Keels

[Don107]

Fair enough - for the few boats going that far. The vast majority of large yachts are delivered with keel attached, including trans Atlantic. Suspect that the volumes of Jeanneau going to Aus /NZ didn’t influence their designer hugely about keel design though

Hi Dunedin
It appears in the United States that also arrive without the keel and rudders fitted

Regards Don

 

[Lucky Duck]

I have three boats come on the back of a low loader and all of them had the keel and rudder firmly attached!

 

[Don107]

I have three boats come on the back of a low loader and all of them had the keel and rudder firmly attached!

Hi Little Grebe
Perhaps it depends on where in the world you are because when you google there is a lot of info on keel installation at time of commissioning
Here is a Hanse

Not saying that shipping is the only reason for bolt on keels but I think it would be a consideration by the manufacturers
Regards Don

 

[rogerthebodger]

If the boat is shipped by sea freight, the cost will be based on Gross Tons which in fact is a volumetric measurement. By removing the keel the GT will be reduced thus the shipping cost.

By road it does not matter too much its more the weight and wheel loading and the maximum height for bridge clearance.

The beam is mainly important from an escort amount, the route and time of day.

By air its always weight.

 

[[3889]]

He should have purchased an Island Packet - tried, tested, pretty much bullet proof.

Maybe he enjoys sailing too much to go down that route?

 

[Don107]

If the boat is shipped by sea freight, the cost will be based on Gross Tons which in fact is a volumetric measurement. By removing the keel the GT will be reduced thus the shipping cost.

By road it does not matter too much its more the weight and wheel loading and the maximum height for bridge clearance.

The beam is mainly important from an escort amount, the route and time of day.

By air its always weight.

Hi Rogershaw

Thanks for the information and It makes sense

Regards Don

 

[Frogmogman]

I guess for new boats it makes sense to ship them without the appendages attached, if the builder has a reliable agent to install them. To drop the keel and rudder(s) on a boat already in service would probably add more to the cost than would be saved on the shipping cost.

 

[pvb]

I guess for new boats it makes sense to ship them without the appendages attached, if the builder has a reliable agent to install them. To drop the keel and rudder(s) on a boat already in service would probably add more to the cost than would be saved on the shipping cost.

My new Bavaria in 2014 was transported by road from the factory to the UK with the keel firmly attached. Having seen how well it's bolted on, I'd certainly not have been happy if the jokers who called themselves "Bavaria dealers" had done the job!

 

[Frogmogman]

Maybe he enjoys sailing too much to go down that route?

Methinks the point that ip485 was trying to make is that it's just nonsense to say that there are no blue water cruising boats out there with encapsulated keels.

 

[pvb]

Methinks the point that ip485 was trying to make is that it's just nonsense to say that there are no blue water cruising boats out there with encapsulated keels.

A number of Hallberg-Rassy yachts from the 80s and 90s also had encapsulated keels. And they didn't have pink gelcoat!

 

[rogerthebodger]

This was my boat being transported from Cape Town to Johannesburg 1400 Km

Then Transported by road from Johannesburg to Durban 600Km

 

[rotrax]

Way too much alarmist hyperbole for my taste. You could just as easily argue that going to sea in any boat that isn't unsinkable is utter madness.

A properly engineered and maintained bolt-on keel is perfectly safe until it has a hard grounding, after which it will need inspecting.
There - edited that a little for you!

Writing from a position of superiority. Our last two boats have been long keelers with fully encapsulated keels.

Prepared to put up with the iffy going astern, big turning circle and slow handling for the structural integrity.

Our Kiwi boat has a deep fin with a bulb on the end. Welded to the steel hull. The bulb is really Kiwi - it is made from seven 9 Kilo gas cylinders welded together and filled with steel punchings set in pitch!

 

[rotrax]

A number of Hallberg-Rassy yachts from the 80s and 90s also had encapsulated keels. And they didn't have pink gelcoat!

Nor do Island Packets have pink gelcoat.

First Mate calls ours Custard Cream!

Interestingly enough, I am treating the failing powder coat on our Pilot House window frames. Wilko's Magnolia Gloss is an almost perfect match.

So there!

 

[dom]

It will be interesting to see how Kracken Yachts work out. Though it's not a business model I would invest in, Island Packet basically went out of business for lack of sailing capability and the Swedes right through to Hallberg-Rassy -- the crusiest of the bunch -- have gradually adopted more modern designs offering superior sailing capabilities.

Personally speaking, attacking competitors is fair enough, but it must be balanced by an innovative, attractive, and useful product, iPhones are a perfect example. With the Kracken, I just don't see it aside from out of date alarmist pub talk: "FFS the engine has to be encapsulated in the plane's fuselage, hang them on the wing and they will rip the wings off, Jeez!!" History wasn't kind to these pub experts.

Edit: nothing whatsoever against IP yachts, I often pass Rotrax's in the harbour and a fine vessel she is too. I'm guessing with a blow on the nose she punches through those waves like a dream, comfy in the wheelhouse and most likely aided by a big lump coupled to perhaps a four-blade fixed prop with low cavitation characteristics. My boat by comparison would be just as safe, but as wet as you like in those conditions. Times I'd love to swap and poss vice-versa ; nothing is perfect all of the time

 

[rotrax]

110 HP Yanmar turbo diesel with a three blade fixed 21X16 prop.

She is the best compromise we could find for our budget.

Sailing is secondary to our cruising. If the wind wont serve, up goes the iron jib.

She rolls a bit with swell on the quarter but her best attribute is comfort on the hook or alongside.

And with a 1.1 metre draught we can creep in lots of places others cant.

Agree entirely with your last sentence.

 

[rotrax]

Though it's not a business model I would invest in, Island Packet basically went out of business for lack of sailing capability.

Island Packet are listing 5 models. The new company is a consortium of established IP Dealers.

The same premises and some of the highly skilled workforce are building them.

IP never really got back on their feet after the 2008 financial crash.

The new 525 has been well recieved and is said to sail well for a luxuriously equiped cruiser that weighs 22,000 kilos.

They are built for trade wind sailing, 20kts on the beam.

One regular contributor to the iphomeport owners forum answered a question about tacking the cutter rig.

He said " What tacking - last time I sailed to Bermuda it was Port Tack there, Starboard tack home. "

Still a different design philosophy to European sailing boats and their quality and long life are appreciated assets.

Might be worth those interested googleing the new IP's.

I just did.