More 'what boat to buy questions' Moody S31, First 31.7 etc.

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Pouring rain today I have been researching my choices and trying to put together a shortlist, any contributions would be welcome as an aid to reducing choice and travelling.
Moody S31- about the size and style I like, though old fashioned short boom IOR type sail layout, plenty on the market BUT - they are all now about 20 years old, have saildrives and most of the owners still seem to be asking a lot for them. What worries me most is that the lack of a proper main sheet and no traveller. I am a bit worried about sail drive legs at that age as well. Anyone know if putting a traveller and tackle in the cockpit is possible?
First 31.7 - much younger and most a lot cheaper than the Moody with good sail controls including a mainsheet traveller in the right place BUT, perhaps a bit sporty for us now, and a tiny (30l?) fuel tank for distance cruising up here. I would perhaps be happier with an Oceanis equivalent but a lot of them seem to have wheel steering which does not look very comfortable on this size of boat and while I would not mind the smaller rig, again the mainsheet seems an afterthought. Perhaps it can be moved? In the same class as the First there are Elans and Dehlers but if I was to go for a sportier boat the 31.7 seems to be the better option with a lot more choice, it surely would not be impossible to install a proper fuel tank.
Sun Oddessey 32- Perhaps better than the Oceanis? and more of them have a tiller but the same mainsheet problem, proper depth fin keels like we use up here seem to be rarer on these though. ( There was a newish small Jeanneau with an enormous stern, two wheels and two rudders sharing a lock with the boat I was helping earlier in the week, even with almost continuous use of a bow thruster it was all over the place in not much breeze, not at all impressed)
Dufour 32 Classic, these do have a mainsheet traveller in the cockpit but it looks as if it is poorly sited, right across the companionway, few of the about in the UK and I do not want to extend my search further than England/ Ireland.
W, Storm/ Tempest, - proper sailing boats but getting a bit old, most have the linings sorted by now but interior veneers and some other parts seem tired and I am not sure if I want to go back to a raw water cooled 2002, contemporary Moody 31 Mk IIs look fresher at the same age?
Sigma 33 OOD - I had one of these in the eighties and loved it but there is surely something as good and younger.
Anyone able to comment on the boats above or to recommend an alternative, around 10m. max. fin keel, preferable tiller steered with a moderately efficient rig including if possible a multi tackle mainsheet toward the back of the boom, scoop at the back for getting into the dinghy, budget around £40k. (or less). Purpose, for 2 elderly people and a dog cruising under sail and engine in W.Scottish/N Irish waters, normal maintenance replacement acceptable but probably not re-engining or other work on that scale. Selling our Finngulf 33 was a big mistake but the next boat does not need to sail quite as well.
 
Re moody s31. Had one from new before buying a moody s38. Very well built boats. They came with two rig versions standard and fractional. We raced our boat. Never had a problem with the traveller in front of canopy. Had a friend who moved the traveller aft into the cockpit sole. Which worked well as long as you don't buy a later version with a wheel rather than a tiller.

Sail drives work well as long as they are serviced regularly, Ie... Donut ring... And anodes are changed... One season we lost the anode and it started to eat through the leg... Shaft seal need changing too.
 
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Finngulfs are beautiful sailing machines: a very hard act to follow. Sounds like you want a Finngulf by any other name? Is the intention to race? If not, the traveller and mainsheet being less than perfect isn't a big factor? I think the Oceanis version of the 31 has a lot going for it? And the wheel is fine. A friend has sailed one single-handed for years.
 
I agree that a saildrive of that age shouldn't be a problem. Mine is in its 17th year and I hope still in its youth.

I sailed a Sadler 29 for many years with a traveller across the companionway, and also never worried about it. It is far better than having the sheet led to a clutch far from the helmsman. There are some bizarre sheet arrangements as designers try to reinvent the wheel, but it is hard to beat the simplest.
 
Im not an expert but I have read hundreds of what boat threads......

Elan 333 is always universally praised. One for sale on boatshed Scotland.
 
When I was half way down your post I was going to say Dufour Classic 32 seems spot on but I see you have considered it. I would have thought the traveller across the companionway was more suited to cruising and safety than dissecting the cockpit but there you go.
 
A peculiar problem we have is our history, the Finngulf 33 followed a Sigma 38 as an effort at downsizing, with a taller rig and bigger fore and aft sails it did not really achieve that and my wife soon twigged that she had been had. This time I would like to achieve a real reduction while still having something I enjoy sailing. I think the Elan and Dehler both fail the 'downsizing' test and would be similar but perhaps not quite equal to the Finngulf. So I want the impossible, a wee handy cruising boat that you do not have to stand up to sail well but will get us smiling in 15 kts. A wheel would be fine if it is direct and is big enough to use sitting on the coaming with the traveller line in the other hand but none of the French boats wheels look as if they are suited to this and where are you supposed to place your feet.. The Finngulf had a 5' wheel and the cockpit was designed around it, the only time you tended to be standing up behind it was berthing or transiting the canal. On passage we tended to motor if we could not manage 4 kts, with the pilot doing the steering. A typical first days passage for us would be Crinan, Gigha or Crinan, Tobermory and I do not see that changing much as long as it does not take much more than an hour longer. My worries about the 20 year old saildrive arise from the boatyard where you see so many with progressive corrosion because of anode passivation or loss, a shaft is easier to maintain/replace though I will miss the dusty bilges. I suppose I am really looking for another Sigma 33, it is a shame if there is not a modern equivalent, perhaps it was the Finngulf.
By the way I haven't mentioned it yet but the boat will be expected to be comfy down below.
 
I don't think a 31.7 is going to give you that "downsizing" feeling either. They're a fairly punchy boat really and need a good main sheet trimmer or early reefing. How about the smaller / earlier Hanses? 291 / 301 etc. Narrow easily driven hull, good ballast ratio and a smaller rig.
 
................Moody S31- about the size and style I like, though old fashioned short boom IOR type sail layout, plenty on the market BUT - they are all now about 20 years old, have saildrives and most of the owners still seem to be asking a lot for them. What worries me most is that the lack of a proper main sheet and no traveller. I am a bit worried about sail drive legs at that age as well. Anyone know if putting a traveller and tackle in the cockpit is possible?................
I had an S31 for 12 years, a terrific boat and apparently overlooked by most. Even the bilge-keel version sails very well indeed. Don't understand what you mean by mainsheet and traveller - mine and every other one I ever saw had a traveller . The centre mainsheet works well. As others have said, the saildrive is not a problem if it's been looked after.
 
I had an S31 for 12 years, a terrific boat and apparently overlooked by most. Even the bilge-keel version sails very well indeed. Don't understand what you mean by mainsheet and traveller - mine and every other one I ever saw had a traveller . The centre mainsheet works well. As others have said, the saildrive is not a problem if it's been looked after.

I have no experience of the arrangement and that is why I raised it as an issue, I thought having the sheet only half way back on the boom was bound to reduce power significantly, I know there is a bit of track but how do you dump it when a gust hits? Or is it that the mainsail not big enough to need it?
I am not trying to be provocative, I just want to try to find out how it works on a gusty day. It seems a long way from the helm and even if you could reach it do you not need two hands to operate it?
If you have time I genuinely want to understand the mechanics of controlling it. The same question arises with most of the 'cruising' boats I referred to, it is almost universal on non racing versions except the Scandinavians but I have never had the chance to try it. I suppose having a clear cockpit in port is now regarded as more useful?
 
I used the traveller to dump the main in gusts, seemed perfectly adequate. It may be short but remember as the track is under the boom centre, letting the traveller right out lets the boom right out over the quarter. Could be a handful single-handed.
For the same reason, pulled the traveller up to windward in lighter airs. It's just different to what you're used to. But if you want to single-hand a lot, then the setup probably won't suit you.
Now sailing a boat with the mainsheet just behind the helm, and I do miss the clear cockpit especially when gybing.
 
Dumping the traveller was never a problem, when going to windard I would always sit on the coming just behind the canopy, you can sit here and steer with a tiller extension. It means you can see the tale tales (sp). Just don't gybe the boom in a rush the car on the traveller will pop the end fitting off and leave the boat rather quick if it's not locked off :)
 
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Sounds like you are describing a Moody 31 Mk 2 with the sugar scoop stern, traveller in the cockpit, fin keel etc. For the price they are now going for dropping in a new Beta 30 or D1-30 will give you shaft drive and reliability.
 
Sounds like you are describing a Moody 31 Mk 2 with the sugar scoop stern, traveller in the cockpit, fin keel etc. For the price they are now going for dropping in a new Beta 30 or D1-30 will give you shaft drive and reliability.

I did consider that and still would if I could find a nice one though with probably only four or five years sailing left in me I was hoping to avoid a project.
What is a reasonable sort of budget for a 30 hp. re-engine.
Our Sigma 38 had a 2003 and when I took it out to the workshop after about 15 years the engineer rebuilt it but told me I could have waited another 15. However its next owner re-engined after a couple of years.
 
How about the smaller / earlier Hanses? 291 / 301 etc. Narrow easily driven hull, good ballast ratio and a smaller rig.

I thought (from an earlier thread) that the OP was going to look at these too, perhaps he has excluded them. They certainly do answer the issues raised in this thread- mainsheet position and they can be fitted with a big wide traveller track in the centre of the cockpit, immediatley at hand from the helm.

Whilst they're not quite the First 31.7 they can still be quite lively boats though. And we find ours perfectly fine down below but for more elderly sailors the narrow hull might make them feel more cramped- the heads in particular is tiny.
 
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