Riding lights

Sailfree, as this thread has shown it is purely down to personal preference but I would if I were you. As one approaches the shore from the north the hulls of the boats are obscured as they are in line with the dark breakwater or beach. The bright lights around the harbour behind do not help and would mask a masthead light. A riding light above your foredeck would make you very visible. IMHO.
 
Re: solar powered garden (gnome) Riding lights

We are in Parkstone Yacht Haven but were on a mooring part of the time in the Wych but mostly by the North Channel at Lilliput SC for 25 years, from the days when Truckline used that channel and not the 'new' main channel in the middle. We were occasionally bumped by dinghies, especially when they used #35 buoy by our mooring as a race mark and had scratches left at dinghy boom height, bent lifebouy holders etc. We also had our big red buoy pinched (they left us a manky smaller one) and had the 12mm chain mooring strop 'swapped' for a rusty 8mm one.

And NO I didn't have a riding light on!

Are we safer in PYC Haven.......well it doesn't seem like it if the Dart 18s are tacking out in a NE wind past our berth or like the Fireball open weekend when one passed our berth (inside the marina) flat out with the crew on the wire!

Robin
 
Come on Martin. Don't sit on the fence. Tell him what you think.

I've been up and down Walton channel a great number of times where there are hundreds of moorings and have yet to see a riding light. They're often missing at the anchorage at the top of the channel at Stone Point. Naughty,naughty!

Kim
 
Not replying to anyone in particular ...

Very interesting thread. The focus of the debate seems to be whether a vessel tied to a mooring is "at anchor" for the purposes of the ColRegs. I suppose we will have to wait for a court to opine on this before the debate can be settled.

From a common sense point of view, however, it occurs to me that charts show many unlit obstructions - bouys, rocks, marks - and areas where moorings are laid. Anyone entering such an area should proceed at an appropriate speed, and with an appropriate lookout (perhaps even with an appropriate searchlight), to be able to react to the obstruction when it is sighted. It should not matter whether the boats themselves are lit - the weary sailor knows that there are unlit obstructions in the area, and that some of them might be boats attached to moorings.

In this case A_7, it looks like you know you were entering an area of moorings. Unless you actually clunked into one of the boats no-one can accuse you of failing to proceed at a proper speed / keep a proper lookout because you were actually able to avoid a collision. But it looks like your complaint that the boats were unlit might be misplaced.

My $0.02.
 
[ QUOTE ]
Sorry - Got to ask. As I normally arrive at Yarmouth too late for any vacant mooring buoys I normally anchor to the west of the buoys ( good photos of boats aground on black rock from there)

Should I or would you use an anchor light in this position- sorry Robin we only have the masthead light and I agree it gets lost in the background cluuter.

[/ QUOTE ]

As you would be where someone might not expect you to be anchored then I would probably use a riding light, as I would if anchoring to the north of the moorings. However as a general rule I hate anchoring off Yarmouth because of the problems with wind against tide, I hate seeing the boat ride up over the chain and scraping underneath and so on. In the same circumstances I would probably chose to anchor behind Hurst Castle out of the tide and yes I would put a light on there.

Robin
 
Re: solar powered garden (gnome) Riding lights

Sorry Robin I don't know where he is actually moored, and although I got the impression he is a member of Parkstone I may be wrong. His name is Ian Stockdale, the (founding) Commodore of the Elizabethan Owners Association and the boat is "Mistweave", a rather pretty pale blue colour. If you're interested in keeping up with Elizabethans then it only costs £7.50 to join the EOA, but I'm afraid you missed this year's south coast get-together in Yarmouth (as did I). I've a 29 myself, which is not really in the same league.
Dave
 
going back to my original point - a vessel on a mooring buoy still needs a riding light as she is technically at anchor - hence my response.

your offering :

'Never mentioned at anchor, there's no issue there. We are talking pernament moorings in an area marked as such on a chart .. have you ever seen one or were you merely the comic act in the cabaret'

is seen by me as your typical ranting ........

the rest of your question is so silly its not worth a reply .... it puts your maturity, conversational abilities and debating prowness in full view of all to see. do you actually take pride in being seen as the prat 'naughty boy' here in the forum, and seek to maintain it, or are you naturally a hostile and argumentitive person.

maybe I was wrong in stopping ignoring your postings here - I have not learned anything from you except the extent of your acerbic drivel.......

so - its off to the sin bin again for you ......... bye

/forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif
 
Erm .. suspect that you are perceived as the inane ranter by all and sundry. I actually take a sort of immature pleasure in tweaking your tail as your response is, too say the least predictable, when your depth of knowledge is challenged. A typical response of those of a shallow and fragile constitution not backed by any real depth of knowledge or experience. Quite frankly your claim that your rowing boat experience gives you well rounded sea experience is laughable.. IMHO you are a fraud, full of sound and fury signifying nothing. I suspect the extent of your sea experience is the vision from the depths of a bath chair propelled along Bournemouth seafront.
 
[ QUOTE ]
going back to my original point - a vessel on a mooring buoy still needs a riding light as she is technically at anchor

[/ QUOTE ]

Is she? Clearly we can all see the similarities between being moored and being anchored, but there is a difference in that you can drop the hook anywhere, but you can only pick up a mooring where one has been permanently installed - usually in an area marked on the chart.

I am not actually taking sides here because I genuinely do not know whether a moored boat is or is not technically "at anchor" for the purposes of the ColRegs. If anyone has any support for one position or the other beyond a bare assertion, I for one would be grateful to hear it.
 
Re: solar powered garden (gnome) Riding lights

Dave

I used to own 'Callisto of Parkstone' also a pretty light blue one until about 18 years ago but I still have a half model of her and pics on the wall. I don't remember seeing Mistweave anywhere or know Ian Stockdale but we do have lots of members I don't know or maybe he is Poole Yacht Club.

Robin
 
sorry for the delay .... am v busy getting final stuff and packing my kit to fly out to angola for a couple of months early tommorrow morning ......

point one .... I havnt time to find the justification, its burried in the 'implied' and extrapolates from being underway or affixed to the shore/anchor bit - maybe you might wanna ask other knowledgeable forumites what constitutes that scenario ?

secondly, I am not kidding but for hm gov a drill ship in the middle of noware in 2000m of water is construed as being at anchor cos its connected to the seabed ...... again I dont have time to support it with hard evidence ...... but its true

ask any proper seamanship school about what difference being on a buoy makes, if you are connected to the seabed by rafting up, caught up in a fishing float, at anchor or by laying too a mooring ..... you are still at anchor. - and yes ...... again I dont have the time to find and quote reams of writing ........ maybe another professional seaman can offer you guidance in finding the written answer....... or a phone call by you to a reputable knowledgable friend.

so - rule 30

A vessel of less than seven metres in length, when at anchor, not in or near a narrow channel, fairway or anchorage, or where other vessels normally navigate, shall not be required to exhibit the lights or shape prescribed in paragraphs (a) and (b) of this Rule.

a and b being light and ball for differing lengths of vessel

I fail to see how its a confusion ......... it is blatently clear what lights and shapes are needed and by whome. it implies a vessel less than 7 m doesnt need to display an anchor ball or light if anchored NOT near a channel, fairway or anchorage where other vessels normally navigate ...... so vessels over 7 m do ......

if I was chatting over a beer in a pub/club it would probably be easier ..... but at the moment I am unsure if you are being obtuse, difficult or jusy bloody minded like others here in the forum. if it is a genuine question then sorry ....... I will be happy to answer further and fuller on my return in september.

until then - maybe other forumites will take the time and look into the nuances of the colregs.

oh - in conclusion ........ if you return to your boat, which isnt displaying the appropriate day and night signals for a boat at anchor, and find you boat has been pranged, how are you going to sucessfully fill out the insurance claim form claiming you complied with the minimum requirements - without lying .
 
mmmmm - if I thought it was worth it jimi ..... I would respond to your jibes ....

but I dont. I suppose you will have to find someone else to annoy/goad/abuse/or whatever ........ you sad person

/forums/images/graemlins/cool.gif
 
re. Callisto

Robin,
I have met the boat, I think she's still in Poole. I believe I'm correct in saying the current owners are EOA members. Sorry I can't remember their names. I can PM you Ian's address, or it is available on the website. As the E29 "official anorak" I don't know as much about the other marques as I probably ought. When we moored against "Mistweave" and "Liz" a few years ago I was struck by the similarity in hull shape, even though the 30 is a bigger boat in other dimensions. I wouldn't swap "Evadne" but I do envy their accomodation size and hull speed.
I promised to meet up with Ian if and when we next call in to Poole, hopefully this summer, I'll drop you a line at the same time if you like.
Meanwhile, I finish work in a couple of hours and we're off to Weymouth on Sunday, weather permitting!
yours,
Dave
 
Nice troll, and we know you can't be serious, but it comes down to the question of "Does being on a mooring subject you to the rules of anchoring?"

If being on a mooring is different (which I am sure it is but can't prove it), then custom, practice, ColRegs and the vast majority of respondents are correct.

If being on a mooring is the same as anchoring then you are right, and custom, practice and ColRegs are wrong and need changing.

Essentially your position is the same as somebody who's "proved" that all parked cars need to have hazard lights on even if left for weeks. You couldn't follow your own interpretation of the rules and nor could anybody else.
 
This is all just nonsense. There are thousands of boats bigger than 7 metres on identifiable moorings ( not at anchor in an unrecognised mooring area) in all sorts of nooks and crannies that for years have not put up lights at night or balls during the day. If this was not OK what do you think the insurance companies would do?
As for the insults - just relax: enjoy yourself it's later than you think
 
Re: re. Callisto

Thanks Dave

When we sold Callisto she went to the East coast somewhere as the owner lived in Yorkshire I think.

Enjoy Weymouth, we are having a 'get ready for hols' weekend and staying on board but in our berth at PYC. We are off next week, probably Thursday night headed via Dartmouth then on south for the Morbihan. Whoopeeeee!

Robin
 
For what it's worth there are over 380 buoyed moorings at Itchenor in Chichester harbour and I have never seen a boat on one of these bouys with an anchor light on.

moorings_Itchenor.jpg


I know this proves nothing although I have been led to believe that if you are in a recognised anchorage such as east head, there is no requirement to display an anchore ball or lights. Personally I would have a light on if at anchore overnight and have done so a whilst anchored outside Yarmouth.
 
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