in the end). As someone else pointed out, it's unlikely the whole boat will get nicked so leaving the ignition key somewhere obvious (to sailors) isn't a bad idea.

We also have hidey holes on the boat for passports and spare dollars. A keen burglar will eventually find them but no harm in making it a little bit more difficult for him. The worst thing that could get nicked for me would be my photographs, but these are backed up on multiple hard drives in different locations, and all my camera gear is insured. All our data is backed up on the cloud too so the only thing really worth worrying about are insurable electronic items, money and passports, which we hide anyway.

There was a spate recently in RLYC in Langkawi of a few boats being burgled. Not sure they got to the bottom of it but the ones that were done over were the unlocked ones where the owners nipped up the bar for a quick one. A few minutes is all it takes.

 

[KellysEye]

>Bear in mind that most cruisers fit out their boat to go sailing the French go sailing to fit out their boat...
>>Would you confirm what you just wrote please ?

We had to replace our generator in Martinique and that was what the French guy who ran the shop that sells and fits generators told us, they steal and about the book. He said that the worst case was a French yacht was caught leaving Martinique for France with ten outboard engines and dinghies on board. He also told us about French guys stealing a racing yacht in the BVI's and repainted and renamed it in French St Martin before heading to France.

We also know a yacht that was anchored in the Chagos archipelago and he was below deck and his wife had gone off to see a another boat in the dinghy. He heard a noise from the back of the boat and found two French guys trying to unbolt his wind vane, he shouted at them and they said "sorry wrong boat".

 

[Roberto]

We had to replace our generator in Martinique and that was what the French guy who ran the shop that sells and fits generators told us, they steal and about the book. He said that the worst case was a French yacht was caught leaving Martinique for France with ten outboard engines and dinghies on board. He also told us about French guys stealing a racing yacht in the BVI's and repainted and renamed it in French St Martin before heading to France.

We also know a yacht that was anchored in the Chagos archipelago and he was below deck and his wife had gone off to see a another boat in the dinghy. He heard a noise from the back of the boat and found two French guys trying to unbolt his wind vane, he shouted at them and they said "sorry wrong boat".

Oh I see, what a serious piece of information: all second hand hearsay, from unknown sources; I suppose your friends in the Chagos asked the two people their passports, to know they were French ?
Still you keep on generalising about French being thieves and a threat to "Security".

As you insist, I reported your post to the Moderators.
Do not bother to reply.