MD21B pump.

[pandos]

I need to replace the spindle and maybe the pulley on the water pump (coolant) on my Penta MD21B.

It seems to do this one must destroy the impeller and press out two bearings.

The kit can be bought for what looks like silly money.

Volvo Penta Circulating Pump Repair Kit 19372

This engine is used in many old cars and the entire pump for one of these can be had for about 90quid.

I suspect I can salvage the impeller or the spindle/shaft from the pump, but not both. I will need to get a a non-standard shaft turned to allow for repairs to my pulley. But to do so I will need the original for measurements.

Has anyone any experience of doing a refurb on one of these pumps?

Or know of a source for just an impeller.?

 

[pandos]

Update might be useful to others...

I drilled out the center of the shaft so that the impeller was easily twisted off. It came off intact and ready to be pressed onto a new shaft.

Then I knocked out the shaft along with the two bearings, took 2 minutes and few taps of a hammer and block of wood.

Local engineering shop will make up a new shaft and repair the pulley with a bush and a new key.

The bearings are about a tenner all in.

The shaft is mild steel, which surprised me.

The ASAP kit at 530 pounds sterling must be a record even for Volvo bits.

 

[vyv_cox]

Mild steel not really a surprise. Corrosion not an issue internally with antifreeze and inhibitor. Externally much like most of the rest of the engine, paint and oil gives enough protection. Strength perfectly adequate for a low stress application like a water pump.

 

[pandos]

Mild steel not really a surprise. Corrosion not an issue internally with antifreeze and inhibitor. Externally much like most of the rest of the engine, paint and oil gives enough protection. Strength perfectly adequate for a low stress application like a water pump.

Makes sense, thanks

 

[Steve_N]

Has anyone any experience of doing a refurb on one of these pumps?

Or know of a source for just an impeller.?

As part of the refurb be sure to re-face the pump housing where the impeller seal makes contact. The ceramic impeller seal itself doesn't seem to wear at all but the face of the alu casting against which it turns does. It's only the pressure of the impeller's spring holding the seal against the pump body which keeps the coolant in.

I sourced a new-old-stock impeller very cheaply from a USA VP dealer but to be honest I couldn't detect any wear on the seal of the 30+ year old original - they looked identical.

 

[pandos]

As part of the refurb be sure to re-face the pump housing where the impeller seal makes contact. The ceramic impeller seal itself doesn't seem to wear at all but the face of the alu casting against which it turns does. It's only the pressure of the impeller's spring holding the seal against the pump body which keeps the coolant in.

I sourced a new-old-stock impeller very cheaply from a USA VP dealer but to be honest I couldn't detect any wear on the seal of the 30+ year old original - they looked identical.

That is interesting, any of the exploded diagrams I have seen do not show details for the impeller as a separate part, I will go to my local vp dealer as a last resort...

The pump face is perfect, there is a tiny bit of wear on the back face of the impeller. Unless I can easily obtain a new one I'll just re use it.

I think mine must have been refurbished in the past as the bearings are marked Slovakia, which I think only came into being in the 1990s.

Thanks.

Tony.

 

[Bilgediver]

Mild steel not really a surprise. Corrosion not an issue internally with antifreeze and inhibitor. Externally much like most of the rest of the engine, paint and oil gives enough protection. Strength perfectly adequate for a low stress application like a water pump.

Is this the Volvo engine based on a Peugot ?

 

[vyv_cox]

Is this the Volvo engine based on a Peugot ?

Montego engine I believe. Some engine derivations here Yacht engine derivations

 

[Steve_N]

Montego engine I believe. Some engine derivations here Yacht engine derivations

One digit out I'm afraid, the MD22 is the Montego derivative.
The MD21 is built upon an Indenor/Peugeot XDP4-90 2112cc base, used in the road on the Peugeot 504. The same base engine was used to produce the Vetus P4-21 and the Lehman 4D61, plus many engines in the Low Countries simply referred to as 'Indenor Bootsmotor'

 

[vyv_cox]

One digit out I'm afraid, the MD22 is the Montego derivative.
The MD21 is built upon an Indenor/Peugeot XDP4-90 2112cc base.

Thanks. I will add that to my page.

 

[pandos]

Thanks. I will add that to my page.

fYI Also used on some Fords and currently used in a Mahindra jeep. Unfortunately the water pump casing is a little different.

jury is out on whether I can take a new impeller from a Ford /Peugeot pump.

Many parts still available on Autodoc and from specialist French suppliers and from tractor places.

I have new pistons, rings and cylinder liners bought as new old stock for a couple of hundred quid so I'll probably do a full rebuild this year.

 

[Steve_N]

Yep, Ford Granada 2.1D and the Indian/Brazilian Mahidra Jeep, I always (when I had the engine) meant to buy a 504 water pump and see if the impeller was the same - it certainly looks like it is.
The impeller was (long obsolete) VP part no. 826871 but both Muldormotor and IndenorRetro seem to be able to supply them at a cost so it does perhaps suggest that they are pulling them off vehicle water pumps.

Apart from the obvious cooling/manifold/heat exchanger mods. that all of the marinisers of this fine engine have made the big plus of the VP version is the replacement of the timing chain (crank, cam + injection pump) with timing gears.

 

[pandos]

, I always (when I had the engine) meant to buy a 504 water pump and see if the impeller was the same - it certainly looks like it is.
The impeller was (long obsolete) VP part no. 826871 but both Muldormotor and Indenor Retro seem to be able to supply them at a cost so it does perhaps suggest that they are pulling them off vehicle water pumps.

Many thanks for the part number.

I suspect you may be correct. At e159 just for the impeller and 50 quid for a new old stock motorcraft pump, certainly worth taking the chance that they are the same.

There is a stamp on the impeller from which I may be able to identify the manufacturer. (I'll need daylight and my best glasses...) it's AP so the same manufacturer as the original Peugeot water pump.

Peugeot 204 304 403 404 504 505 Seal Impeller – Joint Turbine – 122117 or 122121 | Vintage French Car Parts

https://www.autodoc.co.uk/sasic/9277001

Looks like the part is available on its own. Although I'd like a look at the full pump as the bearings and shaft may be of use...more googling tomorrow...

Thanks again.

 

[Bilgediver]

Montego engine I believe. Some engine derivations here Yacht engine derivations

Thanks Vic. Seems it does reach back via Montego to Peugot . A friend had one in his Westerly Vulcan

 

[vyv_cox]

Thanks Vic. Seems it does reach back via Montego to Peugot . A friend had one in his Westerly Vulcan

I have added Steve N's and pandos' posts to the page on engine derivations.

 

[scottie]

volvo MD 21 & 22 are same colour but totally different origin montego connection is red herring

 

[pandos]

MD21B
Thought I'd just post a link to these guys as it might be useful to others.

I used their fuel lift pump about 3 years ago, never missed a beat or required to be bled since.

 

[Michael KP46]

Update might be useful to others...

I drilled out the center of the shaft so that the impeller was easily twisted off. It came off intact and ready to be pressed onto a new shaft.

Then I knocked out the shaft along with the two bearings, took 2 minutes and few taps of a hammer and block of wood.

Local engineering shop will make up a new shaft and repair the pulley with a bush and a new key.

The bearings are about a tenner all in.

The shaft is mild steel, which surprised me.

The ASAP kit at 530 pounds sterling must be a record even for Volvo bits.

I am in the USA with the Volvo penta MD 21B. My water pump. The circulation pump failed today. I am now stuck in a harbor in San Francisco Bay

Looking at the discussion here. Has anybody come up with an actual pump that is available. I'm talking about the glycol circulation pump, not the sea water pump.

 

[pandos]

My belief is that if you pick up a 504 pump the impeller, shaft and bearings will all work in your old pump casing once this is still intact.

I am just out of hospital so not firing on all cylinders myself but I am sure of what I said in the earlier posts.

I have a pdf manual for the engine which shows the impeller being pulled off. Pm me an email and I will send it to you.

WATER PUMP FITS FORD GRANADA GU PEUGEOT 504 505 1.9 2.1 2.3 D BGA CP2684 | eBay

This item or similar would be worth trying as a source for the impeller/bearings/shaft

 

[Michael KP46]

My belief is that if you pick up a 504 pump the impeller, shaft and bearings will all work in your old pump casing once this is still intact.

I am just out of hospital so not firing on all cylinders myself but I am sure of what I said in the earlier posts.

I have a pdf manual for the engine which shows the impeller being pulled off. Pm me an email and I will send it to you.

WATER PUMP FITS FORD GRANADA GU PEUGEOT 504 505 1.9 2.1 2.3 D BGA CP2684 | eBay

This item or similar would be worth trying as a source for the impeller/bearings/shaft

I understand it's ironic. I was just thinking that and then I received your message. My email is mikerobinson617@yahoo.com.
Thanks so much for all the help. It's appreciated. This motor only has 2900 hours and I love the motor itself it runs beautifully.