one hand for the wheel, one for the boat...

[SmileyGiley]

Waaaahhhh... Guapa... if my boat is 37 ft do I have to steer by MIND CONTROL ALONE!

Hmmm. 33 footer with centre cockpit. Could have trouble with a tiller there.

Personally don't mind either. One that got me for the first couple of hours was a wheel steered jet boat.... reverse is arsey tarsey compared to regular wheel steered mobo, but matches reverse for a tiller steering.

Don't care how it steers... so long as it SAILS

 

[SmileyGiley]

erm... or maybe I got confused there... HELP,, just spent 6 hours blatting around in a jet boat offshore angola, & now can't work out which way is left right forwards backwards... must have caught the sun!

 

[SmileyGiley]

Nahhh... jetboats arsey tarsey to everything. Oohhh my head

 

[PeterGibbs]

Wheel more difficult? On the contrary, and for good reason - the wheel employs more gearing so mechanical advantage.

The test is to control the boat through stiff sailing conditions with tiller alone - demanding work. Done that, better with a wheel.

PWG

 

[roger]

I see a lot of moderate sized(35-40ft.) boats with wheel steering. The helmsman is standing at the aft end of the cockpit as otherwise he cant see ahead. He has little protection from the weather and he's using more energy than necessary.
This is fine as a technique for demonstrating machismo but it is not very seamanlike.
With a tiller you can sit down in shelter under the spray hood, keeping warmer and more rested.
Clearly if the boat is large and poorly balanced a tiller will be difficult to handle unless you are a professional wrestler.
The whole discussion is a bit silly for a single hander who will be using autohelm most of the time as he/she will have more important things to do like jeeping lookout, course checking, tea making.

 

[Cardiffcruiser]

I like to sit infront of my wheel and use my other hand on the genoa sheet.

 

[charles_reed]

Wheel or tiller

very much a matter of operator preference.

The major plus point for the tiller, if single-handing, is the more effective connection to the autopilot ram, but the on a wheel-steered boat you operate straight on the quadrant, even if the costs are about x3 a tiller-pilot.

The only one that's got major disadvantages is hydraulic steering, your autopilot has to have a constant running pump, ouch the power-drain.

Oh! mechanical advantage of a wheel, only important on a mis-designed boat with inadequate rudder balance.

On smaller boats, with smaller cockpits a wheel does obstruct the cockpit more than a tiller which can be hinged up in port.

 

[peterb]

One thing no-one seems to have mentioned is rudder angle. Most wheel-steered boats seem to be limited to about 30 degrees, but tiller-steered boats can often reach 60 or even more. Makes little difference in normal sailing, but can be quite important in close-quarters manoeuvring.

 

[damo]

[ QUOTE ]
does anyone know...do all wheels have the hydraulic system.


[/ QUOTE ]

NO! - Mine is Whitlock rod steering...virtually bombproof. I could disconnect the gearbox easily enough, and use the emergency rudder on the fitting on the top of the rudder stock, but crouched inside an aft cabin, and with no mechanical advantage, it would have to be an emergency /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif

[ QUOTE ]
is it feasible/sensible to remove a wheel set up and try the tiller option - then replace if wheel preferred.


[/ QUOTE ]

Feasible I suppose, but easier and cheaper to try other similar boats with either tiller or wheel.

The wheel versus tiller debate is a waste of time IMO - it depends so much on the layout of the boat and type of rudder. A centre-cockpit longkeeler with a keel-hung rudder, like mine, couldn't reasonably use anything else but a wheel. A boat with a balanced rudder would probably find either system worked well.
A very responsive boat would probably get the most from a rudder, a heavy lump like mine sails perfectly well with a wheel. etc etc

I've used both, and on the whole I prefer a wheel on a bigger boat and a tiller on a smaller one. But then again, I prefer to sail in a bigger boat /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif

 

[cumbrian]

[ QUOTE ]
The wheel versus tiller debate is a waste of time IMO

[/ QUOTE ] debates are only a waste of time if one has all the answers Damo - which i don't

i always get good feedback from the forum - most of which is helpful and some very helpful. Sure, there's no substitute for experience, but when those of us with no experience ask the questions, those of us with experence provide the answers. presto! what a system /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif

but i got some experience today - was looking at a 34 ft boat with a wheel - which took up about a third of the cockpit and was awkward to get around - can't say i'm pining for one.

 

[Searush]

What a load of rubbish from the "I don't like wheels, and never used one" brigade!

I have a centre cockpit ketch, so tiller is a bit difficult to arrange. There is an emergency one but you have to stand in the aft cockpit to use it and can't see where you are going!

Mine is only a 31' er but wheel is fine. My previous boat was 25' with tiller, and singlehanding meant that the tiller HAD to be held all the time or tied or on a tiller pilot. My wheel can be left while I walk forward to set sails, sort out the anchor or mooring ropes. The bowden cables have enough friction to keep a course for a while. Similarly, the mechanical advantage is a great help in conditions that cause weather helm, much easier to use than constant heaving on the tiller. Plenty of feedback to detect any weather helm or feel her kick in eddies (plenty of them in the Straits) or awkward overfalls.

Why are people so snobbish about tillers? Tillers work fine on some boats, wheels work well on others. I like to sit on the aft cabin roof & steer with my feet. Leaves both hands free for a drink, binoculars, compass, chart or lunch as relevant. Much more comfortable - & more accurate - steering than straddling a tiller to eat your meal.

 

[damo]

[ QUOTE ]
but i got some experience today - was looking at a 34 ft boat with a wheel - which took up about a third of the cockpit and was awkward to get around - can't say i'm pining for one.


[/ QUOTE ]

That's my point - each boat and person is different, and just because one arrangement you've seen doesn't suit you, wheel or tiller, doesn't mean all are the same. I looked at many boats before I bought mine, and several (Westerly 33 in particular) I knew would drive me nuts with the cockpit wheel arrangement. Most AWB's I've been on have cockpit layouts I don't like, even much longer boats, compared with my Warrior 35, which has lots of room and really comfortable helming positions, but another may have a different opinion....

 

[DJE]

Our standard configuration for motoring back up the harbour is standing with coffee in one hand, sandwich in the other, and tiller between the thighs. Alternatively both hands in warm pockets and tiller as above. What is the equivalent with a wheel?

 

[sailorman]

[What is the equivalent with a wheel?]
Autohelm 6000+ /forums/images/graemlins/ooo.gif then hands in pocket

 

[Phoenix of Hamble]

standing with foot on the wheel at the bottom..... works just fine...

Or failing that, stick the autopilot on, and just shove the remote in my pocket.... can then steer with my hands in my pockets too!

On the flip side of your point.... gone are the days where I end up with sore inner thighs from straddling the tiller!!!!!!

 

[snowleopard]

Re: Wheel or tiller

[ QUOTE ]
The only one that's got major disadvantages is hydraulic steering, your autopilot has to have a constant running pump, ouch the power-drain.

[/ QUOTE ]
Not so. My Raytheon hydraulic autopilot has a motor that only runs when making course corrections so no more drain than a mechanical ram type.

Hydraulic steering has the great benefit for singlehanders that if you let go of the wheel the rudder stays put so no time taken to lock or lash the wheel if you have to dash forward etc. The supposed downside is that there is no 'feel' to the helm. This is also not correct. If you make any steering movements there will be one direction which feels lighter than the other so you soon learn to interpret what the rudder is telling you.

Hydraulics tend to have much lower gearing. My 4 turns lock to lock is typical. I once sailed a heavy 40 footer with mechanical linkage that was 3/4 turn lock to lock and that was a killer to steer on a reach in a fresh breeze.

My chief gripe with wheel steering in a typical mono is that you have to climb round the wheel to get to the normal steering position which means you can't reach anything without clambering. The worst I ever met required you to climb out onto a narrow side deck to get to the steering area.

 

[flaming]

Re: Wheel or tiller

[ QUOTE ]

My chief gripe with wheel steering in a typical mono is that you have to climb round the wheel to get to the normal steering position which means you can't reach anything without clambering. The worst I ever met required you to climb out onto a narrow side deck to get to the steering area.

[/ QUOTE ]

That comes down to your priorities, better relaxing in port or a better tool to steer the boat with.
To be able to helm properly you have to be able to see the telltales. In almost all boats this either requires you to sit out to windward or to sit to leward and view through the slot.
Most people prefer the former, especially as it allows you actually see where you are going, and to see any large waves.

This means you must be able to reach the helm from the windward side of the boat, so either a big wheel or a tiller extension. Or, on the inceasingly wide boats we're seeing, twin wheels. I've helmed a number of boats with twin wheels, and whilst at first the wheel feels stupidly small to someone used to big single wheels it doesn't take long to get used to and is a good compromise allowing a decent sailing position and easy access.

 

[doris]

A down side to a tiller

No-one seems to mention the downside of trying to look under the sails when steering with a tiller. A wheel is very easy to scamper behind, have a quick peek and then back to the high side. I know 2 peeps who have hit buoys 'cos they didn't see them under the sails with a tiller. Maybe this forum has members that are much fitter and more agile than I am!
You can also steer from the low side with a wheel. Tricky with a tiller!

I strongly approved of the autopilot on with remote in pocket principle, excellent seamanship on a cold day.

 

[dulls]

I have owned both wheel and tiller.
With a wheel it is easy to switch on the auto pilot. No adding the arm to the tiller. With a wheel you can sit more comfortably i think. You always look better behind a wheel. Downsides are your wind vane will lose a bit of sensitivity. If it breaks it is a tad more complex to deal with. You lose space down below with the quadrant. I would never have a hydraulic system on a yacht as it excludes most wind vanes.
Tiller. You feel more crusty. Easy to fix and detect problems. Best connection for wind vanes. You can tilt it up in harbour to give more cot pit space. Less internal space lost. (I dont think you lose much feel with a wheel by the way) Add a tiller extension even for a big boat it works well. Only real downside is siting comfortably and it can be more tiring than a wheel. Tiller extension solves some of that. My next boat will have a tiller methinks but i will miss some aspects of the wheel. Even a wheel system is not that complicated to fix.

 

[pvb]

I have owned both wheel and tiller.
With a wheel it is easy to switch on the auto pilot. No adding the arm to the tiller. With a wheel you can sit more comfortably i think. You always look better behind a wheel. Downsides are your wind vane will lose a bit of sensitivity. If it breaks it is a tad more complex to deal with. You lose space down below with the quadrant. I would never have a hydraulic system on a yacht as it excludes most wind vanes.
Tiller. You feel more crusty. Easy to fix and detect problems. Best connection for wind vanes. You can tilt it up in harbour to give more cot pit space. Less internal space lost. (I dont think you lose much feel with a wheel by the way) Add a tiller extension even for a big boat it works well. Only real downside is siting comfortably and it can be more tiring than a wheel. Tiller extension solves some of that. My next boat will have a tiller methinks but i will miss some aspects of the wheel. Even a wheel system is not that complicated to fix.

Have you been considering your reply for 11 years?