KevinV
Well-Known Member
And you should be rightfully proud that my pathetic gutter humour is so far beneath you that you don't even notice it.
Interesting about the Sadlers though ?
How much of an operation is it to get the mast up and down on the average 20 foot or so sailing boat?
- Thread starter NingNong247
- Start date
Interesting about the Sadlers though ?
Praxinoscope
Well-Known Member
Sorry but sometimes I miss the punchline.
PaulRainbow
Well-Known Member
Praxinoscope
Well-Known Member
Good job it doesn't have four
If it did you could rub it and it would double in size!
William_H
Well-Known Member
Re Refueller and others. Hello Nigel. My little boat 21ft has a blade mast base. However it is of ali welded to mast itself as a lug under the track. No castings here. This means that as has happened if the mast swings sideways it just bends the lugs a bit further apart. Another trick is I use a 1/4 bolt ina 3/8 hole. So lots of free play. So mast can swing perhaps 15 degrees sideways with no mast base problem. Still the problem of weight to side heeling the boat so yes a bit terrifying. However I still persevere with a man on cabin top to guide mast. My sailing seems to have deteriorated to just local but we used to traverse bridges quite happily for a day out or a few days.
The idea of additional side stays would be an excellent idea. I believe the much maligned Macgregor 26 has these fitted. Just up to the spreader base would be fine and would not impede normal sailing if left permanently fitted. Especially desirable on fractional rig with aft mounted chain plates.
Many mast head rig boats around here have the cap shrouds (square to mast) in the form of a SS tube from chain plate up to level with mast pivot. Turnscrew then cap shroud. The tube is braced froward by a line so it remains standing up as mast goes down.
To that poster proposing poles to a car running up the mainsail track,. yes this is sometimes seen here. However a bit expensive for all the gear. Supposedly you can raise the mast by hauling the car down the track. I think as you said an A frame and tackle would be far easier. (safer)
When you have a furler. Things get more difficult as it is hard to use forestay for attachment of tackle. Easiest solution is to use a spinnaker halyard or spare jib halyard to haul mast up. Needs to be well cleated and strong. Other options is to tie a rope around the furler and sail and pull on that rope. Needs a good amny wraps around and good knot.
It can be difficult to get the forestay pin in to bow fitting once it is up especially if you are motoring. One trick I made for a friend is a longer rod with a spike point on the end to use in lieu of clevis pin. Point makes it easy to align holes. Needs a hole drilled through spike to take a split pin or similar.
I use 2 spinnaker poles for A frame and have to lugs fitted to side decks to take pole fittings. The tackle I use has a big ring in series into which the pole fittings go. I also have a high field lever to tension the forestay. Means that when rigging after launch. Raising the mast is just a small part of overall rigging chores.
Incidentally I use a very high single pole crutch at the stern so in the case of bridges on Swan River I can lower the mast with boom and mainsail still connected. For mast removal I have a lower crutch support point that I can lift the mast down to. Yes I do have to stay the crutch support sideways. It sits on the top of the rudder pin and is clamped to the stern rail.
Pracice makes it all easier especially if you have all the gear. To see a 70ft mast lowered for bridges is a sight and yes nerve wracking for crew but often done. ol'will
The idea of additional side stays would be an excellent idea. I believe the much maligned Macgregor 26 has these fitted. Just up to the spreader base would be fine and would not impede normal sailing if left permanently fitted. Especially desirable on fractional rig with aft mounted chain plates.
Many mast head rig boats around here have the cap shrouds (square to mast) in the form of a SS tube from chain plate up to level with mast pivot. Turnscrew then cap shroud. The tube is braced froward by a line so it remains standing up as mast goes down.
To that poster proposing poles to a car running up the mainsail track,. yes this is sometimes seen here. However a bit expensive for all the gear. Supposedly you can raise the mast by hauling the car down the track. I think as you said an A frame and tackle would be far easier. (safer)
When you have a furler. Things get more difficult as it is hard to use forestay for attachment of tackle. Easiest solution is to use a spinnaker halyard or spare jib halyard to haul mast up. Needs to be well cleated and strong. Other options is to tie a rope around the furler and sail and pull on that rope. Needs a good amny wraps around and good knot.
It can be difficult to get the forestay pin in to bow fitting once it is up especially if you are motoring. One trick I made for a friend is a longer rod with a spike point on the end to use in lieu of clevis pin. Point makes it easy to align holes. Needs a hole drilled through spike to take a split pin or similar.
I use 2 spinnaker poles for A frame and have to lugs fitted to side decks to take pole fittings. The tackle I use has a big ring in series into which the pole fittings go. I also have a high field lever to tension the forestay. Means that when rigging after launch. Raising the mast is just a small part of overall rigging chores.
Incidentally I use a very high single pole crutch at the stern so in the case of bridges on Swan River I can lower the mast with boom and mainsail still connected. For mast removal I have a lower crutch support point that I can lift the mast down to. Yes I do have to stay the crutch support sideways. It sits on the top of the rudder pin and is clamped to the stern rail.
Pracice makes it all easier especially if you have all the gear. To see a 70ft mast lowered for bridges is a sight and yes nerve wracking for crew but often done. ol'will
Grith
Well-Known Member
There are many simple ways to deal with mast raising on trailer sailers. For years I have noted people stating it’s the reason they gave up on trailer sailers or dislike them.
Growing up in Perth Western Australia ( home of those bloody Aussie’s who pinched the America’s Cup
) many even very large yachts had to develop on water mast raising and lowering equipment due needing to get under the bridges at Fremantle to go from the Swan River out to WA’s favourite holiday island Rottnest.
The Fremantle bridges also sat in a very high traffic zone with many ignorant/uncaring powerboaters blasting by yachts involved in the delicate process of lowering their masts to get under the bridges. The processes therefore had to be robust enough to withstand this buffeting.
A frames made from two spinnaker poles and led through a bow block back to a sheet winch combined with modifying one set of side stays to have a braced solid bottom section to line up with the mast base therefore keeping side stay tension on solved this problem.
My own current trailerable cruising yacht and many other Polish yachts come with a superb manufacturer fitted system which stays unobtrusively fitted when sailing and makes the whole process a one man operation.
Growing up in Perth Western Australia ( home of those bloody Aussie’s who pinched the America’s Cup
) many even very large yachts had to develop on water mast raising and lowering equipment due needing to get under the bridges at Fremantle to go from the Swan River out to WA’s favourite holiday island Rottnest.The Fremantle bridges also sat in a very high traffic zone with many ignorant/uncaring powerboaters blasting by yachts involved in the delicate process of lowering their masts to get under the bridges. The processes therefore had to be robust enough to withstand this buffeting.
A frames made from two spinnaker poles and led through a bow block back to a sheet winch combined with modifying one set of side stays to have a braced solid bottom section to line up with the mast base therefore keeping side stay tension on solved this problem.
My own current trailerable cruising yacht and many other Polish yachts come with a superb manufacturer fitted system which stays unobtrusively fitted when sailing and makes the whole process a one man operation.
Grith
Well-Known Member
Hi William H
Just noticed you are obviously from WA.
I was until about 22 years ago and sailed there for 30 years commencing in the later 1960’s and through probably the heyday of trailer sailers.
I also crewed briefly on some of the big name WA yachts as a foredeck hand.
I wonder if we ran into each other or have mutual friends/contacts?
I sailed out of Nedlands, South of Perth, Royal Freshwater Bay and occasionally Royal Perth and Royal Flying Squadron.
We obviously had some of the same multiple Rottnest crossing Freo bridges experiences!
Refueler
Well-Known Member
There is a Yacht Chandler who has a telescopic V system for mast work ... can even lift keel stepped .... BUT it must lift vertically and then mast rotated to horizontal.
Not exactly suited to my needs .... but interesting.
I can leave boom / main / furled genny in place if only lowering part way for bridges .... but TBH - I don't like it and usually disconnect boom gooseneck to be safe.
Not exactly suited to my needs .... but interesting.
I can leave boom / main / furled genny in place if only lowering part way for bridges .... but TBH - I don't like it and usually disconnect boom gooseneck to be safe.
Praxinoscope
Well-Known Member
I have a similar unit, purchased about 15 years ago, it consists of a set of aluminium poles that can be set together using drop pins, a block and tackle at the apex.
Maximum SWL is 120kg so 10-11m masts probably at top end of its usefulness, have used it single handed both to drop and raise the mast on my previous boat (Invicta26), but on present boat have only used it with assistance as the furling gear needs to be protected.
Getting the ‘A’ frame into position is fairly easy when dropping the mast, but it’s a bit more awkward when setting it up to raise.
The useful part is that when disassembled it all fits into a small family car (Fiesta) and mast can be raised and lowered without the expense of a crane.
ylop
Well-Known Member
I mostly agree with you - and I think it's even worse when you see it is live AND work aboard. However there's a guy seakayaking round scotland for a year (see @lifeafloat on twitter) living in a tiny expedition tent he has to pitch every night, and cooking with camping stuff etc. It *should* be possible to make a 20'er more pleasant than that - but he's doing that as a journey (mentally and physically) rather than as his home. If NingNong247 was suggesting getting a Wayfarer or Drascombe and travelling round the UK on it I'd probably see it as a more credible plan. If I was going to live aboard in one location most of the time I'd go to the canals, and its hard to find a boat better suited to canal life than a canal boat. You won't get one for £1-2K.
Chiara’s slave
Well-Known Member
The thought of living on our 30 ft boat horrifies me. And we have loads of storage for all our junk
This is the real flaw in the plan rather than mast raising, IMHO
Refueler
Well-Known Member
10 day cruise on my 25ftr was about the limit for me ...
4 days on Bav Match 35 was definitely over the limit for me !!
4 days on Bav Match 35 was definitely over the limit for me !!
Chiara’s slave
Well-Known Member
We used to do 2 weeks on a Dragonfly 800 with 2 young kids, for the summer hols. But we were young and foolish. The worst time was when they got nits in Lyme regis. Combing the nits out of your kids hair in a pocket cruiser, I don't recommend it!
Praxinoscope
Well-Known Member
The last long cruise I did was 6 weeks on on my Invicta 26, just two on board, longest passage 11days from the Villanova marina (Ria de Arouca) to Milford Haven. but I was 11 years younger (only 65) back in 2011, now Aberaeron to Arklow is usually my longest passage in my current boat (Sadler 25).
Refueler
Well-Known Member
Blimey - my Snap 23 ..... an Admirals Cup guy and his dad with me for a whole week round Solent .... really great time .... but TBH - not now as I'm much older !!
ylop
Well-Known Member
I think it depends what you are used to. If you have 4 bedroom detached with double garage then living aboard even a 40'er is likely to feel bijoux. If you've been two people in a studio apartment and one of you moves onto a 30'er it might not feel so bad. If you are used to living in a campervan or caravan for prolonged periods it might be tolerable on a 25'er - but you need to make sure you've really understood the headroom issues, the ability to walk about, the amount of daylight, etc as even if the footprint is similar I don't think the experience is. I think you also need to accept that you are going to be single - finding a partner who will tolerate it is going to be incredibly hard.The thought of living on our 30 ft boat horrifies me. And we have loads of storage for all our junk
Jim@sea
Well-Known Member
I bought a 21ft Trailer Sailer which had a method of raising and lowering the mast. When we lowered it last time a mistake was made and the mast fell backwards and snapped when it hit an upright support at the stern.
A new mast cost over £4000. Fortunately we were insured with a very low excess.
Chiara’s slave
Well-Known Member
Ha ha, with the 2 of us rattling around in a 6 bed Victorian house with 10 ft high ceilings, I daresay that is the reason. The boat is fine for a few weeks, especially as we have both a covered cockpit and by most standards, acres of deck space.
Praxinoscope
Well-Known Member
Our arrival at La Caruna on my Invicta 26, after 10 day sail from Kinsale, compétant crew in picture looking forward to a glass or two of wine in the town.
Both of us over pension age.
Both of us over pension age.