Maximum draft, best location for stress-free East coast sailing?

[Egret]

There is plenty of space in Harwich Harbour for everyone. Wivenhoe might be different but only for a few minutes as the fleet passes - Just need to read an approaching race fleet, anticipate where they will be going, especially if likely to turn at a mark - and aim for the gaps, there are plenty even in a tight fleet - and like chess, anticipate several moves ahead - behave as if you were in the same race on a different leg - catch eye of helmsmen if close - they will be looking - slight course change to clear racing boat, pass behind or on the downwind side to avoid making a wing shadow - or if you are really pedantic and have right of way, shout STARBOARD very loudly.

Maybe all cruising people who sail in areas where there is racing should ask at the club if they can spend some time with the race team, in the race box and on the rescue boat, or on a race boat, to understand racing in the area, and maybe make friends with the competitors you will see on the water. Might even like to take part in a regatta race - every boat type has a handicap so can join in.

 

[johnalison]

I am still of the opinion that boats continually tacking (at speed and at the last moment) are a bloody nuisance , they get as far as Harwich harbour docks and turn around and go back annoying more people on the way back. Perhaps their sailing skills or confidence don't allow them to go out to sea where they can really test their boats. Plus I have never seen a bilge keeler being dragged off the mud by a lifeboat.

Quite why you should wish to advertise your incompetence on a sailing forum is beyond me.

 

[Daydream believer]

. Plus I have never seen a bilge keeler being dragged off the mud by a lifeboat.

Well there was one next to me at Bradwell that lost a seasons sailing whilst the skeg etc was re built after a grounding over near Mersea. & being dragged by the RNLI

 

[shanemax]

For a thread about stress-free sailing .... this thread is becoming a little stressful

Couldn't agree with you more. I was just trying to liven things up a bit and if people take offence over my tongue in cheek opinions it all adds to the banter.

 

[Daydream believer]

I am still of the opinion that boats continually tacking (at speed and at the last moment) are a bloody nuisance , they get as far as Harwich harbour docks and turn around and go back annoying more people on the way back. Perhaps their sailing skills or confidence don't allow them to go out to sea where they can really test their boats. Plus I have never seen a bilge keeler being dragged off the mud by a lifeboat.

Annoying more people? You mean just you don't you?
tacking at speed? What properly, not like some dodgy moron all over the place with sails flapping?
At last minute? Just as the depth reduces? ie using the maximum width of the available water?
Continually tacking? Well that is what one does when heading up wind. Did you nit know that? Probably not.
Go out to sea? It takes more skill to sail up a narrow river against wind & tide than just sail a single course at sea

 

[shanemax]

If i hear a ship give 5 blasts it is usually someone tacking across the channel or some yacht (probably a fin keeler) sitting midway between the red and green buoys having not looked behind him /her for 20/30 minutes. Happens several times every year.

 

[Daydream believer]

If i hear a ship give 5 blasts it is usually someone tacking across the channel or some yacht (probably a fin keeler) sitting midway between the red and green buoys having not looked behind him /her for 20/30 minutes. Happens several times every year.

What evidence have you that they are fin keelers?
I would suggest that yachts racing are more spacially aware than any old dodderer drifting down the river.
That might well be the "I don't race" Bilge keeler.
If they are not looking behind them would that suggest that they are running, not tacking.
Although I doubt that you would know the difference

 

[johnalison]

If i hear a ship give 5 blasts it is usually someone tacking across the channel or some yacht (probably a fin keeler) sitting midway between the red and green buoys having not looked behind him /her for 20/30 minutes. Happens several times every year.

Statistics are not your strong point either apparently. The great majority of boats on the Orwell are sailing and because of their relatively slow speeds they are present in the channel for a proportionately longer time. I'm not sure what the proportion of fins to bilgers is but it may be fins, but this is of no relevance. Failure to keep watch is not to be recommended but ships pass the river above Shotley so infrequently that it is understandable that some people will be inattentive, though I wouldn't wish to excuse this. I don't think I have ever been hooted at, here or elsewhere.

 

[Daydream believer]

I don't think I have ever been hooted at, here or elsewhere.

If I knew where you were & the name of your boat, I would certainly love to give you a quick east coast toot, if you think that you are missing out

 

[johnalison]

If I knew where you were & the name of your boat, I would certainly love to give you a quick east coast toot, if you think that you are missing out

I may have to correct myself. I think there was an occasion on our first visit to Stralsund when we misunderstood the signals for the bridge and joined a couple of other boats going through, failing to noticed that there was a ship coming up from astern. My excuse is that we were a bit stressed as it was blowing about 30 knots on and off and the whole area was strange to us, and we knew we were racing the fleet for limited places at the marina. In the event a friendly German woman waved us into a vacant berth and all went well.

 

[Snowgoose-1]

Statistics are not your strong point either apparently. The great majority of boats on the Orwell are sailing and because of their relatively slow speeds they are present in the channel for a proportionately longer time. I'm not sure what the proportion of fins to bilgers is but it may be fins, but this is of no relevance. Failure to keep watch is not to be recommended but ships pass the river above Shotley so infrequently that it is understandable that some people will be inattentive, though I wouldn't wish to excuse this. I don't think I have ever been hooted at, here or elsewhere.

I admit that I have been tooted in the Orwell. I try to remember to tune in to channel vhf 68 now.

 

[Daydream believer]

''

 

[shanemax]

I may have to correct myself. I think there was an occasion on our first visit to Stralsund when we misunderstood the signals for the bridge and joined a couple of other boats going through, failing to noticed that there was a ship coming up from astern. My excuse is that we were a bit stressed as it was blowing about 30 knots on and off and the whole area was strange to us, and we knew we were racing the fleet for limited places at the marina. In the event a friendly German woman waved us into a vacant berth and all went well.

So you impeded the passage of a large vessel obviously constrained by its draught. naughty naughty

 

[shanemax]

If I knew where you were & the name of your boat, I would certainly love to give you a quick east coast toot, if you think that you are missing out

I moor on the Orwell, my favourite river is the Essex Stour, and I wander any where between the Thames estuary and the Ore. Thats enough for me.

 

[Daydream believer]

I moor on the Orwell, my favourite river is the Essex Stour, and I wander any where between the Thames estuary and the Ore. Thats enough for me.

Yes , sounds like you are a right "wanderer"

 

[PaulRainbow]

Yes , sounds like you are a right "wanderer"

That's not how you spell it

 

[johnalison]

So you impeded the passage of a large vessel obviously constrained by its draught. naughty naughty

No, but it was mildly embarrassing in retrospect. My excuse is that we were not alone as you can see.

 

[Egret]

Interesting how some good comment comes out of what starts as a total wind up - Getting back to the original topic, presumably Apguy the OP will be aware of the good information in the Harwich Harbour Visitor Guide, that vessel movements to Harwich Mistley and Ipswich and live cameras shown on 'Harwich Harbour Live' and live positions on 'Vesselfinder' - but watching, there are many small boats, particularly motor boats that either aren't aware of the harbour rules or choose to ignore them - and it is simple enough, Harwich VTS always seems very civilised calling miscreants but they probably don't have radio.

Looking forward now to Apguy publishing pictures of first sail.

 

[Sailing steve]

There is plenty of space in Harwich Harbour for everyone. Wivenhoe might be different but only for a few minutes as the fleet passes - Just need to read an approaching race fleet, anticipate where they will be going, especially if likely to turn at a mark - and aim for the gaps, there are plenty even in a tight fleet - and like chess, anticipate several moves ahead - behave as if you were in the same race on a different leg - catch eye of helmsmen if close - they will be looking - slight course change to clear racing boat, pass behind or on the downwind side to avoid making a wing shadow - or if you are really pedantic and have right of way, shout STARBOARD very loudly.

Maybe all cruising people who sail in areas where there is racing should ask at the club if they can spend some time with the race team, in the race box and on the rescue boat, or on a race boat, to understand racing in the area, and maybe make friends with the competitors you will see on the water. Might even like to take part in a regatta race - every boat type has a handicap so can join in.

I think there's a fair chance many cruising sailors will have raced in the past and may still do on occasions and if they have then they'll have some experience of that aspect of sailing.

Although I'm all for sailors cooperating the bottom line in tight situations regardless of whether they're comptively racing or just pottering along has to be that everybody understands the colregs and adheres to them. That way everybody can anticipate and plan knowing exactly what the other boat is obliged to do and when that happens nobody gets in a situation of collision or worse still somebody getting hurt.

On top of that of course they'll also swerve an awkward Monday morning phone call to their insurance company explaining the incoming claim against them occurred because they were doing another sailor a favour rather than following the rules.

 

[Egret]

Agree - to make intentions clear by movement and positioning in good time - of where intending to pass through the fleet - so that the people in the fleet are clear with what you are intending to do - crossing each part of the fleet in compliance with collision regulations - avoiding disrupting the racing where possible - and thinking ahead - whether they might tack and where I would need to be then.