PYH KICKING OUT 50% OF THEIR LIVABOARDS

[capnsensible]

What about halyards banging? Drives some posters to explode with indignation.

 

[Poignard]

The yard in Brittany where I dry-sail from has some very fine houses nearby. The yard owner has laid down rules that prohibit the use of machine tools out of working hours. Many of the boatowners take no notice of these rules.

Which reminds me that I must decide which impact driver to buy before the Black Friday offers end.

 

[Bilgediver]

it is political, because it is a discussion about how one should run/administer the common good (the "polis"). I have nothing against this. At all. In fact, I think the ban on political discourse in these pages is wrong. Writing about sea-horses and anchoring is political. Discussing limitations on "liveaboards" in marinas is political.

I disagree

It is a matter of finding out what resources exist for travellers and adapt. There are thousands of narrowboaters coping with all these problems and more . They get their kids to school, get prescriptions and get their mail. Just needs an enquiring mind. Some are in marinas on the canal system and not under threat of eviction. There are many Narrow Boat Forums discussing these matters.

The biggest problem with coastal marinas is sorting out the local rates issues.. The canal marinas seem to have sorted this.

 

[TiggerToo]

I disagree.....

The biggest problem with coastal marinas is sorting out the local rates issues.. The canal marinas seem to have sorted this.

"Sorting out" the management of society is "political".

Otherwise: what do you define as "polititcal"?

 

[Bristolfashion]

Certainly in NSW, Australia, living aboard is not allowed. And, even more weirdly,

"The Marine Safety Regulation 2016 does not allow a vessel to be at anchor (including made fast to the shore) in a single geographical location — such as in a bay, waterway or locality — for more than 28 consecutive days, or for more than 90 days in NSW waters."

So some places are VERY restrictive!

The sea marinas & inland waterways were never intended to be a form of permanent housing provision - although I have every sympathy with those currently in difficulties.

Certainly "nomadic" life - moving from place to place - is no problem. Sadly, the more obvious live aboards tend to mess things up for the subtle, under the radar types - only so many bikes, plants, washing etc on an obviously never going to move boat before someone notices!

Our friends, who lived under the radar for many years, only did washing on a Sunday when the marina office was closed!

 

[Bru]

..... There are thousands of narrowboaters coping with all these problems and more . They get their kids to school, get prescriptions and get their mail. Just needs an enquiring mind. .

Actually, there isn't thousands coping. There's a few hundred and not many hundreds at that

That's residential narrowboaters who are living reasonably within the norms of society e g. schooling, working (or retired), doctors, prescriptions, taxes etc. And the vast majority of those are retired genuine continuous cruisers

What there are thousands of, and again it's not as many as people often think, maybe two to three thousand at most and mostly focused on the major cities, especially London, are a group of people living partially or almost entirely outwith the norms of society. They don't pay their dues, subsist on benefits and are often antisocial to boot

Those are the extremes of course and you can find every shade in between

Some are in marinas on the canal system and not under threat of eviction. There are many Narrow Boat Forums discussing these matters

Indeed but be aware that those discussions are heavily coloured by two vociferous and opposing factions with deeply entrenched positions

There are very few genuine residential moorings on the canals, far fewer than there are people living on canal boats

The biggest problem with coastal marinas is sorting out the local rates issues.. The canal marinas seem to have sorted this.

Where canal marinas have PP for residential moorings, the council tax issue can be resolved by an increase in the business rates or it can be dealt with on a berth by berth basis (it depends on the specific circumstances). This is also the case for residential berths in coastal waters and for residential static caravan parks etc., there is nothing intrinsically special about canal marinas.

It's not the biggest problem for coastal marinas, it simply isn't a problem at all. The issue is all about planning permission. If PP is granted for residual berths, the mechanisms are already in situ for dealing with taxation matters

 

[ryanroberts]

The canal marinas seem to have sorted this.

Very few canal marinas have significant official residential, particularly anywhere urban. New Islington in manchester was planned from the beginning as mostly residential as part of a gentrification project. Now the area features more than a methadone clinic and wasteland crawling with manchester's finest citizens many of the occupants of the posh new flats want the boats gone too. Air quality, noise from maintenance, being a bit grubby etc.

I was there for less than 2 weeks in 2012 before going continuous cruiser, having lived in the region for quite a few years I knew exactly how it was going to go after seeing the lax security. People living in boats at New Islington Marina are being abused by thugs .

Charging the local landlubbers to maintain the marina doesn't help either New Islington residents furious after being asked to pay £200 a year for marina

 

[ryanroberts]

I am not sure allowing residential berths will fix it, at least not at reasonable costs if any tenant's rights are granted.

 

[doug748]

Really?

You stated - and I quote :-

"Wonder why such problems dont exist elsewhere."

I pointed out that other countries have EXACTLY the same problems.

It is not unique to the UK......................

Indeed, you are quite right to point this out.

Some daft comments are made for the sake of daftness, some may be sincerely made out of stupidity, who knows?

Anyway, in the old days all scholars, who might one day operate in the public domain, were made familiar with Robert Thouless on Straight and Crooked Thinking. Here is a download which the hapless one might profit from.
Chapter 2 covers it:

https://neglectedbooks.com/Straight_and_Crooked_Thinking.pdf

.

 

[capnsensible]

Indeed, you are quite right to point this out.

Some daft comments are made for the sake of daftness, some may be sincerely made out of stupidity, who knows?

Anyway, in the old days all scholars, who might one day operate in the public domain, were made familiar with Robert Thouless on Straight and Crooked Thinking. Here is a download which the hapless one might profit from.
Chapter 2 covers it:

https://neglectedbooks.com/Straight_and_Crooked_Thinking.pdf

.

Of course others have actually spent decades living aboard and have had no problems in many countries......

There are talkers and walkers and armchair boors.

 

[doug748]

Of course others have actually spent decades living aboard and have had no problems in many countries......

There are talkers and walkers and armchair boors.

See Thouless, ibid, esp:

Suggestion by repeated affirmation
Affectation of false authority
Diversion to another question, side issue or irrelevance

I will admit it's an old source, one bloke said he had been: "busting bullshitters since 1933."

.

 

[Kelpie]

What is a Liveaboard?

One definition I have seen is somebody who spends more than 50% of their time on board in a single location.

Why a single location?
What do you call people who live on their boat but but on a single fixed location?

 

[rotrax]

Of course others have actually spent decades living aboard and have had no problems in many countries......

There are talkers and walkers and armchair boors.

But that is CLEARLY not what you infered, is it?

'Fess up, dont dig yourself in too deep...................

 

[Fr J Hackett]

The yard in Brittany where I dry-sail from has some very fine houses nearby. The yard owner has laid down rules that prohibit the use of machine tools out of working hours. Many of the boatowners take no notice of these rules.

Which reminds me that I must decide which impact driver to buy before the Black Friday offers end.

Makita.

 

[AngusMcDoon]

What do you call people who live on their boat but not on a single fixed location?

Lucky bustards.

 

[nortada]

"Sorting out" the management of society is "political".

Otherwise: what do you define as "polititcal"?

Maximising self-interest.?

 

[Kelpie]

Lucky bustards.

Oh well I've been called the second half of that often enough.

 

[DFL1010]

But that is CLEARLY not what you infered, is it?

'Fess up, dont dig yourself in too deep...................

The speaker implies, the listener infers.

 

[nortada]

Why a single location?
What do you call people who live on their boat but but on a single fixed location?

In the connotation of this thread, Liveaboard is in the perspective of the provider, shore-based authorities or fellow boaters. It follows that liveaboards who regularly move on will not be perceived to be a fixture, liability, sponger or pain in the arse.

 

[rotrax]

The speaker implies, the listener infers.

Well done - I stand corrected - thank you.

I have broad enough shoulders to put my hand up when wrong...................... " I done it, it was me!"