Overtaking (non boaty)

[Observer]

Just watched a bit of "Car Wars Special" on BBC1. The bit that caught my attention was the story of a traffic cop in pursuit of a speeding motorist on the M1.

The in-car video showed him doing 120mph coming up behind an artic which was signalling right and moved from lane 1 to lane 3 forcing the police car towards the central reservation. Police ended up with dents/scrape along near-side doors/wing.

Artic driver was given a good ticking off for not using mirrors and straying into lane 3 (where HGVs not allowed) but, in my opinion, accident was substantially the traffic cop's fault:

1. at 120 mph, closing speed to artic must have been 60ish mph
2. artic was signalling right. Maybe should not have moved to lane 3 but what if obstruction in lane 2? Traffic cop woudn't have seen that - quite feasible. Traffic cop shouldn't have assumed artic would not do what he was indicating he would do.
3. road was on a long left curve. Possibly artic couldn't have seen (or only partially seen) traffic cop in offside mirror anyway and can hardly have been expected to use nearside mirror
4. traffic cop not on blue lights and siren - only flashing headlights
5. traffic cops supposed to be trained in "defensive driving". Not very defensive to be overtaking at 60mph relative speed and unable to brake to avoid accident

Traffic cop was, apparently, "exonerated". In my book he was reckless.

What say you?

<hr width=100% size=1>

 

[Heckler]

yeah
he admitted his pride was dented at the end,

<hr width=100% size=1>

 

[tr7v8]

Yup totally agree. Got peed off with holyier than thou attitude of all the plods on the program.
I am surprised that the fact that he took NO evasive action didn't go against him, He didn't brake or slow at all. And even afterwards it didn't occur to plod that he may not have seen him because of the angles involved. I think it was M180 wasn't it.

Mate used to work in Plod Garage in Basingsoke and they had a very large notice board covered in pics of dented and bent Plod cars, caption was "
Roadcraft, Drive Safe the Police way"

Daft bat from BRAKE also not bright, final fatal accident didn't involve speed but that didn't seem to have got through to her!


<hr width=100% size=1>Jim

Draco 2500

 

[tcm]

It is difficult (as always) to disagree with the Observer (not the poxy rag though).

I regularly drive at high speeds, illegal but anyway. Fact is that lorry drivers trundle along, and if you have ever driven a lorry it is tough to recognise high speed vehicles, which arrive in seconds, from others that take minutes to arive at the side door. So, the answer is to "present" properly: on each entrance to a new straight, flash headlights once from a good distance. Headlights shouild be on. You can take the "corner" of a motway such that the car "leans" a little and this also alerts people that cripes, he's moving up fast.

Lories relaibly indicates actions, not intentions, so be prepared to stamp on the anchors. Also, be especially aware on dark motorways before 2pm when drivers fall asleep a bit - and be aware that a falling asleep motorist actually fails to perform the "automatic" actions - so they 'll turn into a bend but they forget to turn out of it, and gently sway into the faster lanes on exit from bends. Again, the flash from a distance, and being in the fast lane will help alert them.

But if you're doing 120 - they are difficult to be "in the wrong" - same as when motorcycles flash between lanes of moving traffic - they are making their own rules. A lorry almost always allows for an awake motorist to move over or slow down - if they are doing under 100. But if they are doing 120 or more, they need to be smartish on the stoppers. Sailors can't really have to give way to powerboats doing 80 mph, and neither can lorries pick out the er loonies, imho.

<hr width=100% size=1>

 

[Observer]

BRAKE! (what does that mean?)

The whole "speed kills" argument is fallacious. Self-evident that higher speed = greater kinetic energy = greater risk of injury etc. Doesn't follow that speed is the proximate CAUSE of accident/injury. Lots of good argument on <A target="_blank" HREF=http://www.safespeed.org.uk>http://www.safespeed.org.uk</A>.

Too much b****y political correctness on this issue (as many others), in my opinion.

<hr width=100% size=1>

 

[halcyon]

Or the lorry was just blocking the cops, allowing the speeder to get away?

Though who remebers the M1 in the 60's no speed limit, Jags doing 140 down lane 3, Midland Red coaches cruising at 120. The days of look early, signal early, move out and back quickly or those headlights got you.

Brian

<hr width=100% size=1>

 

[tcm]

Re: BRAKE! (what does that mean?)

Quite right. The police say that 70% of accidents are caused by speed. Of course, 100% of vehicle accidents are caused by speed. You are safest in a car park, in a marina, or a wooden box.

<hr width=100% size=1>

 

[Gunfleet]

So the important thing he was doing that could easily have got him, his observer and a couple of innocent motorists killed in a 120 mph crash was 'pursuit of a speeding motorist'. They're really scraping the barrel in police recruitment.

<hr width=100% size=1>

 

[hlb]

Re: BRAKE! (what does that mean?)

Injurys are not caused by speed. quite the reverse. There caused by stopping far to quickly!

<hr width=100% size=1>

Haydn

 

[tcm]

on an empty m25 on a sunday morning I was pulled over at 120, and they explained that see, very dangerous trying that speed, sonny. Hmm, but um you gotta cavalier which is near the limit at 120 whereas I have just slowed from 140, but still inside 75% of this rental lambo that every single copper stops just to have a look, but shall i I let one of you drive to the south mimms service station like last time and we'll say no more about it? Um, yes alright.

<hr width=100% size=1>

 

[Benny1]

Lost art of overtaking

But what abput the lost art of overtaking on a single carriageway road. I am not all that old, but even in my relatively short driving career fewer and fewer people seem to overtake anything.

For example you are following a lorry doing 25-40moh (speed varying because of hills, bends etc) on a de-restricted 60mph road. A queue of 10 or more cars can easily build up and...no one overtakes anyone for miles and miles.

If you then decide to go past the cars one, two or more at a time on the straights in perfectly safe and legal overtaking manoeuvres (how do you spell that) you then get flashed, gesticulated and shouted at. Very bemusing. If they are that bothered why did they not overtake themselves?

Also is it me or does the highway code not say that you must "give way to overtaking vehicles"? ie do NOT speed up all of a sudden and try to close the gap so that the overtaking car has nowhere to go and what was a perfectly safe overtyaking manoeuvre then becomes very dangerous and you have to effectively barge your way in.

Is it just me or have others experienced this?

Also, and this could be red rag to a bull, it is usually those with their whole families with them get the most irate and do the gap closing thing, thus putting their entire family at risk. Very odd. Perhaps it's the wife who won't let them overtake. Hmmm maybe I have found another reason to stay young free and single!?

<hr width=100% size=1>

 

[robp]

Re: Lost art of overtaking

<Hmmm maybe I have found another reason to stay young free and single!?>

You might manage two out of three. But if you can work the trick on the third, praps you'd share the pills around?

<hr width=100% size=1>

 

[Stingo]

Re: Lost art of overtaking

Third is easy. You're as young as the woman you feel.

<hr width=100% size=1><A target="_blank" HREF=http://www.stingo.co.uk>http://www.stingo.co.uk</A> <font color=blue>- now showing at a computer near you</font color=blue>

 

[sailbadthesinner]

not as dented as his flippin car which hislocal council tax payers will have to repair.

if you look it was ponly at the lasty minute that the wagon's sidemirrors were visible, and hence the car to the the wagon.

the chap should have had his horns on. wqhat was the guy in pursuit of?
just a speeder. means in now way justifies the ends.

<hr width=100% size=1><font color=red>Ok brain let's just do this and I can get back to killing you with beer</font color=red>

 

[sailbadthesinner]

I was thoroughly annoyed at the chap who ran out of tickets having spent a morning booking cars on the, A616 i think.

His poor planning meant he had to go back to the base and then return. You would think he would have stacks in the car to generate all that lovely lolly for his Supt.

I think 9 by standers were killed in the Wmids police chases in 2001. An appalling record, some of those were untrained pandas responding to emergencies but a shocking waste of life nonetheless.

I thought the guy on the bike got a result. 2months and £300 seems a bargain.

<hr width=100% size=1><font color=red>Ok brain let's just do this and I can get back to killing you with beer</font color=red>

 

[jamesjermain]

Am I alone in occasionally having a sneaking admiration for the driving of some of the 'get-away' drivers?

Also did anyone else cringe a bit at the copper who said he never deliberately went out to 'get' people. Then promptly stopped a Ferrari for having a closed-up number plate and briefly showing fog lights in bright sunshine? Could he have wanted a quick peek at a real car?

<hr width=100% size=1>JJ

 

[sailbadthesinner]

i think green eyed envy was writ all over his face

what's the chances that if that had been a blue mondeo he'd have not been pulled.

have to say could not make head nor tail of the reg. what it was meant to be???
i think private reg's are a bit past it now

yours
M437JAD

<hr width=100% size=1><font color=red>Ok brain let's just do this and I can get back to killing you with beer</font color=red>

 

[robp]

Re: Lost art of overtaking

Oh eck!

<hr width=100% size=1>

 

[Observer]

Re: Lost art of overtaking

You're right about 'lost art' although that could be partly because roads are so much busier so less opportunity to overtake safely.

A driver is perfectly entitled to choose not to overtake, even a crawling farm tractor, but common sense and courtesy requires should leave reasonable space ahead so cars behind can - not force them to do double overtake which is clearly more hazardous. The space required is only the same as a safe following distance anyway.

Also, many drivers looking to overtake a slow-moving truck tuck up close behind instead of hanging back, which allows better visibility of road ahead, especially through a LH bend when one can see round the nearside, accelerate if road is clear and be past as soon as the road straightens.

All common sense again, of course.


<hr width=100% size=1>

 

[jamesjermain]

B4DHY

Wasn't it B4DHY as in BADDY? A bit provocative, perhaps.

<hr width=100% size=1>JJ