Navionics webapp is no more...

DangerousPirate

Active member
Joined
24 Feb 2020
Messages
657
Location
N. Ireland
Visit site
I just tried to calculate a route on the phone app and now I can't because the area I try to sail to is not in my current plan at all. I thought this only mattered for offline maps??

Did that change, too?
Screenshot_20241124_162653_it.navionics.singleAppMarineLakesHD.jpg
 

Daverw

Well-known member
Joined
2 Nov 2016
Messages
2,892
Location
Humber
Visit site
I think this has always been the case that you need the relevant chart areas to allow a route to be planned, same really as paper charts if your missing one along the route how do you plan it
 

DangerousPirate

Active member
Joined
24 Feb 2020
Messages
657
Location
N. Ireland
Visit site
I think this has always been the case that you need the relevant chart areas to allow a route to be planned, same really as paper charts if your missing one along the route how do you plan it
I might be paranoid but I don't know. I think I used to look up sailing locations in france and spain before and I didn't ever buy charts for there. Think as long as you were connected, oyu were able to see routes and stuff. You only paid for the offline use (like at a passage). I can't even zoom in without the route planner. It's still gray area.

Screenshot_20241124_180120_it.navionics.singleAppMarineLakesHD.jpg
 

lustyd

Well-known member
Joined
27 Jul 2010
Messages
12,423
Visit site
I think I used to look up sailing locations in france and spain before and I didn't ever buy charts for there.
Yes this definitely used to be the case, even without subscription you could see the charts online just not download them. Seems to be a money grab from Garmin, or possibly they're trying to push people to ActiveCaptain which will replace Navionics app eventually as it did with the online portal.
 

Koeketiene

Well-known member
Joined
24 Sep 2003
Messages
18,033
Location
Le Roussillon (South of France)
www.sailblogs.com
Yes this definitely used to be the case, even without subscription you could see the charts online just not download them. Seems to be a money grab from Garmin, or possibly they're trying to push people to ActiveCaptain which will replace Navionics app eventually as it did with the online portal.

I suspect you're right.

When my current subscription expires, I'm contemplating adopting Orca.
The ability to interface with the boat instruments seems an attractive proposition.
 

lustyd

Well-known member
Joined
27 Jul 2010
Messages
12,423
Visit site
I suspect you're right.

When my current subscription expires, I'm contemplating adopting Orca.
The ability to interface with the boat instruments seems an attractive proposition.
Navionics works flawlessly with my B&G over wifi, I didn't even set anything up it just shows up. I'm not sure what my plan is, right now nothing seems as good as Navionics but I don't want to reward Garmin for what they've done to it
 

Red Panda

Member
Joined
3 May 2017
Messages
172
Location
Fastnet
Visit site
Navionics works flawlessly with my B&G over wifi, I didn't even set anything up it just shows up. I'm not sure what my plan is, right now nothing seems as good as Navionics but I don't want to reward Garmin for what they've done to it
I'm in the same situation. I'm annoyed at Garmin, but I haven't been able to find anything that works as well as the Navionics iPad / phone app. I trialled CMAP on my latest trip, but found it much less intuitive - though the charts themselves are well presented and clear, the route planning was difficult.

I've got (now expired) Navionics charts on my B&G plotter, and I'm considering replacing these with CMAP.
 

lustyd

Well-known member
Joined
27 Jul 2010
Messages
12,423
Visit site
oh the CMAP app is a total mess, I can only assume the developers have never been boating and just building an app based on specs. I wasn't keen on their charts either, and with the Navionics update system, Navionics ends up being much cheaper especially if you change regions
 

DangerousPirate

Active member
Joined
24 Feb 2020
Messages
657
Location
N. Ireland
Visit site
Yes this definitely used to be the case, even without subscription you could see the charts online just not download them. Seems to be a money grab from Garmin, or possibly they're trying to push people to ActiveCaptain which will replace Navionics app eventually as it did with the online portal.
So I wasn't just paranoid. 😭

I don't understand why companies do this. Why take over and change things? It worked well so far.

And it's not even about using it without paying, I am paying for my area and just plan to go a different region, but don't want to commit to buying the charts yet. That's why I lijed to look up other regions first. Now garmin not only took the desktop route planning away (why??) they also started taking away the flexible free options like chart availability for foreign regions. If you want to even just look at it, you need to pay. (I understand why they do THIS but seriously not a fan of it).


This is what happens when there is no serious competition. Same thing happened to google.
 

lustyd

Well-known member
Joined
27 Jul 2010
Messages
12,423
Visit site
I don't understand why companies do this
Rampant, uncontrolled capitalism. Just because communism is bad, don't assume capitalism is good. It's just less bad for a time. If the ponzi scheme is ever interrupted pensions and markets will collapse and society will go with it. Unfortunately we're running out of people to exploit to keep up the illusion.

Activecaptain allows browsing areas you don't own from a browser, and looks like it will eventually have planning capability:
https://activecaptain.garmin.com/en-GB/Map
 

Red Panda

Member
Joined
3 May 2017
Messages
172
Location
Fastnet
Visit site
oh the CMAP app is a total mess, I can only assume the developers have never been boating and just building an app based on specs. I wasn't keen on their charts either, and with the Navionics update system, Navionics ends up being much cheaper especially if you change regions
It's the Garmin attitude that makes me reluctant to renew my Navionics plotter charts. I don't trust them to not do a Musk and disable them in a fit of pique, if I somehow offend the latest subscription model! Certainly the connectivity between iPad app and instruments has been degraded since the app subscription has expired.
I used to work for a major IT company so I'm very familiar with the push for subscription licensing and bringing services "into the cloud", which basically means the provider has you over a barrel if you don't keep paying up.
I'm glad I bought a complete set of chart folios for my cruising area!
 

lustyd

Well-known member
Joined
27 Jul 2010
Messages
12,423
Visit site
Garmin are famously bad at the subscription model, and that's a really good thing. They view themselves as a device company and thankfully they're very successful at it so don't really need subscription money. They were traditionally bad at software though and that's slowly changing as they were forced to catch up when competing with Apple Watch (Fenix is Garmin's most profitable product ever, by quite a margin).
 

DangerousPirate

Active member
Joined
24 Feb 2020
Messages
657
Location
N. Ireland
Visit site
Rampant, uncontrolled capitalism. Just because communism is bad, don't assume capitalism is good. It's just less bad for a time. If the ponzi scheme is ever interrupted pensions and markets will collapse and society will go with it. Unfortunately we're running out of people to exploit to keep up the illusion.
I don't even think that has anything to do with capitalism, because capitalism means you'd get more money out of it. This is just a bad business strategy because it will drive people away from the product and look for better alternatives, and if there aren't any, then there soon will be.
 

lustyd

Well-known member
Joined
27 Jul 2010
Messages
12,423
Visit site
I don't even think that has anything to do with capitalism, because capitalism means you'd get more money out of it. This is just a bad business strategy because it will drive people away from the product and look for better alternatives, and if there aren't any, then there soon will be.
That’s level one capitalism. We’ve moved on from there many years back. Now a company makes money, goes public, gets sucked dry by investors and dies, then chump home investors lose all their money while the pros buy out a startup that replaces it.
There’s even a new word as a result of the process Enshittification - Wikipedia
 

DangerousPirate

Active member
Joined
24 Feb 2020
Messages
657
Location
N. Ireland
Visit site
That’s level one capitalism. We’ve moved on from there many years back. Now a company makes money, goes public, gets sucked dry by investors and dies, then chump home investors lose all their money while the pros buy out a startup that replaces it.
There’s even a new word as a result of the process Enshittification - Wikipedia
I didn't know that word, but yeah. It's accurate. It happens everywhere. Navionics is one example apparently. I wish I knew how they calculated the tracks and where they get the charts from, then I'd build my own alternative to navionics lol
 

requiem

Active member
Joined
20 Mar 2019
Messages
234
Visit site
Navionics is one example apparently. I wish I knew how they calculated the tracks and where they get the charts from, then I'd build my own alternative to navionics lol
I suspect a large part of it is licensing chart data from regional ENC coordinating centres (RENCs), possibly modifying it here and there to incorporate additional data, and selling it onwards to the consumer. Example: Distribution — IC-ENC
 
Top