New standing rigging

[pvb]

Ref replacing rigging after 10 years. I can appreciate why why its a requirement. reducing any risk of failure is a wise move especially if it reduces claims.

It's not a requirement for most insurers.

The majority of rig failures are due to insufficient tension. Most boat owners won't tension their rigging enough. It pays to get a professional rigger to set up the tension properly.

 

[Refueler]

It is a req't for Insurers - when you get a daft Surveyor puts a recc'd in his report.

Over the years of being a Marine Surveyor - I've seen too often items mentioned in reports that simply the author has no real test or expertise to state such recommendation. Even if he just mentions is a 'possible' or something to consider in future - Insurers will often take the pessimistic line and request said work.

 

[Pye_End]

It is a req't for Insurers - when you get a daft Surveyor puts a recc'd in his report.

So, the report says standing rigging should be replaced if older than 10 years, and the insurance company say that everything in the report needs to be addressed.

However, if you then ask specifically about rig renewal, you may find that this part of the report does not need to be done for insurance after all.

At least, this is what happened to me.

Can't help feeling there could be some improvements made in this insurance survey thing.

 

[William_H]

I am one to support the concept of 15years life for ss rigging wire. This mostly on the basis of experience of members in my club. The first was when I looked after 10 small 10ft training dinghies. The wires were I think 1/8 1x19./ All the wires failed with strands coming out at the swage after perhaps 10 years or so. These boats were rigged and sailed about 40 hrs per year. The rest of the time masts were stored inside horizontal. Then there was my friend who bought a 21fter which had sat on the mooring for many years virtually never sailed. Wire perhaps 25yo let go. Ave a nu mast. Another 32fter much heavier wire where wire let go after perhaps 25years. New mast again.
Several other examples over the years leave me to believe the wire is not to be trusted after 15 years of callender life in service. Regardless of actual sailing time.
I don't believe my kind of racing is especially harmful to rig or wire. The boats are generally sailed to a heel commensurate with best performance cruising or racing. The loads on the rig commensurate with heel. Actual wire replacement especially of shrouds inner and cap not so expensive compared to mast replacement. ol'will

 

[penfold]

When the wires failed and caused a dismasting what was the inspection regime, or did they telegraph their approaching dotage by stabbing passers-by with errant strands?

 

[vyv_cox]

Squirty wax(sold as car anti-rust treatment or dry chain lubricant) is less likely to mess up your clothes than grease; it comes out runny but the carrier solvent flashes off leaving a film of wax.

Waxoyl is good, I always have a can on board.

 

[DownWest]

Had an inner forestay let go at 10yrs, but the boat had done a RTW and it was quality of the swages rather than the wire.

 

[Refueler]

So, the report says standing rigging should be replaced if older than 10 years, and the insurance company say that everything in the report needs to be addressed.

However, if you then ask specifically about rig renewal, you may find that this part of the report does not need to be done for insurance after all.

At least, this is what happened to me.

Can't help feeling there could be some improvements made in this insurance survey thing.

Little bit lost with your ... " if you then ask specifically about rig renewal, you may find that this part of the report does not need to be done for insurance after all." ....... I don't say I don't believe you in your case ... but I know many who have been caught by this ...

Years ago - I was shown a 'questionaire' form of Survey for an Insurance Brokerage that has long ago gone ... it was actually quite sensible EXCEPT that it had included such items as 'how old is standing rigging'. But the general setout was logical.
It took the Surveyor through sections and steps in logical order, instead of relying on his method. The concluding part allowed a 'narrative' style of comment on any part or whole.

 

[Refueler]

I have had two fail in over 55yrs of sailing ....

1. Snapdragon 23 - forestay .... The Forestay attachment on the 23 was by a single bolt through the stem and then a nut glassed in. Impossible to get at the nut. Basically the nut gave way and stay with furler pulled out ...

2. Cap shroud on present boat ... mast was down, but foot still mounted to the step. This meant I had about 4m of mast extending out from stern. Leaving town quay - boat turned a little sharper than intended, mast head caught key side and the cap shroud was pulled by quay fender. Shroud cut a 2" gash in the mast above its attachment point and severed a few strands. That shroud was many years old ... impossible to say - but certainly over 15yrs (this was 2011) ....
The shroud having severed some of its strands gave access to seeing condition - I asked local metal master to look and his verdict was no fault found. He also looked at the remaining on board .... same verdict. I am aware having had an NDT division in my previous company - that this check is not absolute - but its better than I can do. New stay fitted ...

I have two personal friends who are Masters in Metal ...... I prefer to listen to them ......

Last : Suggest some look up the life and replacement requirements of Cranes ... Derricks ... Lifeboat falls ... etc. on ships ... you may be surprised .....

 

[Poignard]

I should think 10 years is a period based on somebody's best guess rather than any scientific analysis. Having once been decided, it becomes the established standard.

Plenty of arbitrary examples in all walks of life eg voting age, retirement age, age to serve in the military, speed limits,etc. A decision had to be made, someone made a decision, others follow it.

 

[Refueler]

I should think 10 years is a period based on somebody's best guess rather than any scientific analysis. Having once been decided, it becomes the established standard.

Plenty of arbitrary examples in all walks of life eg voting age, retirement age, age to serve in the military, speed limits,etc. A decision had to be made, someone made a decision, others follow it.

Usually a decision is based on worst case scenario. Basically capable are subject to the actions of the incapable idiots... ie speed limits etc.
Full on race boats - can have rigging changed so often - its a regular action ... and then we move through levels of boat use to the cruiser guy who reefs early ... avoids heavy weather .. rarely does long passages ... where in reality unless he has badly designed setup - can live with his rigging for many years.
It really comes down to personal preference and what you consider is sensible / safe for your use.

 

[William_H]

When the wires failed and caused a dismasting what was the inspection regime, or did they telegraph their approaching dotage by stabbing passers-by with errant strands?

From my experience the wires on the little boats did break strand by strand popping out of the swage. The stays were very lightly loaded. However on the bigger boats wire let go with no warning or failure of individual strands and no way to predict failure by inspection. ol'will