ICC - not so international

[bill bligh]

Try chartering a boat overseas.
I also said "as long as you have your original certificates from any recognised authority. "

 

[st599]

That is because it is the government department that has the authority and delegates to the RYA. However the ICC is a UN certificate and MCA has no say in it, unlike the RYA qualifications that might meet the ICC requirements. So what is it about a Canadian authorised ICC that needs MCA recognition?

It's a UN Economic Commission for Europe resolution. I think there's only South Africa outside of Europe that have signed up, definitely not Canada or the US.

 

[Sandy]

I also said "as long as you have your original certificates from any recognised authority. "

I can't see that working if you don't speak, in our case, English.

If somebody presented me with a French/Spanish/German/Dutch etc, etc, I'd be scratching my head wondering what the bit of paper was. At least with an ICC they are printed in many languages.

 

[dunedin]

It's a UN Economic Commission for Europe resolution. I think there's only South Africa outside of Europe that have signed up, definitely not Canada or the US.

Slightly bizarre how the OP has an ICC issued by a country that has not adopted the ICC! Might have been a bit of a warning flag doing a test in Croatia but being issued a certificate from a separate country thousands of miles away that has not adopted the ICC.
I can also see how the RYA might be a little sceptical about issuing a UK ICC in the circumstances. On our first Croatian charter we were told to bring two passport photos, and hand in to the flotilla office on arrival. After the welcome reception, we were all handed out pretty bits of paper in posh envelopes that were apparently our VHF and skippers competence certificates!
The only “test” apparently being able to supply a photo and find the right bar.

 

[st599]

Slightly bizarre how the OP has an ICC issued by a country that has not adopted the ICC! Might have been a bit of a warning flag doing a test in Croatia but being issued a certificate from a separate country thousands of miles away that has not adopted the ICC.
I can also see how the RYA might be a little sceptical about issuing a UK ICC in the circumstances. On our first Croatian charter we were told to bring two passport photos, and hand in to the flotilla office on arrival. After the welcome reception, we were all handed out pretty bits of paper in posh envelopes that were apparently our VHF and skippers competence certificates!
The only “test” apparently being able to supply a photo and find the right bar.

Shows the ICC signatories in blue.

 

[Buck Turgidson]

Not sure an ICC issued by annexed Crimea would be my choice!

 

[zoidberg]

Not sure an ICC issued by annexed Crimea would be my choice!

Cue for a good story in the bar.....

 

[Dellquay13]

I can't see that working if you don't speak, in our case, English.

If somebody presented me with a French/Spanish/German/Dutch etc, etc, I'd be scratching my head wondering what the bit of paper was. At least with an ICC they are printed in many languages.

My Coastal Skipper practical course certificate has different languages on the back, I can’t comment on the DS, I skipped that stage

 

[mjcoon]

... On our first Croatian charter we were told to bring two passport photos, and hand in to the flotilla office on arrival. After the welcome reception, we were all handed out pretty bits of paper in posh envelopes that were apparently our VHF and skippers competence certificates!
The only “test” apparently being able to supply a photo and find the right bar.

How long ago was that? When we first went it was called Yugoslavia, so I suppose it was not so long ago as that! But rules change fast...

 

[mjcoon]

Shows the ICC signatories in blue.

So is the ICC not annotated in, for instance, Italian or Greek?

 

[st599]

So is the ICC not annotated in, for instance, Italian or Greek?

Neither they, nor France, Spain or Portugal are signatories so don't issue them. They may accept them and the RYA may provide a translation, but I don't think they're obligated to accept them.

 

[dunedin]

How long ago was that? When we first went it was called Yugoslavia, so I suppose it was not so long ago as that! But rules change fast...

The “certificates” after welcome drinks in Croatia was our first time back after they rebuilt after the war, 2002 or so.
Had also sailed there twice in dinghies when was Yugoslavia, though was under 10 the first trip.

 

[ylop]

I am left wondering what your own motivations were to post that attack on another forum member, who's aim seems to have been to advise others who might be in the same position.

well I still don’t understand why he posted, if it was a “warning” to others or to be helpful mentioning IYT rather than “a provider in Canada” would have been helpful for anyone searching in the future; whilst the cost differential would probably be really useful info for anyone thinking of getting an ICC in the first place, but despite obviously knowing that he’s still not told us how much more expensive it was (or if he went to IYT first and then thought he’d found a cheap way to get round them).

was my post an attack that puts people off posting? I hope not - unless those people are going to make half-the-facts posts which seem to be requests for help but are not interested in the replies, because those people are just trolls wasting everyone else’s time.

 

[ylop]

Why is the ICC only valid for five years? I did my Day skipper 25 years ago and it's valid for life, same with my VHF Licence. It's just a moneymaking exercise in my opinion.

It’s an international agreement between countries. The real question to me is why is it renewable without either proof of continuing competency or at least some sort of declaration you have actually sailed in that time - as the basis for trusting someone with a boat “I did a course 25 yrs ago” is not great!

however I think the official position is it let’s them improve/revise the certificates with holograms etc to avoid fraud and possibly amend the wording if things aren’t clear. i suppose it also helps keep the photo reasonably up-to-date too?

 

[mjcoon]

It’s an international agreement between countries. The real question to me is why is it renewable without either proof of continuing competency or at least some sort of declaration you have actually sailed in that time - as the basis for trusting someone with a boat “I did a course 25 yrs ago” is not great!

however I think the official position is it let’s them improve/revise the certificates with holograms etc to avoid fraud and possibly amend the wording if things aren’t clear. i suppose it also helps keep the photo reasonably up-to-date too?

It may be like renewing your old person's driving licence every few years. You don't have to take a fresh test, but it does force you to consider if you are still competent. And in effect to declare "yes, I am"!

 

[E39mad]

well I still don’t understand why he posted, if it was a “warning” to others or to be helpful mentioning IYT rather than “a provider in Canada” would have been helpful for anyone searching in the future; whilst the cost differential would probably be really useful info for anyone thinking of getting an ICC in the first place, but despite obviously knowing that he’s still not told us how much more expensive it was (or if he went to IYT first and then thought he’d found a cheap way to get round them).

was my post an attack that puts people off posting? I hope not - unless those people are going to make half-the-facts posts which seem to be requests for help but are not interested in the replies, because those people are just trolls wasting everyone else’s time.

Well I thought it was quite clear that this post was a heads up for those whose ICC was not issued by the RYA despite what they may inform you. Having been on here for over a decade I didn't realise that I had to write in a certain way with certain information to keep people happy nor have I have ever been called a troll. I hope that my posts over the last 10 or so years are helpful as that is the intention.

Thank you to @Black Sheep who summarised my points perfectly.

Anyway I'm giving this place a rest for a while as clearly I'm not up to the job of posting articulately enough on here!!

 

[bill bligh]

I can't see that working if you don't speak, in our case, English.

If somebody presented me with a French/Spanish/German/Dutch etc, etc, I'd be scratching my head wondering what the bit of paper was. At least with an ICC they are printed in many languages.
[/QUOTE
I will agree with you if chartering abroad. How about if you are in your own boat on a world tour.

 

[Buck Turgidson]

Then it's flagged and you need to comply with the requirements of the flagged Nation. If it's UK then requirements are nil.

 

[Seven Spades]

It seems to me that the RYA can't issue an ICC because you are not qualified to recieve one. You just need to do the Day Skipper practical course.

 

[st599]

It seems to me that the RYA can't issue an ICC because you are not qualified to recieve one. You just need to do the Day Skipper practical course.

There are also residency requirements.