inventory!!

[steveeasy]

You are not making a mountain out of a molehill.
There are different contracts out there but you may find it says that items excluded from the inventory are to be noted on a/the schedule.
Anyway, an inventory is just that and is a formal part of the contract and not simply a description that leads up to a contract, as the sales particulars are. If it is specifically pictured (as opposed to being coincidentally in the background of a shot of something else) than it matters not whether it is described by words of photograph. You have made a contact for the boat and her inventory. If the inventory is deficient then it is to be remedied either by rectification or by a price adjustment to put you in the same position you bargained for. Simply paying the 'full' price and then having the stated inventory reduced unilaterally is not acceptable. Is the broker AYBA?

It was an image of a single item only. no other items exist within the image at all. I discussed it with the broker and he said not included. its the text that counts nothing to do with images. How would I know that, I get the feeling it was originally photographed to be included but then removed from the sale but without removing the image. unfortunately an error.I am sure just a little mistake. but I feel it is a loss to what I perceive was included but not significant in any way.
Steveeasy

 

[Poecheng]

..... the broker .... said not included. its the text that counts nothing to do with images.
Steveeasy

Total nonsense from the broker - how something is identified is not confined to text. I presume other items in the inventory were identified by photographs?
Such a claim would be instantly dismissed in small claims court - most likely laughed at. What was the purpose of the photograph if it wasn't to identify property in the vessel's inventory?
My letting agent does the property inventory by photographs now - best way.

 

[steveeasy]

Yes all other items identified by images.

Steveeasy

 

[Poecheng]

Yes they were.

Steveeasy

Slam dunk
Have PMd you

 

[ridgy]

In my experience the inventory is rarely correct because most boats come with an absolute pile of useless shite often including old sails and instruments.
I take the view that if I can see it when I view the boat it then its included but I will ask for a formal inventory before making an offer and tally that with what I have physically observed. I'm not talking about how many teaspoons either, more like what anchors and sails etc.
When viewing I would make a note of what is important to you and confirm those items.

 

[steveeasy]

In my experience the inventory is rarely correct because most boats come with an absolute pile of useless shite often including old sails and instruments.
I take the view that if I can see it when I view the boat it then its included but I will ask for a formal inventory before making an offer and tally that with what I have physically observed. I'm not talking about how many teaspoons either, more like what anchors and sails etc.
When viewing I would make a note of what is important to you and confirm those items.

Well id say what you view is not nessasarily included unless it is expressly listed in the inventory. how that is done is now being debated. a minor detail |I might add.
steveeasy

 

[NealB]

I agree nothing is black and white. but you are now saying other similar instruments are clearly stated in the inventory with images and the only reference to the chart plotter is in an image (but you imply there was another chart plotter included in the inventory). so it seems to me that you are "interpreting" what you say in your favour, taking the image as evidence even though the item was not listed. - As you have asked for an opinion about your thoughts, then no, I don't agree with your interpretation from what you have said. If I felt it was unclear whether it was included or not, I would simply have asked for clarification. I had exactly the same issue with my last boat sale. Even though both the broker and myself took great pains to provide a detailed inventory and removed anything that was not included, we still missed an item and the buyer picked it up. Simple conversation - is it or isn't it ? Sorry it was not on list, but yes, included. Problem solved.

As you say you have no intention of withdrawing, so why are you looking for the opinion of others who have even less information than you? Therefore mountain out of a molehill. The plotter is not crucial to your decision whether to proceed so forget about it and move on.

It was deeply unprofessional of the broker not to have made it explicitly clear with the offeree.

He (the broker) had, apparently, specifically discussed it with the seller.

I would be interested in knowing which broker this is: I would not want them selling anything on my behalf (openess, honesty and integrity are of vital importance to me), and I most certainly wouldn't want to use their services as a potential buyer.

 

[steveeasy]

It was deeply unprofessional of the broker not to have made it explicitly clear with the offeree.

He (the broker) had, apparently, specifically discussed it with the seller.

I would be interested in knowing which broker this is: I would not want them selling anything on my behalf (openess, honesty and integrity are of vital importance to me), and I most certainly wouldn't want to use their services as a potential buyer.

Yes but No. You are correct, he had discussed the matter before I raised it. There I go again, nothing is black or white. I think it may be just a clerical issue or lack of attention and most certainly no intent to mislead. everything else has been very amicable as indeed this matter will conclude.. Recently I was publicly accused of lacking total credibility by one of my demons.(not here I may add) it could not be further from the truth. it is the way of the world.
Steveeasy

 

[harvey38]

Is it a deal breaker or just principle?

If a deal breaker, walk away if not resolved to your liking. If principle, buy the boat and move on, life is waaaaay too short to waste time on small issues, sadly there is no such thing as a persons word/honour/bond any more.

 

[Praxinoscope]

The inventory list refers to GPS at chart table. It transpires thier is a small GPS unit at chart table. the only reference to Chartplotter is the image. clearly it should not be there. I believed it was as its shown clearly. Its about how you interprete what you see and how its set out. clearly there should be no image of it. its an accident but at my loss.

steveeasy

Thanks for clarification, from your descriptions and posts I think perhaps you are on a route to nowhere on this,if there is a small gps then that looks as if that is what’s included, the fact that that the chart plotter was in a photograph is on the edge of weather it was included or not, as it was not a fixed item I guess the seller can claim it was personal property and not included.
as the rest of the boat seems to meet your wishes then just grit your teeth and carry on and put it down to just another one of those irritations in life.

 

[steveeasy]

Is it a deal breaker or just principle?

If a deal breaker, walk away if not resolved to your liking. If principle, buy the boat and move on, life is waaaaay too short to waste time on small issues, sadly there is no such thing as a persons word/honour/bond any more.

Totally agree, life is way to short and Traona is correct in that its a very small matter. I do believe it was inaccurate and misleading though.
steveeasy

 

[steveeasy]

Thanks for clarification, from your descriptions and posts I think perhaps you are on a route to nowhere on this,if there is a small gps then that looks as if that is what’s included, the fact that that the chart plotter was in a photograph is on the edge of weather it was included or not, as it was not a fixed item I guess the seller can claim it was personal property and not included.
as the rest of the boat seems to meet your wishes then just grit your teeth and carry on and put it down to just another one of those irritations in life.

Yes but I understand that within the contract there is a specific section to list excluded items such as this.

 

[ithet]

As this inventory seems a bit subject to interpretation then you need to put in writing now what you expect as part of your offer and which is what you have paid a deposit on, i.e. "chartplotter xx as shown in photo on inventory page y" plus any other major equipment or anything else 'vebally' agreed.

 

[Praxinoscope]

Yes but I understand that within the contract there is a specific section to list excluded items such as this.

I have always used the RYA Sale of Yacht form which doesn’t have a specific section of excluded items, but the wording is perhaps a bit obscure on how one would treat the chart plotter in your situation

……’ including all equipment , machinery and gear on board (’The Yacht’) and any specific inventory atâches hereto installed by the parties and forming part of this agreement’…..

So very much a moot point, the chart plotter was in a photograph therefore it was perhaps reasonable for you to assume it was included, but it was not on the inventory so the seller can argue that it was not part of the agreement.

It’s a shame you haven’t got the chart plotter, but it is just a small part of the deal.

 

[steveeasy]

I have always used the RYA Sale of Yacht form which doesn’t have a specific section of excluded items, but the wording is perhaps a bit obscure on how one would treat the chart plotter in your situation

……’ including all equipment , machinery and gear on board (’The Yacht’) and any specific inventory atâches hereto installed by the parties and forming part of this agreement’…..

So very much a moot point, the chart plotter was in a photograph therefore it was perhaps reasonable for you to assume it was included, but it was not on the inventory so the seller can argue that it was not part of the agreement.

It’s a shame you haven’t got the chart plotter, but it is just a small part of the deal.

yep

 

[MisterBaxter]

Was there an image of the other GPS unit, the one that actually was included? If not, and you had an inventory stating 'GPS' illustrated with an image of the chart plotter, I think you have a very strong basis for kicking up a bit over this.

 

[steveeasy]

Was there an image of the other GPS unit, the one that actually was included? If not, and you had an inventory stating 'GPS' illustrated with an image of the chart plotter, I think you have a very strong basis for kicking up a bit over this.

Yes there was. Either way I’ll not be making a fuss. Just discuss it and move on.
Steveeasy

 

[harvey38]

I've got a mint condition 7" Raymarine Hybrid Touch for sale

 

[steveeasy]

I've got a mint condition 7" Raymarine Hybrid Touch for sale

Sounds wonderful could you pm the details please if it’s not gone yet.

 

[Tranona]

It was an image of a single item only. no other items exist within the image at all. I discussed it with the broker and he said not included. its the text that counts nothing to do with images. How would I know that, I get the feeling it was originally photographed to be included but then removed from the sale but without removing the image. unfortunately an error.I am sure just a little mistake. but I feel it is a loss to what I perceive was included but not significant in any way.
Steveeasy

"not significant in any way" - good description of a "mountain out of a molehill". We only have your side which is full of "feeling", interpretation", and the facts as you state them plus your acceptance that the inclusion of the photo was a mistake or clerical error on the part of the broker suggests you knew all along that it was not included, but hoped that it was.

BTW if this did ever come to court as some seem to suggest, pretty sure the court would tell you to go away and sort it out yourselves. Read the guidelines for the small claims track and you will see one of the things they look for is evidence that the 2 parties have taken steps to resolve the differences between them. Things like documented evidence of discussions and compromise, willingness to go to arbitration and so on.

I suggest you go back to your original question. You describe an issue with one small item worth a couple of hundred £s in a multi thousand £ deal . The broker says you signed for a written list but you want the photo to be evidence if its inclusion. I am with the broker - if it was included it would be on the list with its photo just like everything else. Nip it in the bud as they say - better to know about it now than find out when you complete and find it no longer on the chart table.