SirSnoozalot
New member
Aha. Thanks Nick.
Moonfleet Sailing - Cruise from Hell
- Thread starter CarolSheppard
- Start date
- Status
m00nfleet
New member
Re: Moonfleet Sailing - Cross Channel Cruise
Joining Instructions were issued to join at the Moonfleet Portakabin at 8.30pm, due to the kitchen in the Yacht Club being closed for a private function all 5 clients (including Carol & Gary) were informed by phone or email and asked to eat before arriving, they only live 9 miles from the marina so it was expected that they would eat before leaving home.
Gary had asked to complete the Competent Crew course during the cruise, this started with the safety brief covering use of life jackets and fire fighting (part of his syllabus) and this continued during the cruise. Carol seems to confuse slightly faded life jackets with mould, these are inspected at regular intervals and by Ocean Safety annually. Food on the Yacht was both fresh and frozen with salad and fruit served daily, not one complaint has been received in the 9 years Moonfleet has been trading, Gary cooked a very nice meal for the rest of the crew consisting of Sweet & sour chicken & Ruhbarb Crumble and custard which everone enjoyed and complimented him on. Its true everyone was warned of the weakness of the heads door locking mechanism which was well founded as another client accidentally fell on the handle and subsequently broke it, another one has now been ordered (the 4th). The duty free which was mentioned is bought for the business and a bottle of wine is placed on the yachts at the start of each course to welcome guests on board, Carol and Gary were quick to accept a glass of Moonfleet wine with there first evening meal (Lasagne, salad & cheesecake). We arrived in Cherbourg late afternoon on Weds and and tonight was to be a crew meal ashore, Carol & gary without a word to the others went ashore alone, I enjoyed a pleasant /forums/images/graemlins/confused.gifmeal with the other three clients. Thursday we were to sail back to Poole, however as the forecast was a Westerly force 3/4 it was decided the crew could look around Cherbourg, Carol & Gary visited the Submarine museum on my recommendation and thoroughly enjoyed it. We departed Cherbourg 1400 arriving back in Poole at 0100(the bag of chocolate bars which had been provided specifically for the night sail had been all but eaten by Carol & Gary during a late night drinking session, they had plenty of their own in their cabin) this allowed Gary to complete 4 hrs night sailing for his CC course. From the start of the cruise Carol & Gary didn't seem to want to socialise with the remainder of the crew, always going off on their own, which being a couple is understandable, what is not understandable is why did they not join the remainder of the crew for the meal on the final night ashore, why they after cleaning the yacht up (apparently Carol suggested to another person that they chip in £10 each to pay for the yacht to be cleaned) left the marina without saying a word to everyone else, not a goodbye to anyone, how odd. how extremly rude, I had prepared a Competent Crew certificate for Gary.
My thanks to John for alerting me to this article.
Noel Smith
Principle
Moonfleet Sailing
Joining Instructions were issued to join at the Moonfleet Portakabin at 8.30pm, due to the kitchen in the Yacht Club being closed for a private function all 5 clients (including Carol & Gary) were informed by phone or email and asked to eat before arriving, they only live 9 miles from the marina so it was expected that they would eat before leaving home.
Gary had asked to complete the Competent Crew course during the cruise, this started with the safety brief covering use of life jackets and fire fighting (part of his syllabus) and this continued during the cruise. Carol seems to confuse slightly faded life jackets with mould, these are inspected at regular intervals and by Ocean Safety annually. Food on the Yacht was both fresh and frozen with salad and fruit served daily, not one complaint has been received in the 9 years Moonfleet has been trading, Gary cooked a very nice meal for the rest of the crew consisting of Sweet & sour chicken & Ruhbarb Crumble and custard which everone enjoyed and complimented him on. Its true everyone was warned of the weakness of the heads door locking mechanism which was well founded as another client accidentally fell on the handle and subsequently broke it, another one has now been ordered (the 4th). The duty free which was mentioned is bought for the business and a bottle of wine is placed on the yachts at the start of each course to welcome guests on board, Carol and Gary were quick to accept a glass of Moonfleet wine with there first evening meal (Lasagne, salad & cheesecake). We arrived in Cherbourg late afternoon on Weds and and tonight was to be a crew meal ashore, Carol & gary without a word to the others went ashore alone, I enjoyed a pleasant /forums/images/graemlins/confused.gifmeal with the other three clients. Thursday we were to sail back to Poole, however as the forecast was a Westerly force 3/4 it was decided the crew could look around Cherbourg, Carol & Gary visited the Submarine museum on my recommendation and thoroughly enjoyed it. We departed Cherbourg 1400 arriving back in Poole at 0100(the bag of chocolate bars which had been provided specifically for the night sail had been all but eaten by Carol & Gary during a late night drinking session, they had plenty of their own in their cabin) this allowed Gary to complete 4 hrs night sailing for his CC course. From the start of the cruise Carol & Gary didn't seem to want to socialise with the remainder of the crew, always going off on their own, which being a couple is understandable, what is not understandable is why did they not join the remainder of the crew for the meal on the final night ashore, why they after cleaning the yacht up (apparently Carol suggested to another person that they chip in £10 each to pay for the yacht to be cleaned) left the marina without saying a word to everyone else, not a goodbye to anyone, how odd. how extremly rude, I had prepared a Competent Crew certificate for Gary.
My thanks to John for alerting me to this article.
Noel Smith
Principle
Moonfleet Sailing
webcraft
Well-known member
Re: Moonfleet Sailing - Cross Channel Cruise
[ QUOTE ]
how odd. how extremly rude
[/ QUOTE ]
Don't worry about it Noel. I think the fact that Carol wanted to pay someone to clean the yacht says it all really - she just didn't get the whole concept from the sound of it.
As you can see from the thread she didn't fool many of us on here, and I don't think it will have done Moonfleet any harm. 'Crews from Hell' - they happen occasionally, fortunately rarely though.
- W
[ QUOTE ]
how odd. how extremly rude
[/ QUOTE ]
Don't worry about it Noel. I think the fact that Carol wanted to pay someone to clean the yacht says it all really - she just didn't get the whole concept from the sound of it.
As you can see from the thread she didn't fool many of us on here, and I don't think it will have done Moonfleet any harm. 'Crews from Hell' - they happen occasionally, fortunately rarely though.
- W
David_Jersey
New member
Re: Moonfleet Sailing - Cross Channel Cruise
Always interesting to hear both sides. Cheers.
FWIW I think the problem was that what Carol & Gary thought they had bought was not what Moonfleet were selling.......and throw in some poor communication........
IMO ain't no right or wrong to apportion. and in situatiions like this always something to learn for both parties.
But interesting to hear about getting the punters to clean the boat at the end of the voyage. can't say I would have expected that. helping to tidy up a bit fair enuf - but anything else? LOL /forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif
Maybe Carol & Gary dissapeared sharpish just in case yer broke out the anti-fouling brushes? /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif
Always interesting to hear both sides. Cheers.
FWIW I think the problem was that what Carol & Gary thought they had bought was not what Moonfleet were selling.......and throw in some poor communication........
IMO ain't no right or wrong to apportion. and in situatiions like this always something to learn for both parties.
But interesting to hear about getting the punters to clean the boat at the end of the voyage. can't say I would have expected that. helping to tidy up a bit fair enuf - but anything else? LOL /forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif
Maybe Carol & Gary dissapeared sharpish just in case yer broke out the anti-fouling brushes? /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif
longjohnsilver
Well-known member
Re: Moonfleet Sailing - Cross Channel Cruise
Good to hear the other side of the story. Hopefully that will now be the end of this saga.
Good to hear the other side of the story. Hopefully that will now be the end of this saga.
m00nfleet
New member
Re: Moonfleet Sailing - Cross Channel Cruise
Having read some of the comments from forum members, I would like to thank those that have supported us and to answer a few more questions/comments.
Joining time was 8.30pm (not 8pm as stated by Carol) on the joining instructions, the instructor was not late, Carol & Gary were early.
There was ample bottled water on board, to cater for clients who preferred it to tap water.
The Competent Crew course is a continual learning experience which started the moment the client stepped on board, time was taken to go through the syllabus with Gary from his log book to ensure everything was covered.
The instructor was not on holiday, this was throughaway remark at a light hearted moment.
There was no out of date food or mouldy bread aboard, if Carol had noticed it she should have brought it to my attention, which she didn't. Food was not rationed!
Did Carol & Gary really want a full english breakfast before embarking on a 12 hr cross chanel sail at 6am in the morning.
During the cruise there was no hint of a complaint or dissatisfaction and since arriving back there has still been no complaint, it is quite clear in our booking conditions what the complaints procedure is, ie bring it up at the time so the problem can be resolved.
Noel
Principal
Moonfleet Sailing
Having read some of the comments from forum members, I would like to thank those that have supported us and to answer a few more questions/comments.
Joining time was 8.30pm (not 8pm as stated by Carol) on the joining instructions, the instructor was not late, Carol & Gary were early.
There was ample bottled water on board, to cater for clients who preferred it to tap water.
The Competent Crew course is a continual learning experience which started the moment the client stepped on board, time was taken to go through the syllabus with Gary from his log book to ensure everything was covered.
The instructor was not on holiday, this was throughaway remark at a light hearted moment.
There was no out of date food or mouldy bread aboard, if Carol had noticed it she should have brought it to my attention, which she didn't. Food was not rationed!
Did Carol & Gary really want a full english breakfast before embarking on a 12 hr cross chanel sail at 6am in the morning.
During the cruise there was no hint of a complaint or dissatisfaction and since arriving back there has still been no complaint, it is quite clear in our booking conditions what the complaints procedure is, ie bring it up at the time so the problem can be resolved.
Noel
Principal
Moonfleet Sailing
SirSnoozalot
New member
Re: Moonfleet Sailing - Cross Channel Cruise
It's good to hear both sides of the story. In my line of business, we occassionally get customers whose expectations of the service we provide are higher than the level of service we can offer. It probably isn't their fault that they have high expectations, nor our fault that we do not meet them. If given advance notice of what they expect, or if told at the time, then we often bend over backwards to give that little bit extra just to try and keep them as customers. Sometimes we even make a rod for our own back.
The point is, if they don't tell you where the problem is, it's difficult to know what extra to do. Clearly, they didn't communicate their issues to you at the time, which is a shame, but at least it gave us all an interesting thread on here.
It's good to hear both sides of the story. In my line of business, we occassionally get customers whose expectations of the service we provide are higher than the level of service we can offer. It probably isn't their fault that they have high expectations, nor our fault that we do not meet them. If given advance notice of what they expect, or if told at the time, then we often bend over backwards to give that little bit extra just to try and keep them as customers. Sometimes we even make a rod for our own back.
The point is, if they don't tell you where the problem is, it's difficult to know what extra to do. Clearly, they didn't communicate their issues to you at the time, which is a shame, but at least it gave us all an interesting thread on here.
oldharry
Well-known member
Re: Moonfleet Sailing - Cross Channel Cruise
"You can please some of the people all of the time...." as the old saying goes.
Providing food and accomodation is perhaps the touchiest of all 'service' areas in my experience (having done it in the past), and there will always be a few for whom things 'just aint right'. Fine if they tell you, you can at least then do something about it.
But t if they 'go public' without even having the courtesy of telling you first they had a problem, or giving you a chance even to reply to or deal with their criticisms, invariably tells you as the service provider, that they actually had very little to complain of.
Noel's replies rather prove the point in this case.
"You can please some of the people all of the time...." as the old saying goes.
Providing food and accomodation is perhaps the touchiest of all 'service' areas in my experience (having done it in the past), and there will always be a few for whom things 'just aint right'. Fine if they tell you, you can at least then do something about it.
But t if they 'go public' without even having the courtesy of telling you first they had a problem, or giving you a chance even to reply to or deal with their criticisms, invariably tells you as the service provider, that they actually had very little to complain of.
Noel's replies rather prove the point in this case.
BlueSkyNick
Active member
Re: Moonfleet Sailing - Cross Channel Cruise
Good to hear both sides of any argument. As webcraft says, the general theme through the thread is that Carol's expectations were wrong. As she hasnt bothered to answer the many questions that have been put to her, I suspect she has sheepishly 'left the stage'.
Good to see you on the forum.
(PS Happy 60th next December!)
Good to hear both sides of any argument. As webcraft says, the general theme through the thread is that Carol's expectations were wrong. As she hasnt bothered to answer the many questions that have been put to her, I suspect she has sheepishly 'left the stage'.
Good to see you on the forum.
(PS Happy 60th next December!)
fireball
New member
Re: Moonfleet Sailing - Cross Channel Cruise
Thank you for coming and setting out your side of the story ... as another poster said - probably down misunderstanding by the clients as to what was on offer, it does sound as though they'd be better off on the QE2 though
2 points - Full english at 5am ... yes please .... with two slices of toast and a cup of tea .... failing that, bacon sarnies at 0900 would be just fine ... but I do need a good breakfast otherwise I'm seasick .. /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif
Cleaning the boat down after the cruise - I assume this is just a clean through, hosepipe, vacuum/brush - perfectly reasonable to leave the boat clean and tidy - I've had to do this on flotilla cruises ... so no problem there...
Thank you for coming and setting out your side of the story ... as another poster said - probably down misunderstanding by the clients as to what was on offer, it does sound as though they'd be better off on the QE2 though
2 points - Full english at 5am ... yes please .... with two slices of toast and a cup of tea .... failing that, bacon sarnies at 0900 would be just fine ... but I do need a good breakfast otherwise I'm seasick .. /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif
Cleaning the boat down after the cruise - I assume this is just a clean through, hosepipe, vacuum/brush - perfectly reasonable to leave the boat clean and tidy - I've had to do this on flotilla cruises ... so no problem there...
sailorman
Well-known member
Over 2 YOU Carol were all ears
[ QUOTE ]
Having read some of the comments from forum members, I would like to thank those that have supported us and to answer a few more questions/comments.
Joining time was 8.30pm (not 8pm as stated by Carol) on the joining instructions, the instructor was not late, Carol & Gary were early.
There was ample bottled water on board, to cater for clients who preferred it to tap water.
The Competent Crew course is a continual learning experience which started the moment the client stepped on board, time was taken to go through the syllabus with Gary from his log book to ensure everything was covered.
The instructor was not on holiday, this was throughaway remark at a light hearted moment.
There was no out of date food or mouldy bread aboard, if Carol had noticed it she should have brought it to my attention, which she didn't. Food was not rationed!
Did Carol & Gary really want a full english breakfast before embarking on a 12 hr cross chanel sail at 6am in the morning.
During the cruise there was no hint of a complaint or dissatisfaction and since arriving back there has still been no complaint, it is quite clear in our booking conditions what the complaints procedure is, ie bring it up at the time so the problem can be resolved.
Noel
Principal
Moonfleet Sailing
[/ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Having read some of the comments from forum members, I would like to thank those that have supported us and to answer a few more questions/comments.
Joining time was 8.30pm (not 8pm as stated by Carol) on the joining instructions, the instructor was not late, Carol & Gary were early.
There was ample bottled water on board, to cater for clients who preferred it to tap water.
The Competent Crew course is a continual learning experience which started the moment the client stepped on board, time was taken to go through the syllabus with Gary from his log book to ensure everything was covered.
The instructor was not on holiday, this was throughaway remark at a light hearted moment.
There was no out of date food or mouldy bread aboard, if Carol had noticed it she should have brought it to my attention, which she didn't. Food was not rationed!
Did Carol & Gary really want a full english breakfast before embarking on a 12 hr cross chanel sail at 6am in the morning.
During the cruise there was no hint of a complaint or dissatisfaction and since arriving back there has still been no complaint, it is quite clear in our booking conditions what the complaints procedure is, ie bring it up at the time so the problem can be resolved.
Noel
Principal
Moonfleet Sailing
[/ QUOTE ]
Talulah
Well-known member
Re: Moonfleet Sailing - Cross Channel Cruise
Very brave to reply to specifics on here. I think I would have just taken up the issue with the clients and stated that as such on here.
By responding to specifics it then invites further questions!
Anyway, good luck and all's well that ends well..
Very brave to reply to specifics on here. I think I would have just taken up the issue with the clients and stated that as such on here.
By responding to specifics it then invites further questions!
Anyway, good luck and all's well that ends well..
jimmynoboat
New member
On my comp crew course I had a slightly arrogant skipper, low quality food, damp boat and a cooker which simply did not work. Overall I loved the whole experience and still think of it as one of the best weeks I've ever spent afloat. We did complain directly to the company and they listened and knocked off £50 for the bost cooker. We shared out the food and took it home (I'm up for a free Frey Bentos anytime).
I wrote it up later here
Character building comes to mind.
Sorry - forgot to mention, my course was not with Moonfleet.
I wrote it up later here
Character building comes to mind.
Sorry - forgot to mention, my course was not with Moonfleet.
Dyflin
Active member
Re: Moonfleet Sailing - Cross Channel Cruise
Well done for replying, as has been said, the lack of input from the OP makes their points very weak indeed.
Well done for replying, as has been said, the lack of input from the OP makes their points very weak indeed.
Lakesailor
New member
Re: Moonfleet Sailing - Cross Channel Cruise
Your response seems to back up what others have said about you in that you offer a respectable quality of hospitality in addition to the training aspect.
From what you say it seems that the original posters are of the sort that we would sometimes encounter in the B&B for whom it seems, you cannot do enough.
Sometimes people have left and we have thought that they were particularly anti-social and had really disliked the experience, only to find they send a card thanking us for the wonderful stay.
You didn't get that on this occasion and you can only accept that some people are genuinely impossible to please.
Put them out of your mind and relax in the knowledge that others are delighted with their time with you.
Your response seems to back up what others have said about you in that you offer a respectable quality of hospitality in addition to the training aspect.
From what you say it seems that the original posters are of the sort that we would sometimes encounter in the B&B for whom it seems, you cannot do enough.
Sometimes people have left and we have thought that they were particularly anti-social and had really disliked the experience, only to find they send a card thanking us for the wonderful stay.
You didn't get that on this occasion and you can only accept that some people are genuinely impossible to please.
Put them out of your mind and relax in the knowledge that others are delighted with their time with you.
[ QUOTE ]
To me this shows (if anything) that the business values substance above froth and prefers to spend its money on other things.
[/ QUOTE ]
Spent on what? Certain not on feeding the crew with decent mould free food or replacing the fraying life jackets, let me guess the sailing school owner's bank account.
The web site makes me suspicious about the attitude of those running Moonfleet, as someone has mentioned not one customer quote or photo of a happy crew. The only photo's I saw were Bavaria brochure shots with a misleading bowl of fruit.
The sort of people who promote their business with a web site like that are just as likely to skimp further on a pro skipper who arrives late and cannot be arsed to instruct lowly competent crew trainees. Messing up on planning that leads to a newly arrived crew going to bed hungry on their first night on board is inexcusable.
p.s. the layout plan shown for their Bavaria 36 Ultra does not match any Bav 36 I have seen, it looks like a Bav 38 or 40.
To me this shows (if anything) that the business values substance above froth and prefers to spend its money on other things.
[/ QUOTE ]
Spent on what? Certain not on feeding the crew with decent mould free food or replacing the fraying life jackets, let me guess the sailing school owner's bank account.
The web site makes me suspicious about the attitude of those running Moonfleet, as someone has mentioned not one customer quote or photo of a happy crew. The only photo's I saw were Bavaria brochure shots with a misleading bowl of fruit.
The sort of people who promote their business with a web site like that are just as likely to skimp further on a pro skipper who arrives late and cannot be arsed to instruct lowly competent crew trainees. Messing up on planning that leads to a newly arrived crew going to bed hungry on their first night on board is inexcusable.
p.s. the layout plan shown for their Bavaria 36 Ultra does not match any Bav 36 I have seen, it looks like a Bav 38 or 40.
webcraft
Well-known member
[ QUOTE ]
The sort of people who promote their business with a web site like that are just as likely to skimp further on a pro skipper who arrives late and cannot be arsed to instruct lowly competent crew trainees. Messing up on planning that leads to a newly arrived crew going to bed hungry on their first night on board is inexcusable.
[/ QUOTE ] Why don't you bother to read previous posts before replying to me? The principal of the school has already answered most of these points. If you want to only purchase goods and services from organisations that have spent a fortune on a shiny new website that is your perogative, but don't expect us all to have such shallow values.
- W
The sort of people who promote their business with a web site like that are just as likely to skimp further on a pro skipper who arrives late and cannot be arsed to instruct lowly competent crew trainees. Messing up on planning that leads to a newly arrived crew going to bed hungry on their first night on board is inexcusable.
[/ QUOTE ] Why don't you bother to read previous posts before replying to me? The principal of the school has already answered most of these points. If you want to only purchase goods and services from organisations that have spent a fortune on a shiny new website that is your perogative, but don't expect us all to have such shallow values.
- W
Talulah
Well-known member
[ QUOTE ]
p.s. the layout plan shown for their Bavaria 36 Ultra does not match any Bav 36 I have seen, it looks like a Bav 38 or 40.
[/ QUOTE ]
A number of us will now be hitting Moonfleets web site to check.
I agree, the description of the yacht 'Ultra' and the brochure pics of a Bavaria Cruiser is inconsistent with the layout of 'Ultra' on the charter page.
I'm sure Noel will be quick on the case to update the page before we start looking for more inconsistencies! It may not seem important to us but I'm sure many customers look at those layouts in detail deciding who is going to get which cabin in the build up to their holiday.
p.s. the layout plan shown for their Bavaria 36 Ultra does not match any Bav 36 I have seen, it looks like a Bav 38 or 40.
[/ QUOTE ]
A number of us will now be hitting Moonfleets web site to check.
I agree, the description of the yacht 'Ultra' and the brochure pics of a Bavaria Cruiser is inconsistent with the layout of 'Ultra' on the charter page.
I'm sure Noel will be quick on the case to update the page before we start looking for more inconsistencies! It may not seem important to us but I'm sure many customers look at those layouts in detail deciding who is going to get which cabin in the build up to their holiday.
[ QUOTE ]
If you check the requirements for the CC course you will see that there are no less than 14 separate areas that have to be covered and signed off in the candidate's logbook during the five days.
[/ QUOTE ]
My point exactly, people new to yachting read all that in the RYA literature and believe this is the training their £400 buys. Too many sailing schools skate over the substance of the syllabus and rubber stamp the certs at the end of the cruise. Why after 3 days did Carol have to ask when the training was going to start? I personally recall members of my fellow competent crew course informing the skipper they did not know anything about some course elements signed off in the end of week log book rubber stamping exercise.
If the RYA is not prepared to police competent crew training standards they should scrap the qualification because it undermines the credibility of the whole scheme.
If you check the requirements for the CC course you will see that there are no less than 14 separate areas that have to be covered and signed off in the candidate's logbook during the five days.
[/ QUOTE ]
My point exactly, people new to yachting read all that in the RYA literature and believe this is the training their £400 buys. Too many sailing schools skate over the substance of the syllabus and rubber stamp the certs at the end of the cruise. Why after 3 days did Carol have to ask when the training was going to start? I personally recall members of my fellow competent crew course informing the skipper they did not know anything about some course elements signed off in the end of week log book rubber stamping exercise.
If the RYA is not prepared to police competent crew training standards they should scrap the qualification because it undermines the credibility of the whole scheme.
longjohnsilver
Well-known member
<span style="color:red">The sort of people who promote their business with a web site like that are just as likely to skimp further on a pro skipper who arrives late and cannot be arsed to instruct lowly competent crew trainees. Messing up on planning that leads to a newly arrived crew going to bed hungry on their first night on board is inexcusable.
</span>
Nothing like making assumptions to support your arguement!!
Maybe reading Moonfleets response before writing this would have been useful!
</span>
Nothing like making assumptions to support your arguement!!
Maybe reading Moonfleets response before writing this would have been useful!
- Status