PYH KICKING OUT 50% OF THEIR LIVABOARDS

[mikefleetwood]

Can you not give your permanent/home address as that of a close relative (or friend)? When my sister decided to spend her time living in a motor home circumnavigating the UK (shoreside!), she gave our address as her home. It worked for all normal correspondence including NHS and DVLA. We did the same for our son when he went to New Zealand. The only problem I can see is where you need to provide a utility bill to prove residence - which could be more tricky!

 

[Leisure 27]

Why can you not live in EU now?

Brexit

 

[Yealm]

Very sad. Is PYH the only Plymouth marina that allows (allowed) live-aboards ?

 

[LittleSister]

Be aware that there are places that will tolerate live-aboards, especially those that are discreet about it and pleasant to have around, but don't like this to be broadcast on forums such as this.

A friend was a considerate live aboard, fully known to the yard, and appreciated by the neighbouring boats as he would keep an eye on them when the owners were away. Someone posted online that the place accepted live-aboards, suddenly the yard started getting lots of enquiries and people turning up. They panicked, and my friend was asked to leave, causing him considerable grief.

 

[ryanroberts]

It is a silly game we have to play. I rather embarrassingly officially live with my parents in late middle age, so for legal purposes I just spend a lot of time on the boat.. As a canal boater for over a decade I was a compliant continuous cruiser, but this model obviously doesn't really work very well in the sea in UK winters. All I can do it try not to be a dick and deploy the ultimate liveaboard camouflage - a shiny boat that actually goes cruising for extended periods. PYH going is annoying as I was thinking of moving further west next year, I am lucky enough not to be tied to a particular place at least. It seems to be a problem with planning regulations and general attitude to unsettled lifestyles in all anglophone countries? Much of the USA is as bad. I hear insurance can also be an issue.

The last thing we need is any 'rights / discrimination' discourse, as that would kill it for sure, would be noting left but 10 council berths in Newport with a 20 year waiting list. The NBTA on the canals are a nightmare with their naive SWP adjacent campaigning and trying to use the human rights act to justify flouting the rules, have caused more issues than they solved.

A particularly spectacular case was the chap who set up on the visitor moorings near waltham abbey, then proceeded to fence off the area around his new mooring and populate it with sheep, claiming some medieval law allowed him to live there. There are no visitor moorings now.

 

[PeteCooper]

Brexit

Brexit doesn't stop you living in the EU - slightly more red tape but still eminently doable.

 

[wombat88]

Be aware that there are places that will tolerate live-aboards, especially those that are discreet about it and pleasant to have around, but don't like this to be broadcast on forums such as this.

Indeed, and in a quiet way they offer an additional element of security.

 

[Poignard]

Brexit doesn't stop you living in the EU - slightly more red tape but still eminently doable.

I'd like to think you're right but I don't see how that's possible anymore unlesss you are working there, starting a business, possessed of great wealth, or have a close relative who is an EU citizen.

 

[jordanbasset]

From recent reports on here it certainly is difficult now to get residency with just a marina contract

 

[ryanroberts]

I'd like to think you're right but I don't see how that's possible anymore unlesss you are working there, starting a business, possessed of great wealth, or have a close relative who is an EU citizen.

'Digital Nomad' visas look like an angle if you can demonstrate that you support yourself Visa Info - Long term, National D Visa

 

[sailaboutvic]

From recent reports on here it certainly is difficult now to get residency with just a marina contract

People are still doing it,
two brits in Sicily are moving forward with their application and both are confidently they will get it.
Agree it not as stright forward before 2020 .

 

[jordanbasset]

People are still doing it,
two brits in Sicily are moving forward with their application and both are confidently they will get it.
Agree it not as stright forward before 2020 .

Hi Vic, was a post in the liveaboard forum a couple of weeks ago saying Portugal no longer accepted a marina berth for residency. It does depend on the country and it certainly appears more difficult than when I was travelling around the EU. At the moment people are in the hands of their host country and they can change their residency rules as they wish

 

[AntarcticPilot]

I'd like to think you're right but I don't see how that's possible anymore unlesss you are working there, starting a business, possessed of great wealth, or have a close relative who is an EU citizen.

Pete's doing it - and he doesn't meet any of the criteria you mention unless he's hiding his great wealth from me!

 

[sailaboutvic]

Hi Vic, was a post in the liveaboard forum a couple of weeks ago saying Portugal no longer accepted a marina berth for residency. It does depend on the country and it certainly appears more difficult than when I was travelling around the EU. At the moment people are in the hands of their host country and they can change their residency rules as they wish

Agreed it does depend greatly on country in which residents Is required.

 

[V1701]

I had a go at getting temp residency in Portugal last year, i.e. before end of transition period, the problem then was my not being able to get a NIF (due to Covid) & the area where I was absolutely requiring that to grant initial temp residency. My little boat on a 12 month marina contract there was at that time deemed suitable as an address. It's now sold & the marina where I've been a liveaboard in UK for 11 years put the prices up by 20% at last renewal for a "heavy use" contract, of which there are apparently a limited number. The heavy use contract permits spending up to 12 weeks at a time for up to 48 weeks per year in the marina. They seem to be pushing the floating caravans that have taken over one corner of the place more than they are anything else, presumably they're on the same contract. It is without doubt getting more difficult to live quietly and respectfully on your boat, or in a van, or anything else that isn't bricks & mortar, in the UK and other countries.

 

[Debennut]

Liveaboards started to become unwelcome in St Katherines during 1997, when a berth holder asked the London Borough of Tower Hamlets to send his housing benefit direct to the Marina.

 

[doug748]

As already mentioned, it looks at bit odd to turf out 50% and leave the other half, perhaps there is something we are not being told.

Can anyone with local knowledge fill in the gaps?

 

[Bru]

As already mentioned, it looks at bit odd to turf out 50% and leave the other half, perhaps there is something we are not being told.

Can anyone with local knowledge fill in the gaps?

Not local knowledge but knowledge from elsewhere (and LAs tend to be herd beasts) as already posted ...

There's liveaboards and then there's people who spend all their time on board

The liveaboard liveaboard has no other residence. If they're on the electoral roll at all (and they're probably not) it'll be at an accommodation address or even the marina

The people who just mostly live on board however do have somewhere to go, even if it's the sofa bed at a family members home They're on the electoral roll etc at an actual residential address (although they don't live there)

What happened with Covid lockdown #1 was that marinas were told to close and council officials went a-visiting to make sure they did

The Covid polis discovered a not insignificant number of people quietly (or otherwise) living on their boats. Those who had a home, or a nominal home, they could go home to were required to do so (me would have been included but I'd already gone)

Those with nowhere else to go were allowed on suffrance to stay put *for the duration*

Once the lockdowns were over, councils, having had their attention firmly pointed at the not insignificant numbers of people living below the radar in marinas, started to crack down and with threats of enforcement actions for breach of planning consent, marinas throughout the realm are having to evict the liveaboard liveaboards.

The people who just spend all their time on board, however, are not being evicted because they have, at least officially, a home ashore

So we end up with the slightly bizarre situation where the people with nowhere to go are told to get gone and the people with somewhere to go don't have to go!

Thus is precisely the situation I've been warning putative liveaboards about for decades. Whilst I certainly didn't envisage a global pandemic, I have long suspected that sooner or later there would be a crackdown by the planning authorities

We can argue about the pros and cons of it until we're blue in the face but it's irrelevant. The simple fact is that very few marinas have planning permission for residential berths (commonly, inland waterways marinas have PP for one or two for security, whether this also applies to coastal marinas I know not)

 

[capnsensible]

Wonder why such problems don't exist elsewhere? ?

 

[Wing Mark]

Not local knowledge but knowledge from elsewhere (and LAs tend to be herd beasts) as already posted ...

There's liveaboards and then there's people who spend all their time on board

The liveaboard liveaboard has no other residence. If they're on the electoral roll at all (and they're probably not) it'll be at an accommodation address or even the marina

The people who just mostly live on board however do have somewhere to go, even if it's the sofa bed at a family members home They're on the electoral roll etc at an actual residential address (although they don't live there)

What happened with Covid lockdown #1 was that marinas were told to close and council officials went a-visiting to make sure they did

The Covid polis discovered a not insignificant number of people quietly (or otherwise) living on their boats. Those who had a home, or a nominal home, they could go home to were required to do so (me would have been included but I'd already gone)

Those with nowhere else to go were allowed on suffrance to stay put *for the duration*

Once the lockdowns were over, councils, having had their attention firmly pointed at the not insignificant numbers of people living below the radar in marinas, started to crack down and with threats of enforcement actions for breach of planning consent, marinas throughout the realm are having to evict the liveaboard liveaboards.

The people who just spend all their time on board, however, are not being evicted because they have, at least officially, a home ashore

So we end up with the slightly bizarre situation where the people with nowhere to go are told to get gone and the people with somewhere to go don't have to go!

Thus is precisely the situation I've been warning putative liveaboards about for decades. Whilst I certainly didn't envisage a global pandemic, I have long suspected that sooner or later there would be a crackdown by the planning authorities

We can argue about the pros and cons of it until we're blue in the face but it's irrelevant. The simple fact is that very few marinas have planning permission for residential berths (commonly, inland waterways marinas have PP for one or two for security, whether this also applies to coastal marinas I know not)

And on top of that, there is the issue of council tax if it's a residential site?

The other thing is, anyone operating a marina will have looked at the state of inland waterways where there are many 'liveaboards' and decided they are not in that market.