Schengen Loophole.

[billskip]

It's this bit that I'm unsure of as well.
I'm trying to work out the best plan for us.
We are checking into France next month with the intention of spending 6 months straight off, cruising the coast on way to Spain eventually.
Is it worth us both applying for 6 months residence (no fixed address as cruising so may be difficult) or on 89th day go somewhere else for a few days and return to possibly reset the 90 day clock and continue cruising.

If one of you has EU Passport you can stay in EU for 180+days so long as you stay together, but be careful with Spain if over 183 days.
Presumably you have a legal partnership/married

 

[Travelling Westerly]

As said in ^post ,the French immigration doesn't know if they are being lied to.
You dont have to make resident application after 90 days, you are supposed to make your presence known to the authorities.

I see so are you saying reporting yourself with the intention of say staying for 6 months won't necessarily require you to end up with full residence?
That makes sence as full residency won't personally be wanted for France.

 

[Graham376]

Agreed, but the earlier post said a non resident was travelling with an Irish passport holder(spouse? ) and the non resident was stamped.
I can understand that because there is no guarantee they will transit. If at a later time they continue legally, then I dont see a problem.

The non-resident was stamped because he/she can't be "in transit" to their country of residence, if they don't have residence.

AFAIK, a non-resident partner of EU citizen will most likely be limited to 90/180 in Schengen but I haven't bothered looking that up as it doesn't apply to us.

P.S. There are so many variations in people's situations, the safest bet is to email Europe Direct, give them your circumstances and ask where you stand.

 

[westernman]

Scenario - check into France, on the 89th day we go to Spain for a few days, get a stamp in passport. Then return to France. Does this reset our 90 days and hence no need for registration /residence application?

Passports are not checked going from France to Spain. Neither by plane nor by road.
I usually cross the France <-> Spain border at 90km/h without slowing down.
You won't find anyone anywhere to stamp your passport.

Google Maps

 

[billskip]

I see so are you saying reporting yourself with the intention of say staying for 6 months won't necessarily require you to end up with full residence?
That makes sence as full residency won't personally be wanted for France.

Provided one of you holds an EU passport and you have legal documents re partnership/marriage.

 

[Travelling Westerly]

Passports are not checked going from France to Spain. Neither by plane nor by road.
I usually cross the France <-> Spain border at 90km/h without slowing down.
You won't find anyone anywhere to stamp your passport.

Google Maps

I did wonder if that may be the case. I could get some receipts though etc to prove movement from one country to another.
It might be dangerous for me looking for a passport stamp on that dual carriage way

 

[Travelling Westerly]

If one of you has EU Passport you can stay in EU for 180+days so long as you stay together, but be careful with Spain if over 183 days.
Presumably you have a legal partnership/married

Yes married
What's the deal with Spain and 183 days?

 

[Graham376]

I see so are you saying reporting yourself with the intention of say staying for 6 months won't necessarily require you to end up with full residence?
That makes sence as full residency won't personally be wanted for France.

I suspect it's not as simple as that, remember we're now third country citizens, no longer citizens of an EU country with automatic rights. Residence of any form has many implications such as being in the tax system and to apply for it needs proof of funds, health insurance, an address, etc.

 

[billskip]

Yes married
What's the deal with Spain and 183 days?

As Graham says in post 108 .
If you are in spain for more than 183 days you automatically become a tax resident, something that may be best avoided.
I would advise anyone to seek information from the gov website or professional people to ensure your within your rights.
I dont for one moment believe there are problems with misunderstandings and believe all will be helpful home and abroad provided one doesn't try to dictate to the authorities.

 

[st599]

It's this bit that I'm unsure of as well.
I'm trying to work out the best plan for us.
We are checking into France next month with the intention of spending 6 months straight off, cruising the coast on way to Spain eventually.
Is it worth us both applying for 6 months residence (no fixed address as cruising so may be difficult) or on 89th day go somewhere else for a few days and return to possibly reset the 90 day clock and continue cruising.

It's 90 in a rolling 180 window, so say you leave the EU for 7 days after 89, that only gives you 7 days back in the EU.

 

[AndersG]

The non-resident was stamped because he/she can't be "in transit" to their country of residence, if they don't have residence.

AFAIK, a non-resident partner of EU citizen will most likely be limited to 90/180 in Schengen but I haven't bothered looking that up as it doesn't apply to us.

P.S. There are so many variations in people's situations, the safest bet is to email Europe Direct, give them your circumstances and ask where you stand.

I did ask the EU. I told them I'm a EU citizen. My wife only a British citizen and we are both resident in England. There answer was that she did not have to abide by the 90/180 as long as she travelled with me or to me.

 

[Travelling Westerly]

It's 90 in a rolling 180 window, so say you leave the EU for 7 days after 89, that only gives you 7 days back in the EU.

Well that's really confused me, are you sure, it's the first I've heard of that.

 

[AndersG]

Well that's really confused me, are you sure, it's the first I've heard of that.

It's definitely 90 days in any 180 unless you are EU resident or citizen.

 

[Travelling Westerly]

It's definitely 90 days in any 180 unless you are EU resident or citizen.

That's just it, he's quoted me and for the last 6 odd threads directly above I have very clearly said I'm an EU citizen with UK partner hence I'm really confused with his statement or he's not been keeping up at the back of the class?
I'm pretty sure it's not 90 in 180 as well for my partner, she can claim same FOM as I do but you never know somebody else may have spotted something that contradicts this.

 

[Kelpie]

I did ask the EU. I told them I'm a EU citizen. My wife only a British citizen and we are both resident in England. There answer was that she did not have to abide by the 90/180 as long as she travelled with me or to me.

Likewise. We're in the exact same position. My wife and son have UK passports, they were stamped at every opportunity. Last time was going from La Línea to Gib and back, when they were past their 90 days. Not a word was said. I'm still not sure whether the border officials didn't care, or if they knew all about the spouse rules and had seen it all before.

Anyway our tactic is to keep our heads down, and when we present ourselves at a marina we carry a print out of the emails from the Europe Direct Contact Centre, as well as the relevant pages from there European Commission website. I also make a point of presenting my Irish passport first.

So far it's been fine. We've not had to present the UK passports to anybody since our last marina stay which was more than three months ago.

I'm not sure what to make of the 'registration after 90 days' requirement. It seems to be intended for people who want to stay in one place. Certainly in the past it never bothered people- I know someone who rented a house in France for six months and didn't bother to register... no problems.

 

[Kelpie]

That's just it, he's quoted me and for the last 6 odd threads directly above I have very clearly said I'm an EU citizen with UK partner hence I'm really confused with his statement or he's not been keeping up at the back of the class?
I'm pretty sure it's not 90 in 180 as well for my partner, she can claim same FOM as I do but you never know somebody else may have spotted something that contradicts this.

Yes, it's supposed to be no time limit for spouses of EU citizens. But not many have first hand experience of relying on this and it could be open to interpretation by officials.

 

[Travelling Westerly]

Yes, it's supposed to be no time limit for spouses of EU citizens. But not many have first hand experience of relying on this and it could be open to interpretation by officials.

Agreed but when I contacted the EU help line they said after 90 days in one country I had to present both of us for registration.
I take that to mean there is a possibility of moving out of that country for a few days, get some receipts to prove movement out of country hence no 90 day overstay then return having reset the clock complete another 89 day stay. Technically I can't see anything wrong with this and it negates the need for possible residency applications?
Problem as you say is not many people have real world experience of this, damn, some people can't even be bothered to read the full thread before jumping in late and posting incorrect info....
Looks like another email to the EU help desk...

 

[billskip]

Agreed but when I contacted the EU help line they said after 90 days in one country I had to present both of us for registration.
I take that to mean there is a possibility of moving out of that country for a few days, get some receipts to prove movement out of country hence no 90 day overstay then return having reset the clock complete another 89 day stay. Technically I can't see anything wrong with this and it negates the need for possible residency applications?
Problem as you say is not many people have real world experience of this, damn, some people can't even be bothered to read the full thread before jumping in late and posting incorrect info....
Looks like another email to the EU help desk...

I would be interested to know what the EU help desk says.
My belief is that after 90 days registering is basically making yourself known as said earlier this applies to all people, but there is no commitment to anything residential befor 183 days

 

[Graham376]

I did ask the EU. I told them I'm a EU citizen. My wife only a British citizen and we are both resident in England. There answer was that she did not have to abide by the 90/180 as long as she travelled with me or to me.

That's good news and leaves me wondering whether to give up my residence status if I don't need it, would make life simpler.

As your wife isn't a resident but in your company, what happens with her passport, do they stamp it or not?

 

[billskip]

That's good news and leaves me wondering whether to give up my residence status if I don't need it, would make life simpler.

As your wife isn't a resident but in your company, what happens with her passport, do they stamp it or not?

I fail to understand why there is so much concern about a stamp in a passport, ( unless it's trying to dodge the system)
Also giving up your residence ( only you know the adv & disadv) still puts one in the position of abiding by the UK rules with reference to being absent from the UK for more than 180 days.