? RYA Questionnaire On Boating In The EU 27 (esp the 90/180 rule).?

[nortada]

According to the RYA Legal team at the annual cruising conference, the EU offered 6 months visa free if the UK reciprocated, the UK said no, you can have 6 months with a visa. Far more worrying are all the extra rules that this will incur. Entry and Exit from Ports of Entry etc.

Think you may find it was the other way round, the UK made the offer but the EU is still considering it, but it is of little matter, because as it would drive a coach and horses through Schengen, I cannot see how Brits can expect to get 6 months travel in the EU.

I think Brits need to appreciate after 31/12/20, they will be treated in exactly the same way as all other non-EU residents visiting the EU.

Possibly, the important question is how easy is it to get residency in those countries bordering the EU (Ireland, Nederlands, Belgium and France)?

With residency yachtsmen would be treated like all other EU residents, with unlimited stay in their host country plus up to 90 days Schengen Country and no visa requirements.

This would meet the cruising needs of most UK based sailors. It would also mean flying for holidays further afield would be on the cards.

 

[st599]

Think you may find it was the other way round, the UK made the offer but the EU is still considering it, but it is of little matter, because as it would drive a coach and horses through Schengen, I cannot see how Brits can expect to get 6 months travel in the EU.


This would meet the cruising needs of most UK based sailors. It would also mean flying for holidays further afield would be on the cards.

Nope, EU made offer, UK rejected. UK is offering 6 months access with a Visa.

It certainly won't meet most UK sailors cruising needs. The requirement to enter and exit the EU via a Port of Entry would drastically alter many Weekend trips to France for example.

 

[nortada]

Nope, EU made offer, UK rejected. UK is offering 6 months access with a Visa.

It certainly won't meet most UK sailors cruising needs. The requirement to enter and exit the EU via a Port of Entry would drastically alter many Weekend trips to France for example.

That is why residency may be the only answer.

Even with residency there may still be a requirement to enter exit via a Port of Entry.

Post the TP, I would be surprised if these were to change so where are they?

Then there will be the question of how much bureaucracy - that could be the real killer.

 

[GHA]

Possibly, the important question is how easy is it to get residency in those countries bordering the EU (Ireland,

Easy if you meet the criteria. You need someone to notarize the form, solicitor friend of a friend did mine and was contacted. Then a few weeks later in pops an EU passport, 70Euros.

 

[nortada]

Easy if you meet the criteria. You need someone to notarize the form, solicitor friend of a friend did mine and was contacted. Then a few weeks later in pops an EU passport, 70Euros.

As you mention passports, I think you may be into citizenship rather than residency.

To the best of my knowledge, residents don't get passports?

Ireland - not even sure your average Brit can get residency?

If you have a passport/citizenship, don't think you need residency?

 

[GHA]

As you mention passports, I think you may be into citizenship rather than residency.

To the best of my knowledge, residents don't get passports?

Ireland, not even sure your average Brit can get residency?

Ah, yes, citizenship. Auto if you were born in the north, various criteria regarding parents/grandparents being born there.

 

[Baggywrinkle]

Your Guide to (Legally) Staying in Europe for More Than 90 Days

It's not easy as a third country national - I have an American friend who is a long-term resident in Germany and the Schengen rules put a considerable damper on her ability to travel freely. The UK would be the only country in the world with "special" Schengen rules for it's citizens IF some kind of deal can be arranged.

Residency in one EU country grants a longer stay in that country, and time spent there doesn't add days to your "Schengen clock" - 90/180 still applies to the rest of the Schengen area though.

If I were not a dual citizen I would buy some time by moving my boat to Croatia which is not yet in Schengen - then do Italy/Croatia/Greece/Montenegro

Although the internal borders are all open to cars etc. the external borders, which includes all airports or places where your passport is checked, have a direct link to the Schengen database so overstaying does constitute a risk which carries unpleasant penalties.

 

[nortada]

Your Guide to (Legally) Staying in Europe for More Than 90 Days

It's not easy as a third country national - I have an American friend who is a long-term resident in Germany and the Schengen rules put a considerable damper on her ability to travel freely. The UK would be the only country in the world with "special" Schengen rules for it's citizens IF some kind of deal can be arranged.

Residency in one EU country grants a longer stay in that country, and time spent there doesn't add days to your "Schengen clock" - 90/180 still applies to the rest of the Schengen area though.

If I were not a dual citizen I would buy some time by moving my boat to Croatia which is not yet in Schengen - then do Italy/Croatia/Greece/Montenegro

Although the internal borders are all open to cars etc. the external borders, which includes all airports or places where your passport is checked, have a direct link to the Schengen database so overstaying does constitute a risk which carries unpleasant penalties.

As a German Resident, I assume your fried is allowed unlimited stay in Germany plus 90 days in 180 in any other EU country?

With the soon to be introduced EU-wide biometric residency permit, status and tracking will become even easier.

 

[Baggywrinkle]

As a German Resident, I assume your fried is allowed unlimited stay in Germany plus 90 days in 180 in any other EU country?

With the soon to be introduced EU-wide biometric residency permit, status and tracking will become even easier.

Yes, that is exactly what she is allowed. Residency in Germany (or any Schengen state) automatically bestows a Schengen Visa on the residence holder, she has to travel with her German Residency Permit (Aufenthaltserlaubnis) and her US passport at all times and present both at any passport control. I've seen her get reminded by a Slovenian border guard in no uncertain terms when she handed over her passport but forgot the permit which was in her bag. At a guess, he thought he'd caught a visa-overstayer until she pulled out her residence permit and cleared up the misunderstanding.

 

[nortada]

Yes, that is exactly what she is allowed. Residency in Germany (or any Schengen state) automatically bestows a Schengen Visa on the residence holder, she has to travel with her German Residency Permit (Aufenthaltserlaubnis) and her US passport at all times and present both at any passport control. I've seen her get reminded by a Slovenian border guard in no uncertain terms when she handed over her passport but forgot the permit which was in her bag. At a guess, he thought he'd caught a visa-overstayer until she pulled out her residence permit and cleared up the misunderstanding.

I can live with this.

 

[Koeketiene]

I think Brits need to appreciate after 31/12/20, they will be treated in exactly the same way as all other non-EU residents visiting the EU.

Possibly, the important question is how easy is it to get residency in those countries bordering the EU (Ireland, Nederlands, Belgium and France)?

Ireland is NOT a Schengen country.
So Irish residency won't help the average Brit avoid the 90/180 rule.
An Irish passport OTOH ...

 

[nortada]

Ireland is NOT a Schengen country.
So Irish residency won't help the average Brit avoid the 90/180 rule.
An Irish passport OTOH ...

Good point - but if I held Irish residency, would I not benefit from the same privileges for freedom of movement?

 

[jordanbasset]

Good point - but if I held Irish residency, would I not benefit from the same privileges for freedom of movement?

I don't think so, you would need an Irish passport/citizenship, or put it this way does Portuguese residency for non EU Nationals give people freedom of movement in rest of the EU?

 

[Koeketiene]

Good point - but if I held Irish residency, would I not benefit from the same privileges for freedom of movement?

No, because Ireland is not a Schengen country.

 

[nortada]

No, because Ireland is not a Schengen country.

But my Irish friends enjoy full freedom of movement in the EU

 

[Koeketiene]

But my Irish friends enjoy full freedom of movement in the EU

Because they are Irish (and therefore EU) citizens.
A Brit with Irish residency will not enjoy the same privilege because Ireland is not a Schengen country.
Residency in a non-Schengen country does not grant you freedom of movement in the Schengen area.

 

[shan]

But my Irish friends enjoy full freedom of movement in the EU

Do they have an Irish passport?

 

[nortada]

Do they have an Irish passport?

So it is the passport rather than a residency permit that confers the right of freedom of movement

From my position, all rather academic.

 

[shan]

So it is the passport rather than a residency permit that confers the right of freedom of movement

From my position, all rather academic.

In the same way, having a French or Portuguese Passport would confer those rights - because ultimately it is evidence that you have Citizenship of an EU member country. of course NI Citizens have the right to RoI Citizenship, therefore the same rights as an EU member citizen.

 

[nortada]

In the same way, having a French or Portuguese Passport would confer those rights - because ultimately it is evidence that you have Citizenship of an EU member country. of course NI Citizens have the right to RoI Citizenship, therefore the same rights as an EU member citizen.

Citizenship is something rather different from residency.

In the Schengen Zone it is Residency of an EU state that confers the freedom of movement. Albeit modified in the case of non-EU citizens.

Citizenship tends to cloud the issue so as it is easier to acquire and meets the needs of most, I tend to stay withIn the implications of residency and leave the academic debates to others.