MD21B pump.

[tom2412]

Hi

Can anyone confirm if the peugeot 504 pump contains the parts required to rebuild the vp pumps ? Got mine in bits currently and before I order a peugeot pump I'd like to confirm if possible please

 

[pandos]

Hi

Can anyone confirm if the peugeot 504 pump contains the parts required to rebuild the vp pumps ? Got mine in bits currently and before I order a peugeot pump I'd like to confirm if possible please

Sorry, for various reasons I haven't actually managed to get this job done yet.

There seems to be several versions of the Peugeot pump. One difference is the length and thickness of the shaft which facilitates the different types of fan that are fitted to the cars.

I have a load of things to do at the moment so I won't be able to to go at this for a while..if you do try i' d appreciate any info that you can gather.

This looks close ..https://www.melun-retro-passion.com/gb/pompe-a-eau/505-water-pump-peugeot-404-504-non-disengageable-.html#product-details

 

[tom2412]

Sorry, for various reasons I haven't actually managed to get this job done yet.

There seems to be several versions of the Peugeot pump. One difference is the length and thickness of the shaft which facilitates the different types of fan that are fitted to the cars.

I have a load of things to do at the moment so I won't be able to to go at this for a while..if you do try i' d appreciate any info that you can gather.

This looks close ..https://www.melun-retro-passion.com/gb/pompe-a-eau/505-water-pump-peugeot-404-504-non-disengageable-.html#product-details

I've since ordered a 504 pump and can confirm the impeller is correct but the shaft length and bearing size is incorrect, I'm going to get some bearings to rebuild my housing , be interesting to hear your findings

 

[pandos]

I've since ordered a 504 pump and can confirm the impeller is correct but the shaft length and bearing size is incorrect, I'm going to get some bearings to rebuild my housing , be interesting to hear your findings

Thanks for that. Which pump did you get?

I have been looking again at mine today and I may just need a new impeller, and to have a shaft turned to suit my pulley wheel which is damaged anyway, so with a new shaft I will still need to have the pulley bored and bushed to fit a standard shaft.

 

[tom2412]

Thanks for that. Which pump did you get?

I have been looking again at mine today and I may just need a new impeller, and to have a shaft turned to suit my pulley wheel which is damaged anyway, so with a new shaft I will still need to have the pulley bored and bushed to fit a standard shaft.

this is the pump I ordered, I have found impellers separately but they are approx €65 + postage from a French supplier, bearings seem to be a issue aswell and I'm also struggling to get someone to put the spline for the impeller onto a new shaft, regarding bearings I may have my shaft turned down slightly to allow for a wider range of bearing , also I intend to modify the housing to allow for a removable greese fitting into the weep hole to help prolong the life of the bearings , be interesting to hear how you get on , there's a company in Devon who offer a rebuild £300 ish but won't supply the parts separately so there must be a way to get these parts in a coat effective manner

 

[pandos]

View attachment 172538this is the pump I ordered, I have found impellers separately but they are approx €65 + postage from a French supplier, bearings seem to be a issue aswell and I'm also struggling to get someone to put the spline for the impeller onto a new shaft, regarding bearings I may have my shaft turned down slightly to allow for a wider range of bearing , also I intend to modify the housing to allow for a removable greese fitting into the weep hole to help prolong the life of the bearings , be interesting to hear how you get on , there's a company in Devon who offer a rebuild £300 ish but won't supply the parts separately so there must be a way to get these parts in a coat effective manner

https://www.serie04.com/fr/504-refr...au.html?search_query=Pompe+deleau&results=211

These are the guys who have many internals for the engine from.

It looks like this is the pump you have, I think the circlips at 35mm are too small so there must be another pump with maybe 42mm clips..

I saw one for a 403 which has a 15mm shaft and I think 42mm circlips. But this pump was e299 from these guys. I wonder if this the correct doner pump...(at 299 I am not going experimenting)

I hope to get to the bearing suppliers during the week and will see if they can get the replacement bearings. The numbering on mine is clear and they look like a make I recognize. (I need to get the magnifier to read them)

If you put a grease nipple in the pump won't you stop the weep hole, which should let you know of a problem in advance of a complete failure?

 

[tom2412]

https://www.serie04.com/fr/504-refr...au.html?search_query=Pompe+deleau&results=211

These are the guys who have many internals for the engine from.

It looks like this is the pump you have, I think the circlips at 35mm are too small so there must be another pump with maybe 42mm clips..

I saw one for a 403 which has a 15mm shaft and I think 42mm circlips. But this pump was e299 from these guys. I wonder if this the correct doner pump...(at 299 I am not going experimenting)

I hope to get to the bearing suppliers during the week and will see if they can get the replacement bearings. The numbering on mine is clear and they look like a make I recognize. (I need to get the magnifier to read them)

If you put a grease nipple in the pump won't you stop the weep hole, which should let you know of a problem in advance of a complete failure?

The plan is to pump greese into the housing then remove the fitting to allow the weep hole to do its job should a issue happen , if you are successful in sourcing bearings please do let me know the part numbers

 

[pandos]

The plan is to pump greese into the housing then remove the fitting to allow the weep hole to do its job should a issue happen , if you are successful in sourcing bearings please do let me know the part numbers

Bought replacement bearings today, total cost 19.86 euros. Suppliers had them in stock. one of each required.

Made by FAG..6301-2RSR C3
AND 6302-C-HRS-C3

Googling suggests they are even cheaper online...

If I get a chance to go to the precision engineering place during the week I will, at that stage I'll get an idea of what the new shaft would cost.

peugeot 403 water pump

This link shows a similar pump and issues. Interestingly one version makes it possible to replace the bearings without removing the impeller.. using a sleeve to separate the bearings in lieu of a step in the shaft...

 

[tom2412]

Bought replacement bearings today, total cost 19.86 euros. Suppliers had them in stock. one of each required.

Made by FAG..6301-2RSR C3
AND 6302-C-HRS-C3

Googling suggests they are even cheaper online...

If I get a chance to go to the precision engineering place during the week I will, at that stage I'll get an idea of what the new shaft would cost.

peugeot 403 water pump

This link shows a similar pump and issues. Interestingly one version makes it possible to replace the bearings without removing the impeller.. using a sleeve to separate the bearings in lieu of a step in the shaft...

Thankyou for the numbers that's a big help , be keen to hear if you can get a shaft turned on a lathe I'd say collectively we've worked out the solution

 

[pandos]

Thankyou for the numbers that's a big help , be keen to hear if you can get a shaft turned on a lathe I'd say collectively we've worked out the solution

My son is a mechanical engineer, he has no facilities to do this work but he did it in college workshops, he says the shaft would take 20 minutes for a guy who knew what he was doing, and if they had a CNC lath it would take an hour to do 10...one should cost 50 euros..

 

[DownWest]

Just to ad a note to this:
Yesterday I was asked to look at the fresh water cooling pump on a Fiat/Iveco 6 pot in a big steel peniche. It has two, plus a 65 hp bow thruster (!).
It was dribbling from the weep hole, so pulled the pump and looked at the ceramic seal after drawing the impellor off. Paused, while we looked for spares. This thread came to mind.. on costs.
Well, the owner sent some links early today for new pumps. These are cast iron and really solid bits of kit, the engine is used on trucks and tractors.
The first link I ditched as different connections, but the second was spot on, so ordered. Comes with fresh gaskets for about 80 euro.
At that price we dropped all idea of fixing the original.
Makes the car derived bits for Indenor look quite pricey, not to mention Volvo......

Oh, I met another forumit on here when he was looking for help with his VP 22. Local yard was saying he needed a new heat exchanger matrix at € 1,500. but their logic didn't make sense. Result was a fix for small change after we had a rad company pressure test it and found the matrix was not the problem. Gaskets were.

 

[pandos]

Thankyou for the numbers that's a big help , be keen to hear if you can get a shaft turned on a lathe I'd say collectively we've worked out the solution

Ok I wasted my money on the bearings...today I bought two of these pumps for 35euros...

POMPA ACQUA PEUGEOT 404 1600 GT DISPONIBILE QH 170666 CASSA 149/A - Fabio Izzo Autoricambi

They are Quinton hazel 170666.

That are listed for 404 engines. Although I bought it from a guy who had it advertised for a 504.

The shaft and bearings and the impeller appear functionally identical to the original Volvo. The impeller is a little different in design but I suspect will be fine.

I had to destroy one impeller to get the shaft out intact.

My Volvo pump is pretty much together now, except I am thinking whether to press on my old impeller or use the one from the second pump.

The front of the shaft may be a little shorter but there is ample for smaller nylok nut. the face on the pulley could be reduced to expose a few more mms of thread.

BTW The shaft between the bearings was covered in a huge lump of grease on it.

My photos are too big to upload.

Thanks to Mr Cox for the tip, here's a screenshot of the QH shaft with bearings and grease...

 

[vyv_cox]

Ok I wasted my money on the bearings...today I bought two of these pumps for 35euros...

POMPA ACQUA PEUGEOT 404 1600 GT DISPONIBILE QH 170666 CASSA 149/A - Fabio Izzo Autoricambi

They are Quinton hazel 170666.

That are listed for 404 engines. Although I bought it from a guy who had it advertised for a 504.

The shaft and bearings and the impeller appear functionally identical to the original Volvo. The impeller is a little different in design but I suspect will be fine.

I had to destroy one impeller to get the shaft out intact.

My Volvo pump is pretty much together now, except I am thinking whether to press on my old impeller or use the one from the second pump.

The front of the shaft may be a little shorter but there is ample for smaller nylok nut. the face on the pulley could be reduced to expose a few more mms of thread.

BTW The shaft between the bearings was covered in a huge lump of grease on it.

My photos are too big to upload.

I was given a tip last year regarding large photos. A screen dump of the pic is much smaller and will be accepted by the forum.